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Do you prefer a mega church or a tiny parish?

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  • #76
    [QUOTE=Bob Carabbio;n4419663]
    Originally posted by JC33 View Post

    I don't have a REAL preference.

    LARGE Churches have "Smaller groups" that you can connect with, and "Tiny Parishes" typically struggle to stay in existence.


    Been doing it that way for 53 years now. Been some surprises along the way. But as "Free-range Non-denominational Charismatic eclectics, the labels on the building don't mean a lot, and we just go where we're supposed to.

    One HUGE THING about large congregations is the Ability to support Missionary activities. The Church I attend now is around 1000, and supports 120 missionaries all over the world.

    The last church I was part of was 50-100, and barely was able to keep the doors open.

    Bob Carabbio :

    - - - A question for you, Bob : Do you think that it is ever God's will for someone to attend and support a church where false doctrine is taught, and sinful associations with those who teach false doctrine are tolerated ? I am saying that because the type of church you alluded to is tolerating false doctrine in my opinion. You probably won't agree with my assessment, but I am just tossing that out for your consideration.

    - - - God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind. You may think that God winks and says "boys will be boys", but scripture seems to say otherwise. Your words "
    we just go where we're supposed to" is empty rhetoric if you think that God doesn't consider what you are doing. You may even hear about lots of people who genuinely get saved in such churches, but that doesn't change what God thinks; the final authority is still the Bible.

    Comment


    • #77
      [QUOTE=JC33;n1961]I have attended both.... Here's my opinion...

      Small Church positives-

      A.) You meet very nice people.

      B.) The Minister can usually make time for you right away if need be.

      C.) Parking is not a issue.

      Small Church negatives-

      A.) Because it's a small parish, they expect you to volunteer ALL the time. And if you volunteer elsewhere instead, they sort of put a guilt trip on you for abandoning their parish.

      B.) You will have to deal with a bunch of what I like to call 'little Popes' telling you how to run your life, whether you want their "advice" or not, you wil get it.
      Can only speak for myself and my own experiences:
      I agree, I have met some very nice people, and the minister has had time to deal with me and my questions far more than I have found in larger or mega churches. That said, parking was never an issue, and frankly, I have never experienced either of your so called 'negatives'. In fact, we rarley had any problems until the larger churches started interfering.


      For those who believe, no explanation is necessary. For those who don't, no explanation will suffice. Unknowm Author

      "That's Nice" Agnes Brown

      “It’s the Holy Spirit’s job to convict, God’s job to judge, and it’s my job to love.”

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      • #78
        Originally posted by chtek View Post
        A question for you, Bob : Do you think that it is ever God's will for someone to attend and support a church where false doctrine is taught,
        Step by step, then -

        Depends on the "FALSE DOCTRINE" since every church teaches "False Doctrine" to some degree. Just because YOU consider a doctrine to be "False" doesn't mean that it is. That's just "Church/Theology reality 101".

        Teaching that you have to strip naked and run down the street screaming "Wubba!!!!, Wubba!!!" to be saved would be a serious (but interesting) issue.

        Teaching "Calvinism", or "Arminianism", or "Baptismal regeneration", or "The Initial evidence" as "Church doctrines" - not so much, since they're nothing but Peripheral theological issues. ALL God's chilluns gots "theologies".

        and sinful associations with those who teach false doctrine are tolerated ?
        You'll have to be more specific about what sort of "Sinful Associations" you allude to in order to evaluate your question. The pastor having SEX with female congregants seeking counseling is one thing. Playing Euchre with a congregant, and his family is quite something else.

        I am saying that because the type of church you alluded to is tolerating false doctrine in my opinion.
        I"m ASSUMING that being Pentecostal/Charismatic would be your issue, A Forget whether you're "Reformed" or not, which might be another issue if you are. Naturally I wouldn't see ANY of that as "False Doctrine" in a GENERAL sense, although there are DETAILS within the Full-Gospel genre that I reject as being false. If you want to believe that all "Full Gospel" Folks are FALSE, that's YOUR problem, not mine.

        God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind.
        Depends on what you're definition of EVIL is. Eating Pork is EVIL to some denominations, as is the wearing of makeup, or slacks on Women.

        Your words "we just go where we're supposed to" is empty rhetoric if you think that God doesn't consider what you are doing.
        Except that it's GOD who guides our steps (HE promised to, and He does), and when HE tells us we're HOME, then we're HOME until he tells us otherwise. SO Consequently if GOD leads us into a church situation that HE WANTS US IN, then it's OUR job to find out what Ministry is our responsibility to GIVE in that place. Christians are MINISTERS to whatever situation they find themselves in. Unless, of course, they're Immature, Scriptually Ignorant, and need to be TAUGHT before they can teach others.

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        • #79
          What did JESUS SAY about the widow and WHERE SHE WENT ?
          (didn't she go to the place where the leaders were or later did organize to have JESUS CRUCIFIED ? )

          ===========================================
          " Do you think that it is ever God's will for someone to attend and support a church where false doctrine is taught, and sinful associations with those who teach false doctrine are tolerated ?"
          ===========================================

          ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
          "Do you prefer a mega church or a tiny parish?"
          ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

          Does YHWH give someone a choice ?

          When someone decides to join the U.S.Army, do they go to a Spanish Consulate ? Or to a Walmart ? Or a Bowling Alley ?

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by chtek
            God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind. You may think that God winks and says "boys will be boys", but scripture seems to say otherwise. Your words "we just go where we're supposed to" is empty rhetoric if you think that God doesn't consider what you are doing. You may even hear about lots of people who genuinely get saved in such churches, but that doesn't change what God thinks; the final authority is still the Bible.
            What do you do with the facts of scripture, chtek? Every single church written to in the NT had doctrinal problems. The epistles were writen specifically to correct errant thought, doctrine, and practice. The seven churches of Revelation each have problems, most of them quite serious and manifestations of bad teaching. Furthermore, new converts are neither mature or perfect so the idea "God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind" would mean new believers could not attend church! Again I appeal to the precedents set in scripture: the congregations in Corinth, Ephesus, Galatia and Rome were messy, and persistently so.

            You say "the final authority is still the Bible" (and both Bob and I agree), so perhaps you can cite us a specific example in the Bible where the perfect congregation teaching the perfect set of doctrines perfectly intolerant of evil of any kind actually existed in the NT era.
            All verses cited or quoted or in the NAS unless otherwise noted.

            “if anyone competes as an athlete, he does not win the prize unless he competes according to the rules.” (2 Tim. 2:5)

            Comment


            • #81
              Originally posted by Josheb View Post
              What do you do with the facts of scripture, chtek? Every single church written to in the NT had doctrinal problems. The epistles were writen specifically to correct errant thought, doctrine, and practice. The seven churches of Revelation each have problems, most of them quite serious and manifestations of bad teaching. Furthermore, new converts are neither mature or perfect so the idea "God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind" would mean new believers could not attend church! Again I appeal to the precedents set in scripture: the congregations in Corinth, Ephesus, Galatia and Rome were messy, and persistently so.

              You say "the final authority is still the Bible" (and both Bob and I agree), so perhaps you can cite us a specific example in the Bible where the perfect congregation teaching the perfect set of doctrines perfectly intolerant of evil of any kind actually existed in the NT era.



              - - - Yes Josheb, I am aware that most of the early churches had doctrinal problems, but you must realize that this was very early in the Christian era which was why Paul had to correct them. If they afterward chose to ignore Paul then, it was their own deliberate choice to rebel against the great apostle and ultimately against God.

              - - - As for the seven churches of Asia minor, God commented on them as you are aware. If a believer has a choice, there is no justification for attending and supporting such a church; God calls us to separate ourselves from known doctrinal errors and wicked associations - (Romans 16:17). If there is no sound church within reasonable distance, then I would suggest that Christians should start a small church in their own area. The early Christians often assembled in their own houses.

              - - - I said what I said to Bob because I believe that he associates himself with charismatic groups that most orthodox Bible believers have disputed for many years. I realize that he would not agree with me on this, but just wanted to make him aware of how I and many others see it.

              - - - I believe that God holds Christians responsible for their associations and where they put their time and money. There is no perfect church anywhere on this planet because they are composed of imperfect people, but that is no excuse for tolerating unscriptural doctrines. God calls us to separate from it and to have no fellowship with it.

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by chtek
                - - - Yes Josheb, I am aware that most of the early churches had doctrinal problems, but you must realize that this was very early in the Christian era...
                Oh, I see. So a young, immature congregation might be permitted a certain degree of error, is that it?

                Originally posted by chtek
                - - - As for the seven churches of Asia minor, God commented on them as you are aware. If a believer has a choice, there is no justification for attending and supporting such a church...
                That's not the salient point. You plainly stated, "God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind". That would mean the congregants of the NT-era churches were not lead there by God. Clearly there were some Christians attending those congregations.
                Originally posted by chtek
                - - - I said what I said to Bob because I believe that he associates himself with charismatic groups that most orthodox Bible believers have disputed for many years. I realize that he would not agree with me on this, but just wanted to make him aware of how I and many others see it.
                Bob's personal practices are not the topic of this op, and I'm fairly confident God didn't appoint you arbiter of Bob's faith walk. Similarly, the inquiry of this op is not in any way specific to any sectarian views, especially not those of "charismatic groups that most orthodox Bible believers have disputed for many years." Besides, I think Bob is Baptist with reformed sensibilities (Bob, do please feel free to correct me if I have that incorrectly). If that's correct then an apology is in order.
                Originally posted by chtek
                There is no perfect church anywhere on this planet because they are composed of imperfect people, but that is no excuse for tolerating unscriptural doctrines.
                That statement is self-contradictory, and as such evidence of... unscriptural doctrine! You cannot have it both ways. Neither can it be argued, "God does not lead people to attend a church that tolerates evil of any kind," and also say there is no perfect church.


                You said, "the final authority is still the Bible," but here you've offered nothing but personal opinion; personal opinion that conflicts with plainly stated and plainly read scripture found plainly in the Bible. So I will ask you again:


                Would you please provide a specific example in the Bible where the perfect congregation teaching the perfect set of doctrines perfectly intolerant of evil of any kind actually existed in the NT era?

                Thank you.

                Or maybe you should just adjust your thinking, doctrine, and practice to more accurately reflect God's word and acknowledge there are specific limitations to both Christian conduct and the correction and tolerance thereof and those specifics should not be over-generalized to force universal legalisms upon the body of Christ... and then post accordingly.
                All verses cited or quoted or in the NAS unless otherwise noted.

                “if anyone competes as an athlete, he does not win the prize unless he competes according to the rules.” (2 Tim. 2:5)

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