Psalm 33:6 and Cosmogony versus Trinity
by, 11-20-12 at 05:45 PM (4777 Views)
[QUOTE=Messenger;3654024][QUOTE=oldshepherd;3650147][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Georgia][SIZE=2]You quoted part of a source, out-of-context! I most certainly do know and understand the transcendence and immanence of God. All you are doing is repeating the same childish accusation over and over without clarifying what you mean.
What I post is available to anyone willing to look for it. Both major lexicons Hebrew, BDB, and Greek, BAGD, are available free online to read or download. I provide the definitions from lexicons when people who don’t know what they are talking about try to tell me, “[I]What the Bible really says.[/I]”
I agree with this what is your point?
I got it. A source like Unger’s or the Jewish Encyclopedia is correct when you can quote something out-of-context and make it appear to support your argument but when the source in-context proves you wrong then it is “[I]commentary.[/I]” Scholars don’t make up definitions to suit their presuppositions. The meaning/definitions of words are determined by how the original, native speakers used them in ancient writings. Scholars cannot get away with deliberately misinterpreting words because that would be exposed by other scholars and their credibility would be ruined. Can you provide any credible, verifiable scholarly evidence that any part of the Jewish Encyclopedia article I quoted or Unger’s is corrupt, biased or “[I]commentary[/I]?” Or is that just your corrupt, biased or commentary opinion.
I have not said anything like this. I don’t know what you are talking about.
Without credible language sources such as Lexicons and Concordances neither one of us would have any idea what the Greek and Hebrew of the Bible means. It appears that you want to reject any real scholarship and make up your own meaning to words.
I got it! God’s “[I]name is in[/I]” means one thing when it supports your assumptions/presuppositions but it means something different when it proves you wrong.
I am denying nothing. You are misinterpreting scripture! In Exodus 3 the angel never spoke! You read the Exodus account, the angel appeared [B][I]in the fire out of the bush[/I][/B], God spoke to Moses [B][I]from within the bush.[/I][/B] Neither the Exodus nor the Acts account ever says the angel spoke. Both say Moses heard the voice of God.[INDENT][B]Exo 3:2-4
(2)[/B] And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him [B][I]in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush[/I][/B]: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
[B](3)[/B] And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.
[B](4)[/B] And when the LORD saw that he turned aside to see, [B][I]God called unto him out of the midst of the bush[/I][/B], and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.[/INDENT]
Luke writing in Acts dos not say that the angel was “[I]the pre incarnate Logo![/I][INDENT][B]Act 7:35[/B] This Moses whom they refused, saying, Who made thee a ruler and a judge? the same did God send to be a ruler and a deliverer by the hand of the angel which appeared to him in the bush.[/INDENT]
In one sentence you say the name [FONT=times new roman][SIZE=3] יהושׁוּע[/SIZE][/FONT]/Yehoshua means “[I]Yahweh saves[/I]” and in another sentence you say it mea “[I]Jehovah saves.[/I]” Except for the meaning of Yehoshua which means “[I]Yah[weh] is salvation.[/I]” I agree with what you have said.
While Jesus lived as a man he was subject to the father and during his earthly incarnation the Father [I]hath he given to the Son to have life in himself.[/I]” Before that Jesus [B][I]existed in[/I][/B], not temporarily had, the form of God and was [B][I]equal with God.[/I][/B]
By default you don’t know what you are talking about. I have never said any of this garbage![/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR][/QUOTE]
In the previous post you disagreed to the proofs I gave stating 'Yehoshua' means 'Yahweh Saved' and now you seem to show you agree.
You quoted from Jewish encyclo showing what I was saying is incorrect but I showed from your own source and from Ungers the meaning of the name 'Yahweh'
This name is God's chosen name for himself and this name is attributed to 'Yehoshua' which shows this is his immanent name. The name reveals that he is present for his people saving them, helping them, delivering them.
The main Hebrew word is "hawah" meaning "to be/ become". God is the "Self Becoming One".
You can't deny this. This is clearly mentioned in the source you quoted from (Jewish encyclo) and I highlighted in red and bold the portions which say this from your own source.
God is not one who is a far away, transcendent who started the universe, wound it up, let it go, and then walked away from it letting it run on it's own. Rather, He is immanent who is always close and near to it to help guide, comfort, and teach us about Himself and His ways.
I will give you a few examples to show you that the name Yahweh is attributed to Christ
Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, [B]that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch[/B], and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: [B]and this is his name whereby he shall be called[/B], THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.(Y@hovah tsidqenuw)
Who is this righteous Branch who will reign and prosper, who will execute judgment and justice in the earth, in whose days Judah will be saved, Israel shall dwell safely? His name shall be called Y@hovah tsidqenuw and this name is attributed to Jesus Christ who is the Lord our Righteousness.
2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that [B]we might be made the righteousness of God in him.[/B]
Jg 6:24 Then Gideon built an altar there unto the LORD, and called it [B]Jehovahshalom[/B]:(Y@havah shalowm) unto this day it is yet in Ophrah of the Abiezrites.
Eph 2:14 ¶ [B]For he (Jesus) is our peace[/B], who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, [B]The Prince of Peace.
[/B]Php 4:7 [B]And the peace of God,[/B] which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds [B]through Christ Jesus[/B].
Ex 17:15 And Moses built an altar, and called the name of it [B]Jehovahnissi:
Joh 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.[B] 32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all unto me.
[/B]Ps 60:4 [B]Thou hast given a banner to them that fear thee[/B], that it may be displayed because of the truth. Selah.
5[B] That thy beloved may be delivered;[/B] save with thy right hand, and hear me.
Eze 48:35 It was round about eighteen thousand measures: [B]and the name of the city [/B]from that day shall be, [B]The LORD is there (Y@hovah shammah)
[/B]Ezekiel saw a vision of the New Jerusalem and the Lord is there with his people
Mt 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they [B]shall call his name Emmanuel[/B], which being interpreted is, [B]God with us.
[/B]Mt 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, [B]I (Jesus) am with you alway,[/B] even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Heb 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, [B]I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.[/B]
Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the [B]LORD of hosts[/B];(Y@hovah tsaba) I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
Re 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
14 [B]And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses,[/B] clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, [B]when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
[/B]Jude 1:14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, [B]Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
[/B] Jos 5:14 And he said, Nay;[B] but as captain of the host of the LORD am I now come.[/B] And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant?
Jos 5:15 [B]And the captain of the LORD'S host said unto Joshua, Loose thy shoe from off thy foot[/B]; [B]for the place whereon thou standest is holy. [/B]And Joshua did so.
I can give you many more examples to show you God's immanent name Yahweh which means ' to become', 'to blow', 'to exist as' because this name is attributed to Christ who is our immanent God.
This name of God shows his 'immanence'. From ' I AM'(transcendence) to 'Yahweh' (immanence) and personal to us/face to face with creation through 'Yehoshua' (Christ).
Accept this truth or leave it, it's upto you.