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Does God Ordain some sin ?

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  • Originally posted by antiomno View Post

    How is that different from believing in Jesus Christ, repenting of our sins, and keeping his commandments?
    I didn't say it was different.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Serve the Lord's God View Post

      I didn't say it was different.
      So what did you say?
      "And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach ..." (2 Ne. 25:26)
      "Yea, cry unto him for mercy, for he is mighty to save." (Alma 34:18)

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      • Originally posted by antiomno View Post

        So what did you say?
        It's still there.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Serve the Lord's God View Post

          It's still there.
          So does the will of man override the will of God, or does it not? Is man free to choose good and evil for himself, and be rewarded or punished accordingly, or is he not?
          "And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach ..." (2 Ne. 25:26)
          "Yea, cry unto him for mercy, for he is mighty to save." (Alma 34:18)

          Comment


          • Originally posted by antiomno View Post

            Not sure where you get your theology from, but you are making it a lot more complicated than it is. The will of God, according to the Bible, is that we believe in his Son, Jesus Christ, repent of our sins, and keep his commandments. How hard is that to understand?
            Not hard to understand at all if God has come to you and opened up all of His haven to you instead speculating about it. where you have His same Spirit, have His same mind, walk as He walks in His same light and be ye therefore perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect just as Jesus received form the Father of it.

            The devil himself believes in Jesus Christ, that does not mean he has received from God that what Jesus received from Him in Matt 3:16 where God Himself opens His heaven to that man. And He does the very same in all who will receive form Him the same as Jesus did.

            You are trying to make it way to complicated by the laws you have established for your doctrine to regulate your beliefs.

            The simplicity of God is be as I am by My same Spirit be in you who was in Christ Jesus. That is the only way you can know God at all is if He is manifest in you. Everything outside of the manifestation of is pure speculation and regulated by the laws you established to govern your beliefs.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Gary Mac View Post

              Not hard to understand at all if God has come to you and opened up all of His haven to you instead speculating about it. where you have His same Spirit, have His same mind, walk as He walks in His same light and be ye therefore perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect just as Jesus received form the Father of it.

              The devil himself believes in Jesus Christ, that does not mean he has received from God that what Jesus received from Him in Matt 3:16 where God Himself opens His heaven to that man. And He does the very same in all who will receive form Him the same as Jesus did.

              You are trying to make it way to complicated by the laws you have established for your doctrine to regulate your beliefs.

              The simplicity of God is be as I am by My same Spirit be in you who was in Christ Jesus. That is the only way you can know God at all is if He is manifest in you. Everything outside of the manifestation of is pure speculation and regulated by the laws you established to govern your beliefs.
              It is very hard for them to understand something which has never been a reality to them.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Gary Mac View Post

                Not hard to understand at all if God has come to you and opened up all of His haven to you instead speculating about it. where you have His same Spirit, have His same mind, walk as He walks in His same light and be ye therefore perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect just as Jesus received form the Father of it.

                The devil himself believes in Jesus Christ, that does not mean he has received from God that what Jesus received from Him in Matt 3:16 where God Himself opens His heaven to that man. And He does the very same in all who will receive form Him the same as Jesus did.

                You are trying to make it way to complicated by the laws you have established for your doctrine to regulate your beliefs.

                The simplicity of God is be as I am by My same Spirit be in you who was in Christ Jesus. That is the only way you can know God at all is if He is manifest in you. Everything outside of the manifestation of is pure speculation and regulated by the laws you established to govern your beliefs.
                All the complications are coming from you. Was that a Yes or a No?
                "And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach ..." (2 Ne. 25:26)
                "Yea, cry unto him for mercy, for he is mighty to save." (Alma 34:18)

                Comment


                • Originally posted by AlFin View Post

                  Absolutely. You only have to read the Old Testament to see that. Duh!
                  Really? What in the OT was not designed to point to Christ?

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

                    Really? What in the OT was not designed to point to Christ?
                    What does this have to do with my response to your post #149?
                    Allen

                    Unless otherwise noted, scripture quotes are from the 1984 edition of the NIV.

                    Faith--Sees the invisible, believes the impossible, and receives the impossible.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Calsgal View Post

                      Really? What in the OT was not designed to point to Christ?
                      You are confusing the will of God with the decree of God. They are not the same. It is the will of God that I should keep his commandments. But it has not been decreed that I would, whether I liked it or not. I have the freedom not to, and suffer the consequence. The Atonement of Jesus Christ was decreed that it should take place, and there was nothing that any man could do to prevent it from happening.
                      "And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach ..." (2 Ne. 25:26)
                      "Yea, cry unto him for mercy, for he is mighty to save." (Alma 34:18)

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by antiomno View Post

                        You are confusing the will of God with the decree of God. They are not the same. It is the will of God that I should keep his commandments. But it has not been decreed that I would, whether I liked it or not. I have the freedom not to, and suffer the consequence. The Atonement of Jesus Christ was decreed that it should take place, and there was nothing that any man could do to prevent it from happening.
                        Right. If we cooperate with God in obedience then we will reap the rewards he has promised. If we don't, then we will reap the consequences.
                        Allen

                        Unless otherwise noted, scripture quotes are from the 1984 edition of the NIV.

                        Faith--Sees the invisible, believes the impossible, and receives the impossible.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by AlFin View Post

                          We disagree. Most of what happens here is not ordained by God. If it was then that would make God the author of sin, instead, he commands us to not sin. If everything that we do is ordained by God, then any commandments from God are meaningless.

                          Why would God inspire Paul to write this if he dictated how we act and what we do?
                          2 Tim 2:15
                          Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth.

                          or this:

                          1 Thess 4:3-8
                          3 It is God's will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality; 4 that each of you should learn to control his own body in a way that is holy and honorable, 5 not in passionate lust like the heathen, who do not know God; 6 and that in this matter no one should wrong his brother or take advantage of him. The Lord will punish men for all such sins, as we have already told you and warned you. 7 For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life. 8 Therefore, he who rejects this instruction does not reject man but God, who gives you his Holy Spirit.


                          Calvinism removes all free will from us. Our choices mean nothing if God is in total control of mankind, this includes the ability to chose salvation. IMO it's just lazy man's theology.
                          Can you please God if you do deeds that are not done through the Spirit?

                          If you will good works, what will it benefit you?
                          God is pleased if you do good deeds as you are lead by the Spirit.
                          Your good deeds without the Spirit are like dirty rags to God.

                          There are 10 Commandments, and all failed to make the mark. Then our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ came to give you what.....more laws?

                          As for God ordaining sin... God is not culpable for any of mans sin. Men who want to defend their sin make God culpable.
                          Previously JCiL.
                          Rom 8:38 -39 For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers,
                          nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Braam View Post

                            Can you please God if you do deeds that are not done through the Spirit?
                            No, I never said I could.

                            If you will good works, what will it benefit you?
                            God is pleased if you do good deeds as you are lead by the Spirit.
                            Your good deeds without the Spirit are like dirty rags to God.
                            Of course, if I do good works they will please God and benefit me.

                            There are 10 Commandments, and all failed to make the mark. Then our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ came to give you what.....more laws?
                            No, he did not come to give us more laws. He came to give us the new birth with the Holy Spirit.

                            As for God ordaining sin... God is not culpable for any of mans [sic] sin. Men who want to defend their sin make God culpable.
                            I agree.
                            Allen

                            Unless otherwise noted, scripture quotes are from the 1984 edition of the NIV.

                            Faith--Sees the invisible, believes the impossible, and receives the impossible.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by antiomno View Post

                              It depends on what the "will of God" is. If it is the "will of God" that men should be free to choose good or evil for themselves, and be rewarded or punished accordingly, then obviously not.
                              seems like everyone has their own interpretation of the word WILL...

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by antiomno View Post

                                All the complications are coming from you. Was that a Yes or a No?
                                As I said it isn't complicated at all if God has come to you and opened up all of His heaven to you.for He reveals everything pertaining to His kingdom and who He is. That is what He does, that is what it means for the revelation of the Christ ... Christ revealed, manifested in you.

                                If that is to complicated for you to receive from God to understand don't blame me for your confusion.

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