You seem a little sensitive to think that somebody would dare stand against your “perfect” and “divine"Christian musings - and you would rather my pricked heart just not say anything - turn away. Why is that?
What's your eternity going to be like?
- Thread starter SteveB
- Start date
stiggy wiggy
Well-known member
What a crock of horse feces. I have never typed a word in all my thousands of posts about your or any one else's depravity.
You must have woke up on the wrong side of the bed today. You have reverted to your old hackneyed curmudgeonly role. When you get in these moods, try something to soothe the savage beast within, like maybe watching reruns of I Love Lucy. But if you are tempted to kick your dog or something similar, by all mean I hope you continue to let off steam by coming here and insulting billions. Boring is better than vicious.
Those are just statistics - be those as they may.
Lastdaysbeliever
Well-known member
Where in my comments do you see me as being sensitive to your comments? I've been attacked by far greater atheist warriors then you, with all due respect. And I am not ashamed of the Gospel and consequently I will stand my ground and not compromise my faith, irrespective of who it offends.
No - just speaking against the nonsense is enough.
Lastdaysbeliever
Well-known member
That's like claiming such-and-such is true because you read it on the interweb.
Good.... then don’t ask stupid questions like “what is it to you what I believe?”, and “how have we hurt you with our beliefs?" when you talk about me, my depravity and my damnation. I do the same as you. I stand my ground. I think it really is the issue that Christianity has culturally enjoyed some kind of don’t sass Jesus paradigm.
stiggy wiggy
Well-known member
But remember all the times you called me a liar and couldn't back it up? I don't want to get banned by calling you a liar here, so I'll give you the opportunity to show you are not one:
Copy/paste where I have ever said that you or anyone, or for that matter mankind is depraved.
Lastdaysbeliever
Well-known member
Respect should be mutual. I respect your right to believe what you will and express yourself concerning your beliefs, even when you are slamming my faith and my Lord, God and Savior because it's not me you're attacking but God. I won't stand before Him in your place but when you do know this, you will not be able to claim ignorance, that you didn't know, you will have no excuse and only yourself to blame.
Bless you 5wize,
Ldb
stiggy wiggy
Well-known member
LOL
I think Jesus can handle all your sissy sassing. He was spit in His face by guys a lot more formidable than you.
Good. We are agreeing on more and more.... I respect your right to believe what you will and express yourself concerning your beliefs, even when you are slamming my, and my loved one's personal dispositions. I take them as seriously as you take your lord, god and savior - except mine are actually real - so real harm was done, not imagined harm.
Sure Jesus can... but you've proven here that Jesus “culture” sure can’t.
Runningman
Well-known member
There is no eternal life in hell. The Bible says that only those who are believers in Jesus, followers in his ways, will receive eternal life. Those in hell die, are destroyed, or perish just like everything in the Old Testament and New Testament says. So what you have here amounts to nothing more than fear mongering. While there are good reasons to fear God, eternal conscious torment isn't one of them.
While I appreciate your efforts to encourage others to come to Christ, there is a right way and a wrong way to do this.
Matthew 10
28Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Instead, fear the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
SteveB
Well-known member
Even when it's utterly irrelevant?
So, your subjective experiences are equally as irrelevant?
Seems like you're lacking objectivity.
Apparently that's a lie. You spent your own time typing out 26 words, telling me that I should agree with your thinking on this issue, and think exactly how you feel I should.
Quoting the bible isn't about you. It's what YHVH said would achieve his purposes.
So, since you're saying that you don't actually want to know him, your opinion on this issue is irrelevant.
Don't worry. You'll get exactly what you want at death.
And you actually possess objectively verifiable evidence to back your belief about this up?
i mean, you have been there, and brought evidence back so we can check it out for ourselves?
yet, you obviously expect me to take your word for this, in spite of the fact that you offer absolutely nothing to corroborate your beliefs.
why would I do that?
yet another unsubstantiated opinion.
astonishing how those work.
"hey everyone! I have an opinion about something i know absolutely nothing about, and i think it's full of manure, so you should just take my word for it and ignore the people who are giving you the wherewithal to corroborate it for yourself. Admittedly, I know everything there is to know ABOUT it, but... I lack any experience beyond what I've been told!"
It's an astonishing thing how that goes....
The lack of actual experience means that you're a brilliantly ignorant person.
why would I? God hadn't created me yet.
ironically, YHVH says otherwise.
he says that we will exist for an eternity.
It's simply a matter of location.
As you keep saying you don't want to know if this is actually true or not, i guess that you'll get to find out the hard way.
YHVH himself is the evidence of my future.
i don't need to convince you.
you either want to know or you don't.
so far you've been telling me that you don't actually want to know.
if you ever change your mind, it's written that whoever will call on his name shall be saved.
just don't wait until you're dead.
it'll be too late.
yep. They date back to creation.
They're only bad to people who think they are more intelligent than they actually are.
They're only odd to people who love their sin.
They're only irrational to people who are irrational.
only to people who are blinded by their egos and don't actually want to know the truth.
They're only false to people who are desperate to escape culpability.
Reminds me of what John Lennox said about Stephen Hawking's claim about being afraid of the dark.
Sounds to me that you're desperate to avoid living forever.
That's what sounds childish to me.
People who are looking forward to living forever have come to understand that they actually have plenty to look forward to.
it's your eternity.
???
Well, considering that the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all unrighteousness, and gives us a right stand before God, this is exactly why we have so much to look forward to and increase in our understanding, learning, wisdom and knowledge of God and Jesus.
As the song from the 80's goes....
My future's so bright I've gotta wear shades.
In the case of Jesus followers, we use a #14 welding lens.
Thankfully, he gives us his power, his love, and sound thinking.
SteveB
Well-known member
i wouldn't call hell's existence anything remotely close to life.
Jesus describes it as an exceedingly miserable experience. Weeping, wailing, gnashing of teeth.
yep.
by all means, please provide biblical references for this.
if it weren't for Ezekiel 33, 2 Corinthians 5:11, Revelation 20-21:8, Proverbs 27:5-6, 28:4, Psalm 141:5, and several others, I'd agree with you.
But because those passages do exist, as Paul tells us in 1 Corinthians 9 about all means.... I'll continue to work through this.
Really? Then why did Jesus say
Mat 10:28 WEB Don’t be afraid of those who kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul. Rather, fear him who is able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.
Indeed. yet I don't see anything from you, encouraging people to turn to Jesus.
Yep.
Which is why I'm wondering why you're criticizing what I'm doing.
I have a great idea.
Please read Ezekiel 33, and then explain why you think that this is the wrong way.
Oh, BTW, I've been talking with these guys and gals for over a decade now, and have given them everything that pertains to life and godliness.
They've previously established that they have no interest in the gospel of Jesus.
This op is a biblical description, giving practical information on what awaits them, should they, in the end, refuse to come to Jesus.
All this said, I visited your bio, and see that you've been over in the theology forum.
Welcome to the atheist forum.
Instead of telling me how to do this, jump right in and talk with the atheists.
My focus has been incorporating the bible because of Isaiah 55:8-11, and 1 Cor. 2:4-7.
Others have used the classic Apologetics arguments, and they just shred those for fun.
It's become fairly clear to me that they don't actually want to know God, on God's terms.
A former member, from the previous revision of the forum once stated it in the following terms.
After extensive back and forth, I finally asked them if they wanted to know God or not.
They said they only wanted to know if God was real, without actually being involved in a relationship with him.
I explained to them that this had been explained to them repeatedly, since they came to the forum, back in the 00's.
I then explained to them that the only way to actually know that God is real, and knowable, in practical, real world terms, is by coming to Jesus. At which point, Jesus and God will come and make their home with them. I included John 14:20-24, with emphasis on vs 23.
That apparently was not what they wanted, and said they just wanted an argument that would intellectually convince them that God is real.
I told them that there was no "argument" that would definitively prove God's existence.
They eventually left the forums.
They may be here under a different name. In Late 2019, through early October 2020, the forum software experienced a catastrophic failure.
All the former members losts thousands of posts, and extensive discussions about all the biblical topics, Apologetics discussions, etc....
So, essentially, we've started over again, even though we all remember what was before.
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SteveB
Well-known member
I'm thinking that it exposes their sin for what it actually is, and they have previously decided that death is better than life, regardless of what death actually means.
Remember... Psalm 18:25-26.
In other translations, it reads that to the morally bankrupt, God appears perverse, tortuous, immoral....
They'll take their sin to the grave, and they don't care.
Lastdaysbeliever
Well-known member
I have faith the Bible is, just as you have faith it isn't so we equally share having an opinion.
SteveB
Well-known member
So, your opinion is that it's only an opinion until it's demonstrated, to your degree of satisfaction with the demonstration, regardless of the fact that it's been repeatedly demonstrated to hundreds of millions, indeed, billions of people throughout history, and they have enjoyed the life, and hope engaging YHVH on his terms has brought them?
How does your opinion carry so much weight, that you'll choose to send yourself to an eternal punishment?
Seems like you just enjoy torment.
Lastdaysbeliever
Well-known member
Ah....you're seeking common ground where there is none.
Real harm? Perhaps develop a thicker skin.
Temujin
Well-known member
You are not the gatekeeper to what is relevant.
My subjective experience is backed up by objective Facts, as I said. Seems like you are lacking in honesty.
That actually is a lie. I have no interest in telling you what to believe or that you should think as I do. That's what Christians do. As always, you write your response according to what you think I said rather than what I did say. You should be less sanctimonious and more honest.
The opinion of various long dead superstitious mystics is equally irrelevant. You quote them as an antidote to the fact that you have nothing real, nothing factual, nothing objective to support your position. Just bronze age poetry.
You are not in a position to decide that. Though clearly, in your hubris, you think that you do. Sanctimonious arrogance and dishonesty. This is what you use to evangelise?