ROFLOL, so you believe in Hebrews 1:5 that when the writer says, "for unto which of the angels did God ever say you are my Son this day have I begotten you", he was speaking of a function and not a celestial being huh? And you are telling me that I am speculating?
That is bunk, for although people can also be messengers, the Bible also reveals that God has created heavenly celestial beings that are called angels and the Bible specifically speaks of angels in Hebrews as actual celestial beings and tells us that God never spoke unto any of them and told them that they were his Son.
Here is the Encyclopedia Britannica on the Definition of the word Logos and you should understand that John was using the Philosophical Greek Logos and its Hebrew version the Memra, pretty much the same way that Paul used "the alter to the unknown God" in the Book of Acts.
Logos, (Greek: “word,”
“reason,” or “plan”) plural
logoi, in ancient
Greek philosophy and early
Christian theology, the divine
reason implicit in the cosmos, ordering it and giving it form and meaning.
Notice, nowhere in the early definitions of the Logos, is it ever stated that the Logos was an actual living person and even in the Hebrew version of the Memra, the Memra was only a personification of God's word and not an actual sentient living being or second person of God like trins try to argue and the Jewish Encyclopedia will reveal this also.
Oh come on dude, it proves that God foreknew Jeremiah intimately as conceived first in his mind and plan before he was actually created in the physical world and so does Psalm 139 concerning David also and this proves that Jesus pre existed only in God's intimate foreknowledge of him and before any others in creation also.
This is what Paul is speaking of in Colossians 1:15-16 and also in Romans 8:29. Jesus was the firstborn image of the invisible God over all creation and which means he was the firstborn conceived in the mind = Logos of God over all creation.
Romans 8:29 proves this as what Paul meant because all saints from the beginning of creation unto the end are predestined to be conformed to his image and this also includes Enoch, Noah, Abraham, David and all of God's elect from the beginning to the end.
Which being Jesus was not the firstborn in the order of the physical creation, he was the firstborn as conceived in the mind of God = the Logos.
For if every single saint from the beginning of creation to the end of creation was predestined to be conformed to the image of Jesus and the scriptures cannot be broken, then Jesus had to be the first to be conceived in God's mind and at the center of his Divine Logos and you do need to consider the full definition of the Logos.
Well my Bible tells me, "out of the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be confirmed" what does your say dude?
ROFLOL, Sorry but there is nothing philosophical at all about what Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians chapters 1-3 and especially in what he wrote in 1 Corinthians 2:13-16 and following into 1 Corinthians 3:1-2 and as I have copied and pasted below.
For this is the very reason why there are right now so many different divisions of tongues of false doctrine in the world (Mystery Babylon), including that of the Jehovah's Witnesses.
1 Corinthians 2:
13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words. 14 The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit. 15 The person with the Spirit makes judgments about all things, but such a person is not subject to merely human judgments, 16 for,
“Who has known the mind of the Lord
so as to instruct him?”
But we (who are truly spiritual) have the mind of Christ.
1 Corinthians 3: And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ. 2 I gave you milk to drink, not solid food; for you were not yet able to receive it. Indeed, even now you are not yet able,
I just gave it unto you by the true definition of the word "Logos" before the apostate churches" added their unsupported inflections on the the word.
Furthermore, I also have you proof from what is truly being taught in Colossians 1:15-16 and also in Romans 8:29 and also from Jeremiah 1:5 and from Psalm 139, and you really shouldn't need a picture drawn for you.
For if all God's elect were predestined to be conformed to the image of Jesus who is the firstborn image of the invisible God of all the creation as a human being, and as per Colossians 1:15 and Romans 8:29, then this proves that Paul was not speaking of Jesus as the first creation at all.
For what it proves is that Paul was speaking of Jesus as the firstborn human being in the image of the invisible God that was conceived in God's mind and unto which all his elect from the beginning of the creation to the end would be predestined to be conformed to the image of.
Like I said, you are led by your flesh and also by the flesh of the teachers of the Jehovah's witnesses and that is why you can't see these facts in the scriptures, but they are there to be seen and understood by those who are led by the Spirit.
Furthermore, Jehovah's Witnesses speculate on many things in the scriptures and without even the slightest bit of evidence from any of the inspired writers of the NT also and like I the examples I posted in a previous reply and you knew better than to get into being you know what I am talking about.
Like the classes that they divide God's people into such as "the Mordecai Naomi class" and which is utter nonsense and not at all revealed in the scriptures.
You are also wrong about what you believe about how we are to be saved as well and other than the truth about the nature of God and Christ, this is the most important issue in the scriptures.