This makes Jesus the son of God the Father
This makes Jesus the incarnation of his Father, not the incarnation of himself.
You just exposed your faulty belief.
Did Jesus teach he was GOD himself?
- Thread starter Lilel01
- Start date
You just exposed your faulty belief.
You just proved that Jesus is not God. God was sustaining while Jesus was dead for three days...
Yahchristian
Well-known member
You said...
Jesus is the Son of the Creator and Sustainer of all things.
So just to clarify...
Is Jesus the Son of A BEING?
I say Yes.
rossh
Well-known member
Yes and I see the quoted passage and I already know this, do you have a point or an idea that you wish to impart ?
You post is saying " Your Lord and Savior have a God " ? not very good English but never mind that for now, is this a statement/claim on your part or what is it about ?
Let see now ? oh yes!!
John 20:6 A week later his talmidim were once more in the room, and this time T'oma was with them. Although the doors were locked, Yeshua came, stood among them and said, "Shalom aleikhem!" 27 Then he said to T'oma, "Put your finger here, look at my hands, take your hand and put it into my side. Don't be lacking in trust, but have trust!" 28 T'oma answered him, "My Lord and my God!" 29 Yeshua said to him, "Have you trusted because you have seen me? How blessed are those who do not see, but trust anyway!" 30 In the presence of the talmidim Yeshua performed many other miracles which have not been recorded in this book. 31 But these which have been recorded are here so that you may trust that Yeshua is the Messiah, the Son of God, and that by this trust you may have life because of who he is.
When ever the Hebrews/Israeli made any sacrifice to God. the actual sacrifice had to be pure and without spot of blemish.. The same is demanded of a man being the sacrifice . Herein is the problem. Not one man is pure,, as we are all born with the sin nature of Adam. Yeshua, Gods Son is NOT born of man and has no " sin nature "..
rossh
Well-known member
I HAVE NEVER SAID THAT YESHUS IS GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! EEEEEEKKKKKKK, YOU TROLLS THE PITS...
Jesus is the Son in His deity and in his humanity!
rossh
Well-known member
They just do not want to listen... They reject even Gods Word on this... they will never accept the fact that Yeshua was born a flesh and blood man, a man whom did NOT have a human being father! Matt 2:1 Gal 4:1-31
Acts 2:
1 The festival of Shavu'ot arrived, and the believers all gathered together in one place.
2 Suddenly there came a sound from the sky like the roar of a violent wind, and it filled the whole house where they were sitting.
3 Then they saw what looked like tongues of fire, which separated and came to rest on each one of them.
4 They were all filled with the Ruach HaKodesh and began to talk in different languages, as the Spirit enabled them to speak.
5 Now there were staying in Yerushalayim religious Jews from every nation under heaven.
6 When they heard this sound, a crowd gathered; they were confused, because each one heard the believers speaking in his own language.
7 Totally amazed, they asked, "How is this possible? Aren't all these people who are speaking from the Galil?
johnny guitar
Well-known member
Jesus Christ is the incarnation of The SON, NOT The Father.
rossh
Well-known member
and He never taught that he was God and so all that is just in your mind, no one else to be blamed for thinking that..
1 The festival of Shavu'ot arrived, and the believers all gathered together in one place.
2 Suddenly there came a sound from the sky like the roar of a violent wind, and it filled the whole house where they were sitting.
3 Then they saw what looked like tongues of fire, which separated and came to rest on each one of them.
4 They were all filled with the Ruach HaKodesh and began to talk in different languages, as the Spirit enabled them to speak.
5 Now there were staying in Yerushalayim religious Jews from every nation under heaven.
6 When they heard this sound, a crowd gathered; they were confused, because each one heard the believers speaking in his own language.
7 Totally amazed, they asked, "How is this possible? Aren't all these people who are speaking from the Galil?
Amen!
OldShepherd
Well-known member
Does you Bible only have those 2 verses? My Bible has 31,172 verses. I use the all of them, not just one or two.
There is one God! The Son is called/referred to as God, in scripture, but the Son is not the Father or the Holy Spirit. Thirty six (36) scripture which address or refer to Jesus as God.
[1] Mat 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
[4] Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
[5] Joh 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
[6] Joh 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him[God created the world, Gen 1:1], and the world knew him not.
[7] Joh 1:14 And the Word [acting on Himself] became flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
[8] Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten God, μονογενὴς θεὸς ] which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
[9] John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
[10] Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. [Jewish leaders speaking]
[11] Joh 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.[John speaking]
[12] Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, [Amen, Amen] I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am [ אהיה/ehyeh, I am, Ex 3:14].
[13] John 12:41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his [Jesus] glory, and spake of him[יהוה/YHWH, Isa 6:1ff].
[15] Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was[Jesus was aware of His existence,with God, before the world was created.].
[16] Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine[Everything that belongs to the Father belongs to Jesus]; and I am glorified in them.
[17] Joh 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, [Jesus] My Lord and my God. [Thomas addressed Jesus as God and Jesus praised him.]
[18] Act 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
[19] Rom 9:5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever[Jesus called God]. Amen.
[20] 2 Cor 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
{Character limit. Continued next post]
[2]Isaiah 7:14
14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
[3]Luk 7:16 And there came a fear on all: and they glorified God, saying, That a great prophet is risen up among us; and, That God hath visited his people.14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
[4] Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
[5] Joh 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
[6] Joh 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him[God created the world, Gen 1:1], and the world knew him not.
[7] Joh 1:14 And the Word [acting on Himself] became flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
[8] Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten God, μονογενὴς θεὸς ] which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
[9] John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
[10] Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. [Jewish leaders speaking]
[11] Joh 5:18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.[John speaking]
[12] Joh 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, [Amen, Amen] I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am [ אהיה/ehyeh, I am, Ex 3:14].
[13] John 12:41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his [Jesus] glory, and spake of him[יהוה/YHWH, Isa 6:1ff].
Isa 6:1 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple
[14] Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?[15] Joh 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was[Jesus was aware of His existence,with God, before the world was created.].
[16] Joh 17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine[Everything that belongs to the Father belongs to Jesus]; and I am glorified in them.
[17] Joh 20:28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, [Jesus] My Lord and my God. [Thomas addressed Jesus as God and Jesus praised him.]
[18] Act 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.
[19] Rom 9:5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever[Jesus called God]. Amen.
[20] 2 Cor 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
{Character limit. Continued next post]
OldShepherd
Well-known member
[Previous post continued]
[21] Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, [Jesus] and for him[Jesus]:
[22] Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
[23] Eph 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
[24] Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
[25] Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever[God calls the Son, God]: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;
12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.
[26] Heb 3:3 For this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house.
4 For every house is builded by some man; but he that built all things is God.
[27] Phi 2:6 Who, being [existing] in the form of God, thought it not something to be used to His advantage the being[present, active infinitive] equal with God:[The being equal to God was a then and there reality not something considered and declined.]
[28] 1 Tim 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh[Jesus called God], is justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
[29] 1 Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ[Jesus called God], which is our hope;
[If Jesus is not God and savior in vs,1 He is not Lord and savior in vs. 11. Same grammatical construction]
[31] Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ[Jesus called God. If Jesus is not God in Tts 2:13 He is not Lord and Savior 2 Pet 1:11, same grammatical structure.];
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
[32] 2 Pet 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ[Jesus called God. If Jesus is NOT God and savior 2 Pet 1:1, He is not Lord and savior vs. 2:11, same grammatical structure.]:
[33] 1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life[Jesus called God].
[34] Rev 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings[יהוה/YHWH, Deu 10:17]: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
[35] Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS[יהוה/YHWH, Deu 10:17].
[36] Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be[יהוה/YHWH, Isa 40:10].
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.[יהוה/YHWH, Isa 44:6][/indent]
[21] Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, [Jesus] and for him[Jesus]:
[22] Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
[23] Eph 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
[24] Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
[25] Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever[God calls the Son, God]: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
11 They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;
12 And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.
[26] Heb 3:3 For this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house.
4 For every house is builded by some man; but he that built all things is God.
[27] Phi 2:6 Who, being [existing] in the form of God, thought it not something to be used to His advantage the being[present, active infinitive] equal with God:[The being equal to God was a then and there reality not something considered and declined.]
[28] 1 Tim 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh[Jesus called God], is justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
[29] 1 Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the commandment of God our Saviour, and Lord Jesus Christ[Jesus called God], which is our hope;
[If Jesus is not God and savior in vs,1 He is not Lord and savior in vs. 11. Same grammatical construction]
2 Peter 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
[30] 1 Tim 6:15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;[The lamb is king of kings, Rev 17:14, Jesus is king of kings, Rev 19:16, God is Lord of Lords Deu 10:17][31] Tit 2:13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ[Jesus called God. If Jesus is not God in Tts 2:13 He is not Lord and Savior 2 Pet 1:11, same grammatical structure.];
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
[32] 2 Pet 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ[Jesus called God. If Jesus is NOT God and savior 2 Pet 1:1, He is not Lord and savior vs. 2:11, same grammatical structure.]:
[33] 1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life[Jesus called God].
[34] Rev 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings[יהוה/YHWH, Deu 10:17]: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
[35] Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS[יהוה/YHWH, Deu 10:17].
[36] Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be[יהוה/YHWH, Isa 40:10].
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.[יהוה/YHWH, Isa 44:6][/indent]
rossh
Well-known member
learn how to read English then come back and try again.. Oh yes and also, leave out and omit your suppositions which you insert as you go along with your blasphemy .. so if you do want to be taken seriously just use Scripture only.. you quoted what " people " said by suppositions and you suppose these issues yourself.. lol
John 17:9 "I am praying for them. I am not praying for the world, but for those you have given to me, because they are yours. 10 Indeed, all I have is yours, and all you have is mine, and in them I have been glorified. 11 Now I am no longer in the world. They are in the world, but I am coming to you. Holy Father, guard them by the power of your name, which you have given to me, so that they may be one, just as we are.
You type nothing but garbage and an insult to all..
rossh
Well-known member
Col 1 as you quoted is a problem for many, they seem to think that it is a Question.. sic!
…8 Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and that will be enough for us.” 9 Jesus replied, “Philip, I have been with you all this time, and still you do not know Me? Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in Me? The words I say to you, I do not speak on My own. Instead, it is the Father dwelling in Me, performing His works.…
The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of His nature, upholding all things by His powerful word. After He had provided purification for sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high.
rossh
Well-known member
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 He was with God in the beginning.
3 All things came to be through him, and without him nothing made had being.
4 In him was life, and the life was the light of mankind.
5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not suppressed it.
6 There was a man sent from God whose name was Yochanan.
7 He came to be a testimony, to bear witness concerning the light; so that through him, everyone might put his trust in God and be faithful to him.
8 He himself was not that light; no, he came to bear witness concerning the light.
9 This was the true light, which gives light to everyone entering the world.
10 He was in the world -- the world came to be through him -- yet the world did not know him.
well I can not find where it says explicitly that, " Yeshua IS God " ? so you will have to c/p it for me/us please ?
rossh
Well-known member
well may we suggest that you actually OPEN your Bible and actually READ those verses.. THEN you will be able to preach to us... instead of guessing.... Rev 4:
1 After these things, I looked; and there before me was a door standing open in heaven; and the voice like a trumpet which I had heard speaking with me before said, "Come up here, and I will show you what must happen after these things."
2 Instantly I was in the Spirit, and there before me in heaven stood a throne, and on the throne Someone was sitting.
3 The One sitting there gleamed like diamonds and rubies, and a rainbow shining like emerald encircled the throne.
4 Surrounding the throne were twenty-four other thrones, and on the thrones sat twenty-four elders dressed in white clothing and wearing gold crowns on their heads.
5 From the throne came forth lightnings, voices and thunderings; and before the throne were seven flaming torches, which are the sevenfold Spirit of God.
johnny guitar
Well-known member
The Son of THE Being.
100% WRONG again He Will Add! He ( the Word ) " who was God " and " was with God " ( the Father & Holy Spirit ) in John 1:1 BECAME " Flesh " ( God the Word in the Flesh as Jesus Christ the God-Man ) in John 1:14! All was created through/By Him ( God the Word, who became Jesus Christ ) as per John 1:3/ Col.1:16! Even God the Father calls Him " O God " in Heb.1:8, just after all His created angels Worshiped Him ( Jesus ) in Heb.1:6! Angels do not worship anyone but God! Precarnate Jesus ( the Word ) existed as God in order to have known Abraham BEFORE Abraham was born as per John 8:58! Case closed on the former HWA with his Twisted views ( 2 Peter 3:16 ) because all the AS IS ( before the Twist ) posted scriptures rebukes his views as per 2 Tim.3:16!
John said He " was God " the Word and " was with God " ( the Father & Holy Spirit ) in John 1:1 before He became " Flesh " ( incarnate as the God-Man Jesus Christ ) in John 1:14! The doubting Apostle Thomas said this " My Lord and My God " after seeing the resurrected Christ with His crucifixion wounds in John 20:28! So yes they did indeed and the case is closed!
Our Lord's God
Well-known member
No it doesn't. It was your imaginations that did that.
No, its the actual Greek construction that asserts that!