Why Evangelicals always lose the Mormon Debate!

Richard7

Well-known member
It's very simple: 2 Nephi 29

1 But behold, there shall be many—at that day when I shall proceed to do a marvelous work among them, that I may remember my covenants which I have made unto the children of men, that I may set my hand again the second time to recover my people, which are of the house of Israel;

2 And also, that I may remember the promises which I have made unto thee, Nephi, and also unto thy father, that I would remember your seed; and that the awords of your seed should proceed forth out of my mouth unto your seed; and my words shall hiss forth unto the ends of the earth, for a standard unto my people, which are of the house of Israel;

3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.

4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what cthank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?

5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.

6 Thou fool, that shall say: A Bible, we have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible. Have ye obtained a Bible save it were by the Jews?

7 Know ye not that there are more nations than one? Know ye not that I, the Lord your God, have created all men, and that I remember those who are upon the isles of the sea; and that I rule in the heavens above and in the earth beneath; and I bring forth my word unto the children of men, yea, even upon all the nations of the earth?

8 Wherefore murmur ye, because that ye shall receive more of my word? Know ye not that the testimony of two nations is a witness unto you that I am God, that I remember one nation like unto another? Wherefore, I speak the same words unto one nation like unto another. And when the two nations shall run together the testimony of the two nations shall run together also.

9 And I do this that I may prove unto many that I am the same yesterday, today, and forever; and that I speak forth my words according to mine own pleasure. And because that I have spoken one word ye need not suppose that I cannot speak another; for my work is not yet finished; neither shall it be until the end of man, neither from that time henceforth and forever.

10 Wherefore, because that ye have a Bible ye need not suppose that it contains all my words; neither need ye suppose that I have not caused more to be written.

11 For I command all men, both in the east and in the west, and in the north, and in the south, and in the islands of the sea, that they shall write the words which I speak unto them; for out of the books which shall be written I will judge the world, every man according to their works, according to that which is written.

12 For behold, I shall speak unto the Jews and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the Nephites and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the other tribes of the house of Israel, which I have led away, and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto all nations of the earth and they shall write it.

13 And it shall come to pass that the aews shall have the words of the Nephites, and the Nephites shall have the words of the Jews; and the Nephites and the Jews shall have the words of the lost tribes of Israel; and the lost tribes of Israel shall have the words of the Nephites and the Jews.

14 And it shall come to pass that my people, which are of the house of Israel, shall be gathered home unto the lands of their possessions; and my word also shall be gathered in cone. And I will show unto them that fight against my word and against my people, who are of the house of Israel, that I am God, and that I covenanted with Abraham that I would remember his seed forever.

Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, D&C and includes the Bible as it's correctly translated...
 
And that perfectly demonstrates the Mormon contempt for the word of God.

If the Church felt contempt, then they should remove from every Meetinghouse the Name, The Church of Jesus of LDS, and from our Temples the House of the Lord.... so we boldly proclaim the name of Jesus Christ on our Building and the Calvinist proclaim their precious founder, Calvinist or all other denominations that usually include the name of some other church than Jesus Christ ... chuckle...
 
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So the question is why do we win the debate every time!

1).The LDS Church is closer than any other religion out there to the Church Christ set up.
2). A living Church that relies on personal revelation, for flesh and bone has not revealed it unto us but our Father in Heaven has.
3). Living apostles and prophet, no other church can lay claim to this and also claim to have the Keys of the Kingdom
4). Common sense makes it simpler for the humble and sincere seeker to understand our doctrine versus the complex and unexplainable 3 in one God, or the corrupt claim that we are all predestined to have salvation or consigned to hell for ever..
5). Last of all, the promise in Moroni 10. A promise from God and we know God does not lie.


If any other Mormons poster would like to add to this list, it will be appreciated.


Moroni 10
2 And I seal up these records, after I have spoken a few words by way of exhortation unto you.

3 Behold, I would exhort you that when ye shall read these things, if it be wisdom in God that ye should read them, that ye would remember how merciful the Lord hath been unto the children of men, from the creation of Adam even down until the time that ye shall receive these things, and ponder it in your hearts.

4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ,
if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.

5 And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things.
You hit upon a verse mistranslated in the Book of Mormon that is quoted correctly in the introduction of the Book of Mormon

notice below how Moroni verse 4 was corrected in introduction below

We invite all men everywhere to read the Book of Mormon, to ponder in their hearts the message it contains, and then to ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ if the book is true.
 
It's very simple: 2 Nephi 29

1 But behold, there shall be many—at that day when I shall proceed to do a marvelous work among them, that I may remember my covenants which I have made unto the children of men, that I may set my hand again the second time to recover my people, which are of the house of Israel;

2 And also, that I may remember the promises which I have made unto thee, Nephi, and also unto thy father, that I would remember your seed; and that the awords of your seed should proceed forth out of my mouth unto your seed; and my words shall hiss forth unto the ends of the earth, for a standard unto my people, which are of the house of Israel;

3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.

4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what cthank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?

5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.

6 Thou fool, that shall say: A Bible, we have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible. Have ye obtained a Bible save it were by the Jews?

7 Know ye not that there are more nations than one? Know ye not that I, the Lord your God, have created all men, and that I remember those who are upon the isles of the sea; and that I rule in the heavens above and in the earth beneath; and I bring forth my word unto the children of men, yea, even upon all the nations of the earth?

8 Wherefore murmur ye, because that ye shall receive more of my word? Know ye not that the testimony of two nations is a witness unto you that I am God, that I remember one nation like unto another? Wherefore, I speak the same words unto one nation like unto another. And when the two nations shall run together the testimony of the two nations shall run together also.

9 And I do this that I may prove unto many that I am the same yesterday, today, and forever; and that I speak forth my words according to mine own pleasure. And because that I have spoken one word ye need not suppose that I cannot speak another; for my work is not yet finished; neither shall it be until the end of man, neither from that time henceforth and forever.

10 Wherefore, because that ye have a Bible ye need not suppose that it contains all my words; neither need ye suppose that I have not caused more to be written.

11 For I command all men, both in the east and in the west, and in the north, and in the south, and in the islands of the sea, that they shall write the words which I speak unto them; for out of the books which shall be written I will judge the world, every man according to their works, according to that which is written.

12 For behold, I shall speak unto the Jews and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the Nephites and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the other tribes of the house of Israel, which I have led away, and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto all nations of the earth and they shall write it.

13 And it shall come to pass that the aews shall have the words of the Nephites, and the Nephites shall have the words of the Jews; and the Nephites and the Jews shall have the words of the lost tribes of Israel; and the lost tribes of Israel shall have the words of the Nephites and the Jews.

14 And it shall come to pass that my people, which are of the house of Israel, shall be gathered home unto the lands of their possessions; and my word also shall be gathered in cone. And I will show unto them that fight against my word and against my people, who are of the house of Israel, that I am God, and that I covenanted with Abraham that I would remember his seed forever.

Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, D&C and includes the Bible as it's correctly translated...
This is one of the most...ridiculous assertions I have ever seen on here, and is totally unmerited. It is telling that you have to quote from the fictional (except for the stuff quoted from the Bible), in order to support your assertion.

Mormons can never, ever go against the true word of God, the Bible, especially the passages that declare that there is only One True God. Even the BoM asserts that and even has Trinitarianism in it. Yet, later "revelation" not only contradicts the Bible, but the BoM as well.
 
You hit upon a verse mistranslated in the Book of Mormon that is quoted correctly in the introduction of the Book of Mormon

notice below how Moroni verse 4 was corrected in introduction below

We invite all men everywhere to read the Book of Mormon, to ponder in their hearts the message it contains, and then to ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ if the book is true.
What happened to the "burning in the bosom" part?
 
So the question is why do we win the debate every time!

1).The LDS Church is closer than any other religion out there to the Church Christ set up.

That is completely false.
The original church taught monotheism, Mormonism teaches "plural gods".
The original church taught faith alone, Mormonism teaches "obedience for salvation".
The original church taught monogamy, Mormonism teaches polygamy.
The original church taught paid ministry, Mormonism teaches against it.
And so many more...

2). A living Church that relies on personal revelation, for flesh and bone has not revealed it unto us but our Father in Heaven has.

This is completely false.
The Father did not reveal Mormonism.
It was an invention of Joseph Smith and other men.

3). Living apostles and prophet, no other church can lay claim to this and also claim to have the Keys of the Kingdom

This is completely false.
Mormon "apostles" and "prophets" are not authentic, or called of God.

4). Common sense makes it simpler for the humble and sincere seeker to understand our doctrine versus the complex and unexplainable 3 in one God, or the corrupt claim that we are all predestined to have salvation or consigned to hell for ever..

True theology doesn't come from "common sense":

Prov. 14:12 There is a way that seems right to a man,
but its end is the way to death.

5). Last of all, the promise in Moroni 10. A promise from God and we know God does not lie.

God didn't write Moroni 10.
 
You hit upon a verse mistranslated in the Book of Mormon that is quoted correctly in the introduction of the Book of Mormon

notice below how Moroni verse 4 was corrected in introduction below

We invite all men everywhere to read the Book of Mormon, to ponder in their hearts the message it contains, and then to ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ if the book is true.
Thx you, not go to Moroni 10 where the actual correct scripture is found.
 
This is one of the most...ridiculous assertions I have ever seen on here, and is totally unmerited. It is telling that you have to quote from the fictional (except for the stuff quoted from the Bible), in order to support your assertion.

Mormons can never, ever go against the true word of God, the Bible, especially the passages that declare that there is only One True God. Even the BoM asserts that and even has Trinitarianism in it. Yet, later "revelation" not only contradicts the Bible, but the BoM as well.
Then why do we always win the debate? the best you guys can come up with is 3 in on God... which we win every-time and also Faith wihout works is dead!

We have countlessly explained the Godhead... not our problem you want to continue to misrepresent our Godhead doctrine.. this is the reason you guys lose so much...its obvious to most visitors and guest you have to twist our doctrine in a attempt to live with a very faulty doctrine of the Trinity as you observe it and we don't ... hmm
 
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Then why do we always win the debate?

You don't.
You've NEVER "won the debate".

the best you guys can come up with is 3 in on God... which we win every-time and also Faith wihout works is dead!

You see... You don't realize that infantile mockery doesn't win debates.

You can't "win" a debate when you keep RUNNING AWAY from Deut. 4:35,39, 1 Kings 8:60, Isa. 43:10, 44:6,8, 45:5,21,22, 46:9, 1 Cor. 8:4, etc. etc.

You can't "win" a debate when you keep RUNNING AWAY from Eph. 2:8-9, 2 Tim. 1:9, Tit. 3:5, Rom. 4:5, 4:6, 11:5-6, etc. etc.
 
What happened to the "burning in the bosom" part?
Well we also have additional scripture that boasters Moroni Chapter 10 found in D&C 9.... another reason you guys lose the debate... even in the Bible it talks about a burning in the bosom and christians completely ignore it.... bingo another win.

8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.

9 But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings, but you shall have a stupor of thought that shall cause you to forget the thing which is wrong; therefore, you cannot write that which is sacred save it be given you from me.

D&C 9
 
bingo another win.

1Kings 20:11 And the king of Israel answered, “Tell him, ‘Let not him who straps on his armor boast himself as he who takes it off.’”

You know judges are supposed to be neutral and impartial, right?

So what non-Mormon has EVER said, "Mormons have won the debate"?
 
That is completely false.
I have yet to find anyone that has tackled the BOM and proven it fiction... many speculations but nothing concrete... we win until proven wrong... chuckle
The original church taught monotheism, Mormonism teaches "plural gods".
We have constantly been consistent on this forum that we worship One God. Not our problem you use the usual anti materials for your source and never go to the actual source, the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS to get the truth... hmm


The original church taught faith alone, Mormonism teaches "obedience for salvation".
It also teaches faith without works is dead... don't you wish you could get rid of that verse... hmm


The original church taught monogamy, Mormonism teaches polygamy.
The original church taught paid ministry, Mormonism teaches against it.
And so many more...

We lived the law of God on marriage found in section 132.... the new and everlasting covenant... so did Abraham and other old testament patriarchs... but you lose when you judged Abraham a adulterer...

1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.

3 And he said unto them, Take nothing for your journey, neither staves, nor scrip, neither bread, neither money; neither have two coats apiece.
Christ set the true example.... Luke 9 ...

Another debate lost ... hmm

This is completely false.
The Father did not reveal Mormonism.
It was an invention of Joseph Smith and other men.
Wrong, you need to study the scriptures more Theo...


This is completely false.
Mormon "apostles" and "prophets" are not authentic, or called of God.

Please show what Church today has the Key of the Kingdom once given to Peter, where in he was given power and authority..
"he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority" Luke 9



True theology doesn't come from "common sense":
Well that would hold true that common sense does not allows for the false definition of trinity and predestination. God predestined that 6 million Jews to be murdered along with babies and infants...


Prov. 14:12 There is a way that seems right to a man,
but its end is the way to death.



God didn't write Moroni 10.
Prove it, so far all we see is pure phony speculation...
 
1Kings 20:11 And the king of Israel answered, “Tell him, ‘Let not him who straps on his armor boast himself as he who takes it off.’”

You know judges are supposed to be neutral and impartial, right?

So what non-Mormon has EVER said, "Mormons have won the debate"?
No different than your usual, "not interested" when challenged... that is a losing reply every-time...debate is a two way conversation Theo, not interested is admitting you can't..... My premise of Christians losing the debate stands and is obvious to most...
 
I have yet to find anyone that has tackled the BOM and proven it fiction... many speculations but nothing concrete... we win until proven wrong... chuckle

Wrong.
The truth or falsity of Mormonism is IRRELEVENT to whether the BoM is true or false.
And in fact, in order to give Smith any validity, you have to PROVE it to be true.

WE "win" until proven wrong.... <Chuckle>

We have constantly been consistent on this forum that we worship One God.

Irrelevant.
You believe in MANY gods, contary to the Bible.

Not our problem you use the usual anti materials for your source and never go to the actual source, the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS to get the truth... hmm

Wow.
So you consider the Bible to be "anti materials".
hmmm...

It also teaches faith without works is dead... don't you wish you could get rid of that verse... hmm

Nope, I have no problem with that passage. The only problem is that Mormons don't understand what that means, even though I've written an exhaustive exegesis of that chapter.

YOU are the ones who wish you could "get rid of" Eph. 2:8-9, 2 Tim. 1:9, Tit. 3:5, Rom. 4:1-6, Rom. 11:5-6, etc. etc.

The original church taught paid ministry, Mormonism teaches against it.
And so many more...

We lived the law of God on marriage found in section 132.... the new and everlasting covenant... so did Abraham and other old testament patriarchs...

D&C 132 is anti-Biblical garbage.

but you lose when you judged Abraham a adulterer...

Wrong again.
You lose when you deny he was a sinner.

1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.

3 And he said unto them, Take nothing for your journey, neither staves, nor scrip, neither bread, neither money; neither have two coats apiece.
Christ set the true example.... Luke 9 ...

Reading comprhension problem?
The reason they weren't supposed to bring anything because they were to be SUPPORTED by the people they preached to.

Another debate lost ... hmm

... lost by Mormons.

Wrong, you need to study the scriptures more Theo...

You keep running AWAY from "the Scriptures".

Please show what Church today has the Key of the Kingdom once given to Peter, where in he was given power and authority..
"he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority" Luke 9

I don't have to.
His disciples STILL have those keys.
Prove that any MORMONS have them.

Mormons lose again!

Prove it, so far all we see is pure phony speculation...

Correct, Mormonism is NOTHING but "pure phony speculation".
 
No different than your usual, "not interested" when challenged... that is a losing reply every-time...debate is a two way conversation Theo, not interested is admitting you can't..... My premise of Christians losing the debate stands and is obvious to most...

The bottom line is that you have nothing but bankrupt boasts of "we win!", when:

1) You are never able to defend your beliefs;
2) You shift the burden of proof to US to "disprove" your beliefs, and you cherry-pick irrelevant things that we MUST "disprove"; and
3) You keep attacking our beliefs, because you can't defend your own.

When all the dust settles, and all the mud-slinging has been cleared, you've accomplished precisely NOTHING.
 
Wrong.
The truth or falsity of Mormonism is IRRELEVENT (irrelevant) to whether the BoM is true or false.
And in fact, in order to give Smith any validity, you have to PROVE it to be true.
Lost, you have no desire to prove what you call irrelevant. Since you can not debate with a show of proof, than discussion comes to a end, quite normal for when losing a debate... just quit and claim irrelevant... chuckle... hope all you guest and visitors notice his running away and quitting the discussion... This just proves my topic is relevant..


WE "win" until proven wrong.... <Chuckle>
No debate indicates no desire to prove the BoM is fiction and if I asked him to prove the Bible I wonder if he would still divert. I wonder if he even knows what Faith entails... hmm

Irrelevant.
You believe in MANY gods, contary (contrary) to the Bible.

Believe contary? whoops. Have not idea of what your question is... chuckle.


Wow.
So you consider the Bible to be "anti materials".
What? that we worship one God, and believe in many other gods... yes that is correct, but as usual you misrepresent worship and believe in this context... do you even know the difference in believe and worship... so folks this is what I stated..."We have constantly been consistent on this forum that we worship One God." Can anyone find the word believe in one God in my reply... nope, the poster apparently does not even understand his own question... chuckle

hmmm...



Nope, I have no problem with that passage. The only problem is that Mormons don't understand what that means, even though I've written an exhaustive exegesis of that chapter.

Than I must have missed your exhaustive and comprehensive explication....

YOU are the ones who wish you could "get rid of" Eph. 2:8-9, 2 Tim. 1:9, Tit. 3:5, Rom. 4:1-6, Rom. 11:5-6, etc. etc.
You know my heart and mind? interesting, maybe you are in to prophecy...

D&C 132 is anti-Biblical garbage.

Yet I don't see a effort to debate... lost for reasons of non-communicable... a Christian debating disease .. hmm

https://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/what-is-non-communicable-disease



Wrong again.
You lose when you deny he was a sinner.

If I'm a sinner that so are you and Abraham... you though labeled and judged him a adulterer... worthy of being stoned according to Mosaic law.

Reading comprhension problem?
The reason they weren't supposed to bring anything because they were to be SUPPORTED by the people they preached to.
what is reading comprehhension?... chuckle
I don't have to.
His disciples STILL have those keys.
Prove that any MORMONS have them.

Mormons lose again!



Correct, Mormonism is NOTHING but "pure phony speculation".
Guest and visitors, in any of the above is there any debate going on... just my point, they lose for not willing to debate... what's the word again, oh yea, when nothing comes to mind they just call it garbage... a losing reply if any... this poster has just proven my point over and over..

Why Evangelicals always lose the Mormon Debate!​

 
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