Did Jesus bear Gods wrath and was He forsaken ?

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You don’t know the value since you haven’t read the book

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Brother, suppose there is value in there. And I am sure there must be some truth. But value is valuable when it’s widespread, not just in a couple places. Unless this person has some secret info from God that he along gives to mankind. And I highly doubt that.

I don’t know why this book is so important?
 
Brother, suppose there is value in there. And I am sure there must be some truth. But value is valuable when it’s widespread, not just in a couple places. Unless this person has some secret info from God that he along gives to mankind. And I highly doubt that.

I don’t know why this book is so important?
You brought up the tabernacle and Christ the other day and I said Epps book was good on that specific topic.
 
The thread has been proven . If you understood the Trinity you would agree :)
If I understood the trinity, I would agree?
Well I’m like the rest of mankind, I can only understand so much, God’s ways are not our ways. If you claim you have perfect understanding of the Trinity, I feel sorry for you, your deceived.

Becides that, what makes you so sure you have a better understanding and therefore your correct? And I’m wrong?
Isn’t that your opinion?
Do you have a better understanding of all the theologians through the centuries on the Trinity?

Civic, we need to be sensible with these things. ?
 
If I understood the trinity, I would agree?
Well I’m like the rest of mankind, I can only understand so much, God’s ways are not our ways. If you claim you have perfect understanding of the Trinity, I feel sorry for you, your deceived.

Becides that, what makes you so sure you have a better understanding and therefore your correct? And I’m wrong?
Isn’t that your opinion?
Do you have a better understanding of all the theologians through the centuries on the Trinity?

Civic, we need to be sensible with these things. ?
The OP :)

Have you studied the attributes of God, read a theological book on them ?

If so can you tell me which ones ?
 
You brought up the tabernacle and Christ the other day and I said Epps book was good on that specific topic.
Yes you did.

I just expressed what I thought about it and why. No disrespect meant. I believe it’s misleading coming from a Mennonite.

I wouldn’t read a JW on it either, of course that’s extreme. But my point is, it would be misleading
 
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The OP :)

Have you studied the attributes of God, read a theological book on them ?

If so can you tell me which ones ?
Haven’t we all? After study and testing to scripture we get a good understanding. I haven’t read any according to the Mennonite’s.

Do you want to debate me on the Trinity?
We’re in the wrong thread for that.
Besides I think we would agree on much, unless you got your info from a Mennonite?

But I will not claim I know it all about the trinity, nor can you.
And I don’t really care who knows more about it.

It’s not about who knows more
 
Haven’t we all? After study and testing to scripture we get a good understanding. I haven’t read any according to the Mennonite’s.

Do you want to debate me on the Trinity?
We’re in the wrong thread for that.
Besides I think we would agree on much, unless you got your info from a Mennonite?

But I will not claim I know it all about the trinity, nor can you.
And I don’t really care who knows more about it.

It’s not about who knows more
Let me know what books you have read and studied on the Trinity and we can discuss them . It should be an easy one for you to answer .

hope this helps !!!
 
Let me know what books you have read and studied on the Trinity and we can discuss them . It should be an easy one for you to answer .

hope this helps !!!
If I get to the point I want to discuss the Trinity, I will surely call on you. Not to debate, but hopefully to learn more.

But this is a different thread,

Think for a moment civic what got you going here.
You recommended a book on the tabernacle etc…
I, knowing he’s a Mennonite said, read it with discernment.
Is there really something wrong with what I said?

Would you recommend someone who was about to read the institutes that they read it with discernment if you were recommending what your convictions were, as you basically agree with Calvinism about the 5 points? Even though you gave the impression you didn’t agree with much more.
 
Haven’t we all? After study and testing to scripture we get a good understanding. I haven’t read any according to the Mennonite’s.

Do you want to debate me on the Trinity?
We’re in the wrong thread for that.
Besides I think we would agree on much, unless you got your info from a Mennonite?

But I will not claim I know it all about the trinity, nor can you.
And I don’t really care who knows more about it.

It’s not about who knows more
It’s about truth period
 
So are you going to share which books on the Trinity you have studied?
Here's a good one

What Is the Trinity?
R.C. Sproul

Here's the beginning of chapter 1


The concept of the Trinity has emerged as a touchstone of truth, a non-negotiable article of Christian orthodoxy. However, it has been a source of controversy throughout church history, and there remains much confusion about it to this day, with many people misunderstanding it in very serious ways.
Some people think that the doctrine of the Trinity means that Christians believe in three gods. This is the idea of tritheism, which the church has categorically rejected throughout its history. Others see the Trinity as the church’s retreat into contradiction. For instance, I once had a conversation with a man who had a PhD in philosophy, and he objected to Christianity on the grounds that the doctrine of the Trinity represented a manifest contradiction—the idea that one can also be three—at the heart of the Christian faith. Apparently this professor of philosophy was not familiar with the law of non-contradiction. That law states, “A cannot be A and non-A at the same time and in the same relationship.” When we confess our faith in the Trinity, we affirm that God is one in essence and three in person. Thus, God is one in A and three in B. If we said that He is one in essence and three in essence, that would be a contradiction. If we said He is one in person and three in person, that also would be a contradiction. But as mysterious as the Trinity is, perhaps even above and beyond our capacity to understand it in its fullness, the historic formula is not a contradiction.
Before we can talk about the Trinity, we have to talk about unity, because the word Trinity means “tri-unity.” Behind the concept of unity is the biblical affirmation of monotheism. The prefix mono means “one or single,” while the root word theism has to do with God. So, monotheism conveys the idea that there is only one God.
 
So are you going to share which books on the Trinity you have studied?
What’s the point civic? to see who knows more?

I haven’t read that many on the Trinity. But what I have read not only confirmed what I believed but shed more light on it. There is so much on the Trinity in scripture that it’s obvious.

If your suggesting the trinity proves penal substitution wrong, your misled. If your saying the cross and wrath of God on the son dis-unites the Trinity, then I my opinion, you don’t understand the cross.
 
@civic. You said your done here for now until you can read through that book again.

See, this is one thing that upsets me greatly.
We’re not debating with the Mennonite, it’s not his thread.
Are you saying you don’t really know anything about the tabernacle and types and shadows of Christ?
If so, thats ok. Just admit it.

You must remember something of your studies in scripture ?
If not, then you shouldn’t close the door on the Penal Substitution.

Your giving up on an essential doctrine because of someone’s opinions without testing it to scripture? ?

Just sayin
 
What’s the point civic? to see who knows more?

I haven’t read that many on the Trinity. But what I have read not only confirmed what I believed but shed more light on it. There is so much on the Trinity in scripture that it’s obvious.

If your suggesting the trinity proves penal substitution wrong, your misled. If your saying the cross and wrath of God on the son dis-unites the Trinity, then I my opinion, you don’t understand the cross.
Don't involve yourself in the juvenile game of one-upmanship bro.
 
The three members of the Trinity are inseparable yet distinguishable.

I've learned in studying this thread out that the idea of the inseparability of the persons takes us to a principle known as inseparable operation. As Augustine of Hippo put it, ‘the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit, as they are indivisible, so [they] work indivisibly’.

The principle of inseparable operation highlights that the persons of the Trinity do not act without each other any more than they can exist without each other.

Here's a look at how their inseparable operation and their mutual indwelling works. As Jesus explains in John 14:10: ‘Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work.’

That shows us that our salvation is the work of the triune God, not an action done by one of the persons of the Trinity acting independently such as an angry God pouring out his wrath on another member of the Trinity. Much less by one person acting against the others. If the principle of inseparable operation did not hold, there would be no guarantee that the saving work of the individual persons would be effective. So that leaves the possibility of Trinity being divided off the table if in fact God's wrath was poured out on Jesus.​
 
What’s the point civic? to see who knows more?

I haven’t read that many on the Trinity. But what I have read not only confirmed what I believed but shed more light on it. There is so much on the Trinity in scripture that it’s obvious.

If your suggesting the trinity proves penal substitution wrong, your misled. If your saying the cross and wrath of God on the son dis-unites the Trinity, then I my opinion, you don’t understand the cross.
So you haven’t studied the Trinity at any depth , read any theological treatise and you want to debate me on that is what you are telling me correct ?
 
Don't involve yourself in the juvenile game of one-upmanship bro.
That's good advice I don't think it's a good idea to take any of these posts personal

By this we know love, because he laid down his life for us. And we also ought to lay down our lives for our brother and. But whoever has this world's goods, and sees his brother in need, and shuts up his heart from him, how does the love of God abide in him? 1 John 3:16-17

Being kindhearted to one another is something we all need.
 
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