Was Paul the Thirteenth Apostle of Jesus?

It was the apostles led by Peter, not Paul, who were to preach the gospel to the Gentiles.

I was merely pointing out that Paul was a Roman citizen. Doesn't matter who lead what, as long as the gospel is preached whether Jews or gentiles.

Paul merely appointed himself as an apostle to the gentiles but his apostleship wasn't recognized by the official apostles.

Not so.

It was the Lord who appointed him, who else? Why on earth would he call himself an apostle? For the prestige? For fame and honor? Hardly not. Otherwise, you would make him to be a liar, pretending to be an apostle. It's also contradictory that he himself warned about false apostles masquerading as an apostle of Christ. He even said that he is the least of all apostles because he persecuted the Church.,

2 Tim 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,

1 Cor 1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and our brother Sosthenes,

Not sure why the fuss about Paul being an apostle or not. It is the will of God that he is an apostle.

If you don't believe Paul, then to you he is a liar and a false apostle. You shouldn't really listen to him but tear up that portion of the New Testament where he preached, right? Problem solved.
 

As the author of 13 of the 27 books in the New Testament, Paul is arguably the most influential apostle in Christianity. Interestingly, Paul never met Jesus when the latter lived on earth. He also has a history of viciously persecuting the followers of Jesus. It was only after an alleged encounter with Jesus during a journey that Paul changed his ways and started proclaiming himself as an apostle of Jesus. Whether or not Paul was speaking the truth is a separate matter and will be addressed in later videos, God willing. But in this video we will examine if it was even possible for there to be a 13th apostle.

According to the gospel account, there were 12 apostles. After Judas killed himself, 2 candidates were shortlisted to be the replacement for Judas. They were Matthias and Barsabbas. Peter prayed and cast lots. The lot fell on Matthias, who then joined the disciples. This account appears in Acts 1:12-26. Note that the number of Apostles was fixed at 12. Peter did not enlist both Matthias and Barsabbas because there was no room for a 13th apostle.

Peter’s criteria for selecting an apostle was that candidates had to have been with them since the time Jesus was baptised.

"Therefore it is necessary to choose one of the men who have been with us the whole time the Lord Jesus was living among us, beginning from John’s baptism to the time when Jesus was taken up from us. For one of these must become a witness with us of his resurrection” (Acts 1:20-22)

Thus, the criteria that an apostle candidate had to meet was that he should have been with the apostles from the time of the baptism of Jesus until the time of Jesus' ascension. Peter was simply following what he heard from Jesus. In John 15, Jesus said the following:

He said to them: “You also will bear witness, because you have been with me from the beginning” (John 15:27)

Furthermore, Jesus said there are only 12 apostles.

“Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of his glory, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel” (Matthew 19:28)

The book of Revelation also says there are only 12 apostles.

“And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God… The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb” (Revelation 21:10, 14)

As we have seen, twelve thrones, twelve tribes, twelve foundations and twelve apostles. The number of apostles was fixed at 12.

If Paul was indeed a true apostle, then there would have been 13 thrones and 13 foundations with the names of the 13 apostles (that is, the original 11, Matthias and Paul). We have no reason to think Paul was among the 12, as Judas was replaced by Matthias long before Paul’s conversion. If it was even possible for there to be a 13th apostle, Peter would have selected both Matthias and Barsabbas instead of drawing lots to choose one of them.

Since there could have only been 12 apostles, Paul simply could not have been an apostle.

Ok.
What do you think the work of the apostle is?
 
Jesus doesn't make any mention of a 13th apostle.

Jesus gave the disciples the task of preaching to all creation (so that includes Jews and Gentiles).

He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. (Mark 16:15)

Also, Peter was the apostle to the Gentiles.

“After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: ‘Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe'” (Acts 15:7)

Paul shows up out of nowhere and declares himself an apostle to the gentiles.

Acts 15:7 refers only to the Gentiles Peter spoke to in Acts 10, not that Peter is to be an apostle to the Gentiles, but he opened the mission. Because in Acts 15:8 refers to them in the past tense
 
Was Paul the thirteenth apostle?
No.

Acts 1 tells us Matthias was the thirteenth. He was picked to replace the lost apostle Judas. Matthias became the twelfth witness to Christ.

However, the more whole-scripture response is that there about two dozen people mentioned in the New Testament as apostles and the one chronologically following Matthias is not Paul, but Barnabas. It was Barnabas who brought Saul to the council of apostles (Acts 9). Luke calls both Barnabas and Paul apostles (Acts 14:14).

And if anyone wants to split hairs over this then it should be recognized Jesus is the first apostle according to the author of Hebrews :unsure:!

Hebrews 3:1
Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly calling, consider Jesus, the Apostle and High Priest of our confession...

So...... if we count Jesus as the first then the last of the twelve he picked was actually the thirteenth, as was the person who replaced the one that was lost. Chronologically, it appears Matthew, the tax collector, was the last one chosen. But.... since Judas was always going to be the one to betray him and was from the beginning, the "son of perdition," we have reason to understand he was never going to be any kind of a messenger of Christ for any longer than a season.

Furthermore, the word "apostle" simple means "messenger" or "envoy" (G652). There were lots of messengers of Christ and there remain many more than twelve or thirteen.


As far as that YouTube video goes, none of what I just posted was mentioned.

Legalism kills.
 

As the author of 13 of the 27 books in the New Testament, Paul is arguably the most influential apostle in Christianity. Interestingly, Paul never met Jesus when the latter lived on earth. He also has a history of viciously persecuting the followers of Jesus. It was only after an alleged encounter with Jesus during a journey that Paul changed his ways and started proclaiming himself as an apostle of Jesus. Whether or not Paul was speaking the truth is a separate matter and will be addressed in later videos, God willing. But in this video we will examine if it was even possible for there to be a 13th apostle.

According to the gospel account, there were 12 apostles. After Judas killed himself, 2 candidates were shortlisted to be the replacement for Judas. They were Matthias and Barsabbas. Peter prayed and cast lots. The lot fell on Matthias, who then joined the disciples. This account appears in Acts 1:12-26. Note that the number of Apostles was fixed at 12. Peter did not enlist both Matthias and Barsabbas because there was no room for a 13th apostle.

Peter’s criteria for selecting an apostle was that candidates had to have been with them since the time Jesus was baptised.

"Therefore it is necessary to choose one of the men who have been with us the whole time the Lord Jesus was living among us, beginning from John’s baptism to the time when Jesus was taken up from us. For one of these must become a witness with us of his resurrection” (Acts 1:20-22)

Thus, the criteria that an apostle candidate had to meet was that he should have been with the apostles from the time of the baptism of Jesus until the time of Jesus' ascension. Peter was simply following what he heard from Jesus. In John 15, Jesus said the following:

He said to them: “You also will bear witness, because you have been with me from the beginning” (John 15:27)

Furthermore, Jesus said there are only 12 apostles.

“Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of his glory, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel” (Matthew 19:28)

The book of Revelation also says there are only 12 apostles.

“And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God… The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb” (Revelation 21:10, 14)

As we have seen, twelve thrones, twelve tribes, twelve foundations and twelve apostles. The number of apostles was fixed at 12.

If Paul was indeed a true apostle, then there would have been 13 thrones and 13 foundations with the names of the 13 apostles (that is, the original 11, Matthias and Paul). We have no reason to think Paul was among the 12, as Judas was replaced by Matthias long before Paul’s conversion. If it was even possible for there to be a 13th apostle, Peter would have selected both Matthias and Barsabbas instead of drawing lots to choose one of them.

Since there could have only been 12 apostles, Paul simply could not have been an apostle.
I agree with you. The anointed Apostles of Christ never once referred to Paul as an Apostle. While Paul self-identified as one. The Apostles only referred to Paul as brother. Which is a term applicable to all males in Christ among one another. As is the term, sister, the endearing term among women.
 
His 144k are the apostles of these end times today

along with Paul and His ones in early Christianity and the prophets in the OT
 
His 144k are the apostles of these end times today

along with Paul and His ones in early Christianity and the prophets in the OT
The end of a man is when he dies to his old self in his old ways of thinking about a god and actually receive from the God of Heaven, which simply is Love, to be like Him instead of that old man who has to die if you are to be of the God of heaven.

And His kingdom doesnt come with observation, it is within you. Luke 17:20-21. But sense most seek a different kingdom to come and is waiting for that change, will go to the graven never receiving that promise of His kingdom that does come to all who will die that death.

The message in the cross is death to that flesh man who spawns beliefs systems, and the resurrection of that spirit man who is not of in the carnality of flesh, and become like Him instead where we are His temple, His kingdom the place God resides.

You are waiting for something that you could receive this day.
 
His 144k are the apostles of these end times today

along with Paul and His ones in early Christianity and the prophets in the OT
every soul of His having an attribute (see, talents)
has a job on this earth...
but the main thing is,
that His Souls hear Him and listen,
unlike the ancient fathers who did not hear or listen or obey and went into the assyrian captivity

whereas the prophets and His souls since Eden fell
are humble and can hear Him...

all his prophets and apostles and souls hear Him
and as such can say His context and see what are the true words
mixed in with the bad by this world...whose evil goal was always to confuse His Words to us
...example all the corruptions in scripture based on versions given by the same
judaizing pharisees whose only goal is to continue the assyrian captivity.
 
the obsession with, a fetish really,
about the exact number of apostles ,
is esau's attempt to again,
focus souls on a non-topic
 
this is the same Rome has been doing,
frantically and constantly,
ever since the early church.

its called divide and conquer
and its run by the same evil pharisee types
who murdered Jesus
 
Yes, I am aware that Paul called himself an apostle, and that he begins most of his letters calling himself an apostle. But those are just claims. It doesn't prove Paul was indeed an apostle.

Besides, as outlined in the OP, Jesus and the book of Revelation teach there were only 12 apostles. So there's no room in the apostle department for a 13th apostle, i.e., Paul.
The issue of your thread is not whether Paul was an apostle or not but to state that the full bible is not true for saying that Paul is speaking claims rather than speaking from the Holy Spirit is to call into question the bible itself. Nevertheless the difference between the bible and all other books is that it is living:

"For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart" (Heb. 4:12).

But if you believe only parts of the bible are accurate then anything came become a inaccurate or wrong.

If you believe Paul did not have authority by God and thus are calling into question things he has written, what are you challenging in Paul's writings?

Are you also calling into question the old testament which Jesus is the fulfillment of? How about the New Testament book written by his other Apostles?
 
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Yes, I am aware that Paul called himself an apostle, and that he begins most of his letters calling himself an apostle. But those are just claims. It doesn't prove Paul was indeed an apostle.

Besides, as outlined in the OP, Jesus and the book of Revelation teach there were only 12 apostles. So there's no room in the apostle department for a 13th apostle, i.e., Paul.
Paul was an Apostle but when scripture refers to the 12 it doesn’t include him . He was just as much an Apostle that was picked by Jesus personally as the rest .

hope this helps !!!
 
Yes, I am aware that Paul called himself an apostle, and that he begins most of his letters calling himself an apostle. But those are just claims. It doesn't prove Paul was indeed an apostle.

Besides, as outlined in the OP, Jesus and the book of Revelation teach there were only 12 apostles. So there's no room in the apostle department for a 13th apostle, i.e., Paul.
The proof of the authority of Paul is God himself. If God did not want Paul's claims or if He believed there was error then He would have made sure it was not in the bible.

John, one of the Apostles inspired by the only true and living God, wrote in the gospel of John:

"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life,[a] and the life was the light of men" (John 1:1-3).

"Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever nfollows me will not owalk in darkness, but will have the light of life" (John 8:12).

God would not allow his Word to be tarnished, imperfect, or tainted by false claims.:)
 
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