Was Paul the Thirteenth Apostle of Jesus?

beliefs are not relevant and are not the criteria and are not what i was referring to.

here was what i said:
you have no understanding who I am or what I do or what I have received.
And my reply was -- sure I know, you have openly told us your beliefs for your god and your eden, just as I have told you the reality of God coming and putting us in His kingdom that is within me that is not a belief at all but reality in the manifestation of Him reveals in real time, not some future beliefs fo a god to come someday and set you sin His Eden. He was very clear the kingdom fo God doesnt come with observation as you are seeking, but is within you. This is the One that you do not believe that He will come to you and be in you that you be the temple of God.
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And my reply was -- sure I know, you have openly told us your beliefs for your god and your eden, just as I have told you the reality of God coming and putting us in His kingdom that is within me that is not a belief at all but reality in the manifestation of Him reveals in real time, not some future beliefs fo a god to come someday and set you sin His Eden. He was very clear the kingdom fo God doesnt come with observation as you are seeking, but is within you. This is the One that you do not believe that He will come to you and be in you that you be the temple of God.
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your reply has nothing to do with what i said and is completely off.
 
Yes, I am aware that Paul called himself an apostle, and that he begins most of his letters calling himself an apostle. But those are just claims. It doesn't prove Paul was indeed an apostle.

Besides, as outlined in the OP, Jesus and the book of Revelation teach there were only 12 apostles. So there's no room in the apostle department for a 13th apostle, i.e., Paul.
The Word of God calls Paul an apostle, so Paul was an apostle.
 
Yes, I am aware that Paul called himself an apostle, and that he begins most of his letters calling himself an apostle. But those are just claims. It doesn't prove Paul was indeed an apostle.

Besides, as outlined in the OP, Jesus and the book of Revelation teach there were only 12 apostles. So there's no room in the apostle department for a 13th apostle, i.e., Paul.
So, God entrusted almost 80% of the NT letters to a liar?

Judas never made it to becoming an apostle of the Church. He committed suicide before the church age began.

And, Matthias was not truly an apostle. For Peter got his impulsive notion to vote the "gift" in before the Church age began.

Just try it..... Vote between two people in your church to determine who is going to be your next pastor.

The spiritual "gift" is not granted via human voting!

There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit distributes them.
There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. There are different
kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work.
Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.
To one there is given through the Spirit a message of wisdom, to another a message
of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, to another faith by the same Spirit, to another
gifts of healing by that one Spirit, to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to
another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,
and to still another the interpretation of tongues. All these are the work of one and the
same Spirit, and he distributes them to each one, just as he determines."

1 Corinthians 12:4-11


Peter was not yet a new creation in Christ until the baptism of the Spirit at Pentecost when he got the impulse to replace Judas. Peter also never said that God instructed them to vote on such a matter.. Remember! Peter by nature was very impulsive. For it was Peter who the Lord rebuked by calling him "Satan" after Peter expressed his "good intentions" for the Lord. Peter is like some of us. We are to learn from his mistakes, not canonize them.
 

As the author of 13 of the 27 books in the New Testament, Paul is arguably the most influential apostle in Christianity. Interestingly, Paul never met Jesus when the latter lived on earth. He also has a history of viciously persecuting the followers of Jesus. It was only after an alleged encounter with Jesus during a journey that Paul changed his ways and started proclaiming himself as an apostle of Jesus. Whether or not Paul was speaking the truth is a separate matter and will be addressed in later videos, God willing. But in this video we will examine if it was even possible for there to be a 13th apostle.

According to the gospel account, there were 12 apostles. After Judas killed himself, 2 candidates were shortlisted to be the replacement for Judas. They were Matthias and Barsabbas. Peter prayed and cast lots. The lot fell on Matthias, who then joined the disciples. This account appears in Acts 1:12-26. Note that the number of Apostles was fixed at 12. Peter did not enlist both Matthias and Barsabbas because there was no room for a 13th apostle.

Peter’s criteria for selecting an apostle was that candidates had to have been with them since the time Jesus was baptised.

"Therefore it is necessary to choose one of the men who have been with us the whole time the Lord Jesus was living among us, beginning from John’s baptism to the time when Jesus was taken up from us. For one of these must become a witness with us of his resurrection” (Acts 1:20-22)

Thus, the criteria that an apostle candidate had to meet was that he should have been with the apostles from the time of the baptism of Jesus until the time of Jesus' ascension. Peter was simply following what he heard from Jesus. In John 15, Jesus said the following:

He said to them: “You also will bear witness, because you have been with me from the beginning” (John 15:27)

Furthermore, Jesus said there are only 12 apostles.

“Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of his glory, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel” (Matthew 19:28)

The book of Revelation also says there are only 12 apostles.

“And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God… The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb” (Revelation 21:10, 14)

As we have seen, twelve thrones, twelve tribes, twelve foundations and twelve apostles. The number of apostles was fixed at 12.

If Paul was indeed a true apostle, then there would have been 13 thrones and 13 foundations with the names of the 13 apostles (that is, the original 11, Matthias and Paul). We have no reason to think Paul was among the 12, as Judas was replaced by Matthias long before Paul’s conversion. If it was even possible for there to be a 13th apostle, Peter would have selected both Matthias and Barsabbas instead of drawing lots to choose one of them.

Since there could have only been 12 apostles, Paul simply could not have been an apostle.
Explain 1 Cor 12:28. Eph 4:11
 
Paul had his own doctrine for his own way for his god.

So did Jesus and they are not the same teachings.
Just another Paul Hater, then. I don't find Paul, and Jesus contradictory when considered in context. You can believe whatever you please.
 
Just another Paul Hater, then. I don't find Paul, and Jesus contradictory when considered in context. You can believe whatever you please.
Oh no' just another who loves the way of Jesus to be in the Father for myself.

I dont hate Paul at all, he had his own religion, it just wasn't the perfections of God who makes us His anointed no different from the way of Jesus at all. Paul is the way for a religious mind. Jesus is the way for a Spiritual mind.

I dont hate Paul nor those who follow Paul at all. I do understand their ways of Paul instead of Jesus and Jesus understood as well those who were not like him but is of sin instead.

Jesus is the way for me, not Paul. If Paul is your way then you are Pauline not Christian. I just happen top be of Christ, anointed of God not anointed of Paul.

But I do understand that you dont see the difference between Paul who teaches he is a sinner from Jesus who teaches to be without sin. perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect.

Paul as a sinner is your way, but for myself Jesus to be without sin is the better way for me.

But I do see a hate for me who is of Christ as Jesus was of Christ anointed of God myself as He demands of us if we are to be His child, His son.
 
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Yes, I am aware that Paul called himself an apostle, and that he begins most of his letters calling himself an apostle. But those are just claims. It doesn't prove Paul was indeed an apostle.

Besides, as outlined in the OP, Jesus and the book of Revelation teach there were only 12 apostles. So there's no room in the apostle department for a 13th apostle, i.e., Paul.
so then you do you claim he Paul, was preaching to us about then ? Himself or The Messiah Yeshua ? Apostle means an emissary .. How and in what way does Paul negate Salvation and or the crucifixion ?

NB:
Paul described himself as set apart for the gospel of God and called to be an apostle and a servant of Yeshua the Messiah. Jesus Christ had revealed Himself to Paul, just as He had appeared to Peter, to James, to the Twelve, after his Resurrection.

Phl 3:3 For it is we who are the Circumcised, we who worship by the Spirit of God and make our boast in the Messiah Yeshua! We do not put confidence in human qualifications,
4 even though I certainly have grounds for putting confidence in such things. If anyone else thinks he has grounds for putting confidence in human qualifications, I have better grounds:
5 b'rit-milah on the eighth day, by birth belonging to the people of Isra'el, from the tribe of Binyamin, a Hebrew-speaker, with Hebrew-speaking parents, in regard to the Torah, a Parush,
6 in regard to zeal, a persecutor of the Messianic Community, in regard to the righteousness demanded by legalism, blameless.
 
Oh no' just another who loves the way of Jesus to be in the Father for myself.

I dont hate Paul at all, he had his own religion, it just wasn't the perfections of God who makes us His anointed no different from the way of Jesus at all. Paul is the way for a religious mind. Jesus is the way for a Spiritual mind.

I dont hate Paul nor those who follow Paul at all. I do understand their ways of Paul instead of Jesus and Jesus understood as well those who were not like him but is of sin instead.

Jesus is the way for me, not Paul. If Paul is your way then you are Pauline not Christian. I just happen top be of Christ, anointed of God not anointed of Paul.

But I do understand that you dont see the difference between Paul who teaches he is a sinner from Jesus who teaches to be without sin. perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect.

Paul as a sinner is your way, but for myself Jesus to be without sin is the better way for me.

But I do see a hate for me who is of Christ as Jesus was of Christ anointed of God myself as He demands of us if we are to be His child, His son.
So - As I said, Just another "Paul Hater", and apparently a "Sinless one" as well.
 
So - As I said, Just another "Paul Hater", and apparently a "Sinless one" as well.
So -- as I said, I love Paul, he just had a different gospel from the one Jesus presented. I hate no man, but there are a few who hate me for the same reason they hated Jesus, for we have the same Father. Jesus was my brother.

But you are correct in the sinless part. We who are born of God, born again to be like Him cannot sin, impossible to be in sin because I am born of God. See 1 John 3:9. And read 1 John 3, when you see Him as He is ye shall be like Him as well. I saw!

Im assuming by your comment that you are a sinner? If so read 1 John 3:8, it tells clearly who you are of.
 
So -- as I said, I love Paul, he just had a different gospel from the one Jesus presented. I hate no man, but there are a few who hate me for the same reason they hated Jesus, for we have the same Father. Jesus was my brother.

But you are correct in the sinless part. We who are born of God, born again to be like Him cannot sin, impossible to be in sin because I am born of God. See 1 John 3:9. And read 1 John 3, when you see Him as He is ye shall be like Him as well. I saw!

Im assuming by your comment that you are a sinner? If so read 1 John 3:8, it tells clearly who you are of.
CHuckle!!
 
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