The conundrum of faith and the Calvinist

Joe

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To the Calvinist faith is a gift of God otherwise the claim is it is a work of man, and yet it takes a man to put faith to use, so it ends up being a work of man because it is the person's faith not God's and God does not believe for man. And faith takes a person's will to put it into effect, so man is actively involved in the mental act of the decision to repent and believe.

How do Calvinist reconcile this obvious issue within their thinking?

God bless
 
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To the Calvinist faith is a gift of God otherwise the claim is it is a work of man,
I don't know enough about Calvinism to know for a certainty that this is the case, but it sounds about right.
and yet it takes a man to put faith to use,
And that man is Christ Jesus.
so it ends up being a work of man because it is the person's faith not God's
Christ would disagree as he points out that it is the father who does the work. Why would it be any different with anyone else?
and God does not believe for man.
God believes what he creates, and when he creates man it is God who makes it happen because of his own sovereign will.
And faith takes a person's will to put it into effect,
It is the will of the father by the power of the holy spirit in, with, and through Christ.
so man is actively involved in the mental act of the decision to repent and believe.
Man is dead in sins, and the dead know nothing.
Man cannot save himself,
Agreed.
but can believe to be saved.
Man can only believe what he sees and he will only believe he is saved when he sees that he is saved, and that revelation can only come from God..
 
To the Calvinist faith is a gift of God otherwise the claim is it is a work of man, and yet it takes a man to put faith to use, so it ends up being a work of man because it is the person's faith not God's and God does not believe for man.
Okay. You battle with Calvinists here almost every day and you don’t know the answer to this? Yet you judge calvinists? 🤔
And faith takes a person's will to put it into effect, so man is actively involved in the mental act of the decision to repent and believe.
Calvinists don’t deny this. Just a few things of how your explain it is in error.
How do Calvinist reconcile this obvious issue within their thinking?

God bless
That’s an easy one, but there’s no issue.
I think we been giving you the answer for quite some time now. You still don’t understand it?
 
To the Calvinist faith is a gift of God otherwise the claim is it is a work of man, and yet it takes a man to put faith to use, so it ends up being a work of man because it is the person's faith not God's and God does not believe for man.

Calvinism does NOT teach that man has to take an extra step and "put faith to use".
God gives man an ACTIVE faith.
But that doesn't mean that "God belivese for man", it means that man believes for himself from his own faith that God gave him.


How do Calvinist reconcile this obvious issue within their thinking?

We don't start with the straw-man.
So there is nothing to have to "address".
 
We do not have faith in our faith.

We have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and His work. Faith does not save anyone, Jesus blood did.
If this were true hell would be empty. If faith wasn’t necessary grace would be available to everyone, which contradicts Ephesians 2:8,9, which says saved by grace through faith.
 
Calvinism does NOT teach that man has to take an extra step and "put faith to use".
God gives man an ACTIVE faith.
But that doesn't mean that "God belivese for man", it means that man believes for himself from his own faith that God gave him.

What? You didn't have to put faith to use? Explain that please. Everyone has to have/place/put faith in Christ to be saved. That requires a work of man because he must put it to use by the mental act of decision to repent and believe. While in your thinking that God gives active faith, you still must put it to use. You must repent and believe. Cannot run around it and be true to the Word. You even stated, "it means that man believes for himself from his own faith that God gave him". So, man must do something, and that something is put into use the faith that God gave him.

So how do you avoid the issue that it is not a work of man since you must repent and believe in Christ, even though it is from faith God gave you?


We don't start with the straw-man.
So there is nothing to have to "address".
Yeah, I found that accusation to be the MO of some people. We shall see.
 
If this were true hell would be empty. If faith wasn’t necessary grace would be available to everyone, which contradicts Ephesians 2:8,9, which says saved by grace through faith.
Jesus died for His people. No one else. Those people will be born again and come to faith and repentance. Hell is for those who God has left in darkness. In unbelief.

You believe your decision is what made salvation effectual, it seems.
 
Jesus died for His people. No one else. Those people will be born again and come to faith and repentance. Hell is for those who God has left in darkness. In unbelief.

You believe your decision is what made salvation effectual, it seems.
Yes Jesus died for “whosoever” believes.John 3:16 where did you get your belief about God from Disney world ? The scripture does not portray God as you think what scripture actually says about God is:
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2Pe 3:9 - The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is long suffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.and:
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Isa 1:18 - Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD:though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
 
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Okay. You battle with Calvinists here almost every day and you don’t know the answer to this? Yet you judge calvinists? 🤔
Nope, I don't recall seeing it answered. So please do. And we are to judge everything brother. I don't judge my brothers, but I sure do judge the invention of a man from the 1500's that entrapped them!

Calvinists don’t deny this. Just a few things of how your explain it is in error.
Ok, please correct the error. Who knows you may convince me.


That’s an easy one, but there’s no issue.
I think we been giving you the answer for quite some time now. You still don’t understand it?
Oh, I understand alright. Perhaps it is you who does not! :)
 
Yes Jesus died for “whosoever” believes.John 3:16 where did you get your belief about God from Disney world ? The scripture does not portray God as you think what scripture actually says about God is:
Unchecked Copy Box
2Pe 3:9 - The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is long suffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.and:
Unchecked Copy Box
Isa 1:18 - Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD:though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
Matthew 1:21 KJV

But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.
Psalm 115:3 KJV

For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Romans 9:15‭-‬16 KJV

What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Romans 9:22‭-‬23 KJV
 
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
Matthew 1:21 KJV

But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.
Psalm 115:3 KJV

For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Romans 9:15‭-‬16 KJV

What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Romans 9:22‭-‬23 KJV
So you completely ignore 2 Peter 3:9 ,John3:16, and Isa. 1:18 to keep your one sided view of God. God leaves no one in darkness who seeks light provide one verse that says He does if you can. Jesus said they will not come to the light (Holy Spirit) because they LOVED the darkness more than the light that isn’t God keeping them in darkness they are keeping themselves in darkness rejecting the light according to scripture.
 
So you completely ignore 2 Peter 3:9 ,John3:16, and Isa. 1:18 to keep your one sided view of God. God leaves no one in darkness who seeks light provide one verse that says He does if you can. Jesus said they will not come to the light (Holy Spirit) because they LOVED the darkness more than the light that isn’t God keeping them in darkness they are keeping themselves in darkness rejecting the light according to scripture.
And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
John 3:19 KJV

We can stay in John if you'd like.
 
And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
John 3:19 KJV

We can stay in John if you'd like.
That does NOT say that God kept them in darkness it literally says they keep themself in darkness by loving darkness more than light.
 
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We do not have faith in our faith.
Well, that's good!
We have faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and His work
That's good too!
Faith does not save anyone, Jesus blood did.
Remember, I stated this before to you, "You are justified by believing Jesus justified you by His death."

You cannot be saved unless Jesus's death justified you on your behalf, and you cannot be saved unless you believe it!.

God bless
 
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