The Value of Evangelism in Reform Theology

[brightfame52]

As does Heb 2:9 see below

Your problem is that verse does not say he layed down his life for the sheep only

Paul stated Christ gave himself for him

would you conclude that he died for Paul only

Heb. 2:9 —KJV
“But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.”

As does Heb 2:9 see below

Your problem is that verse does not say he layed down his life for the sheep only

Paul stated Christ gave himself for him

would you conclude that he died for Paul only

Heb. 2:9 —KJV
“But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.”

He died for the Sheep

 

[TomFL]

He died for the Sheep

He died for all, the world, every man

John 6:51 (KJV 1900)
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

2 Corinthians 5:14–15 (KJV 1900)
14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: 15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Hebrews 2:9 (KJV 1900)
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

 

[JDS]

Your problem is that verse does not say he layed down his life for the sheep only

Paul stated Christ gave himself for him

would you conclude that he died for Paul only

Heb. 2:9 —KJV
“But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.”

Calvinists takes pride in being one of the favored of God and they come across to me as being glad that most people cannot be saved. I would like to be wrong about this but I have read what these Calvinists have written for a few years now and I do not think I am. Misrepresenting who the sheep are in John 10 and 1 and 2 Peter is never going to help but just energize them into more error. It is best to believe what words say.

Peter did not think the sheep were gentiles and if he did, as you seem to think, he was as confused as a termite in a yo-yo, because he said the following.

1 Peter 1;1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Gentiles in their own lands are not strangers. Israelites scattered into gentile lands are strangers. These strangers have been there since 722 BC.

Now, notice what he says here to these strangers in gentile lands here:


Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

Of course conversation means life style.

Here is another instruction:

1 Peter 4:3
For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries:

....and what about this?


But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Now, the church is not revealed to us as a nation. Peter is not addressing these strangers as the church but as a people. This is the northern nation that was scattered out of their land and those whom Jesus Christ said he was going to seek and save at his first coming. Peter and the other 11 apostles was charged with this task in the name of Jesus Christ.

Ga 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles)
9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.

After reading this I am not surprised that Peter and the other apostles wrote their letters to people of Israel. Are you? These letters were written in the 60's and they are still sheep because they are still of the family of Israel. However, they were children of God if they are born again.


1 Pet 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

Read about what God is doing for the northern kingdom of Israel in Rom 9 and Hosea 1. He had promised to visit them and call them the children of the living God, which, BTW, requires a birth.

We are back to the flock being those of Israel and not gentiles:

1 Peter 5:2
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;

1 Peter 5:3
Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being examples to the flock.

Still speaking to the strangers in the north.

The scriptures are logical and reasonable and life giving if one just simply believes the words and leaves off the editorializing.

 

[guest1]

Calvinists takes pride in being one of the favored of God and they come across to me as being glad that most people cannot be saved. I would like to be wrong about this but I have read what these Calvinists have written for a few years now and I do not think I am. Misrepresenting who the sheep are in John 10 and 1 and 2 Peter is never going to help but just energize them into more error. It is best to believe what words say.

Peter did not think the sheep were gentiles and if he did, as you seem to think, he was as confused as a termite in a yo-yo, because he said the following.

1 Peter 1;1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Gentiles in their own lands are not strangers. Israelites scattered into gentile lands are strangers. These strangers have been there since 722 BC.

Now, notice what he says here to these strangers in gentile lands here:


Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

Of course conversation means life style.

Here is another instruction:

1 Peter 4:3
For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries:

....and what about this?


But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Now, the church is not revealed to us as a nation. Peter is not addressing these strangers as the church but as a people. This is the northern nation that was scattered out of their land and those whom Jesus Christ said he was going to seek and save at his first coming. Peter and the other 11 apostles was charged with this task in the name of Jesus Christ.

Ga 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles)
9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.

After reading this I am not surprised that Peter and the other apostles wrote their letters to people of Israel. Are you? These letters were written in the 60's and they are still sheep because they are still of the family of Israel. However, they were children of God if they are born again.


1 Pet 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

Read about what God is doing for the northern kingdom of Israel in Rom 9 and Hosea 1. He had promised to visit them and call them the children of the living God, which, BTW, requires a birth.

We are back to the flock being those of Israel and not gentiles:

1 Peter 5:2
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;

1 Peter 5:3
Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being examples to the flock.

Still speaking to the strangers in the north.

The scriptures are logical and reasonable and life giving if one just simply believes the words and leaves off the editorializing.

You are more hung up or obsessed with sheep than Calvinists. Its all you are talking about these days.

Calvinists do not only use sheep but the elect, chosen, those whom He has predestined, those whom He foreknew, those given to Me, those who were designated, as those who are destined, etc..........

All are similar phrases with the same meaning/results. There are many more ways to skin a cat than using sheep.

hope this helps !!!

 

[TomFL]

Calvinists takes pride in being one of the favored of God and they come across to me as being glad that most people cannot be saved. I would like to be wrong about this but I have read what these Calvinists have written for a few years now and I do not think I am. Misrepresenting who the sheep are in John 10 and 1 and 2 Peter is never going to help but just energize them into more error. It is best to believe what words say.

Peter did not think the sheep were gentiles and if he did, as you seem to think, he was as confused as a termite in a yo-yo, because he said the following.

1 Peter 1;1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Gentiles in their own lands are not strangers. Israelites scattered into gentile lands are strangers. These strangers have been there since 722 BC.

Now, notice what he says here to these strangers in gentile lands here:


Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by your good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

Of course conversation means life style.

Here is another instruction:

1 Peter 4:3
For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries:

....and what about this?


But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Now, the church is not revealed to us as a nation. Peter is not addressing these strangers as the church but as a people. This is the northern nation that was scattered out of their land and those whom Jesus Christ said he was going to seek and save at his first coming. Peter and the other 11 apostles was charged with this task in the name of Jesus Christ.

Ga 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles)
9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
10 Only they would that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.

After reading this I am not surprised that Peter and the other apostles wrote their letters to people of Israel. Are you? These letters were written in the 60's and they are still sheep because they are still of the family of Israel. However, they were children of God if they are born again.


1 Pet 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

Read about what God is doing for the northern kingdom of Israel in Rom 9 and Hosea 1. He had promised to visit them and call them the children of the living God, which, BTW, requires a birth.

We are back to the flock being those of Israel and not gentiles:

1 Peter 5:2
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;

1 Peter 5:3
Neither as being lords over God's heritage, but being examples to the flock.

Still speaking to the strangers in the north.

The scriptures are logical and reasonable and life giving if one just simply believes the words and leaves off the editorializing.

Sorry your lost tribes theology is flawed

Acts 2:5 —KJV
“¶ And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.”

and as for

Peter

1 Pet. 5:1–4 —KJV
Ҧ The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.”

The idea that Church elders should only feed Jewish believers is without merit

1 Pet. 2:9–10 —KJV
“But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.”

That refers to gentiles

Matt. 25:32 —KJV
“And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:”

Matt. 25:33 —KJV
“And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.”


as is your bifurcation of the people of God

Ephesians 2:11–16 (KJV 1900)
11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

 

[guest1]

Sorry your lost tribes theology is flawed

Acts 2:5 —KJV
“¶ And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.”

and as for

Peter

1 Pet. 5:1–4 —KJV
Ҧ The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.”

The idea that Church elders should only feed Jewish believers is without merit

1 Pet. 2:9–10 —KJV
“But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.”

That refers to gentiles

Matt. 25:32 —KJV
“And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:”

Matt. 25:33 —KJV
“And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.”

Its Armstrongism much like the late tv preacher Gene Scott taught.

 

[TomFL]

Its Armstrongism much like the late tv preacher Gene Scott taught.

That along with his extreme dispensationalism which seeks to bifurcate the people of God

There is one body

Ephesians 2:11–16 (KJV 1900)
11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

1 Corinthians 12:13 (KJV 1900)
13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

 

[Theo1689]

Calvinists takes pride in being one of the favored of God

What is your evidence for this false claim?

and they come across to me as being glad that most people cannot be saved.

I have NEVER in my life came across a Calvinist who was "glad" about this.
What is your evidence for this false and insulting claim?

I would like to be wrong about this

Well, you are.

It is best to believe what words say.

Too bad you refuse to do this.

Peter did not think the sheep were gentiles

How exactly do you know what Peter "thought"?
Are you a mindreader?
And it is doubly impressive that you presume to read someone's mind who's been dead for 2000 years.

Peter did not think the sheep were gentiles and if he did,

So suddenly you DON'T know what Peter thought, even though you want to claim you DO?

Peter did not think the sheep were gentiles and if he did, as you seem to think, he was as confused as a termite in a yo-yo, because he said the following.

So if you're wrong about what Peter thought, then you're claiming YOU understand things better than he did?

SERIOUSLY?!

The scriptures are logical and reasonable and life giving if one just simply believes the words and leaves off the editorializing.

Yep, and if you "leave off the editorializing", you end up with "Calvinism".
Go figure.

 

[JDS]

You are more hung up or obsessed with sheep than Calvinists. Its all you are talking about these days.

Calvinists do not only use sheep but the elect, chosen, those whom He has predestined, those whom He foreknew, those given to Me, those who were designated, as those who are destined, etc..........

All are similar phrases with the same meaning/results. There are many more ways to skin a cat than using sheep.

hope this helps !!!

Gentiles are an addition into the body of Christ, the family of God, because of the unbelief of Israel, whom God intended to save as one man, the only way he can fulfill his eternal covenants with him. This is the reason given in Roman 11, beginning at verse 13, for gentiles to being made partakers in the spiritual blessings of Israel, which are the forgiveness of sins, and the gift of the Spirit of God making the believers in Christ to be sons of God and equal with the Jews. The epistle to the Ephesians will give all the insight we need for the thinking of God with both these people groups in one body and what he intends to accomplish through the one body. One must keep in mind that God has not negated or nullified any of the covenants he has made with Israel because of this contingency, but will fulfill them all when, as he puts it in Romans 11, when the fullness of the gentiles be come in. IOW, when the church i complete and gathered together into one and taken to the Father's house.

It is this body that was predestinated to be glorified both individually and collectively. It did not have to have gentiles in it and they would not have been included if not for the unbelief of Israel, and gentiles would have been saved through them but not have been in this body. You may read about this glorification in Romans 8, which is in a Jewish context, and see that the hope of the believers is this glorification of the body, which will happen instantaneously and at one time for every member of this body in a day that God has determined to bring it to pass. God has chosen Christ before the foundation of the world and has elected all who would be included in his body. He has not elected who would be put into this body. That is the ministry of the Holy Spirit who is the agent of the formation of this body. It is said in 1 Cor 12:1313 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. God has chosen Christ and we are the body of Christ. Christ has suffered for our sins and washed them away. God has not chosen us before we are put into Christ. He is the head of the body and we are the functioning members placed at the discretion of the Spirit and equipped with abilities he calls the gifts of the Spirit. Therefore, election is not what Calvinists say it is. No one is elected before the foundation of the world but Jesus Christ.

Since foreknow is a bible word found in a text that is dealing with the first people group in the body, we must allow the scripture words to define who he is speaking of, and he does o in words that hold no ambiguity at all.

Rom 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

The "ourselves" are the Jews and the "they" are the creatures," the gentiles. Remember, this is written in AD 58, 18 years after the gentiles were first given the Spirit in Acts 10, and 28 years after the Jews received him in Acts 2. The history that had already passed in the NT age was from Acts 1 to Acts 18, when the epistle was written from Corinth.

Now, with all those facts in mind, here is the biblical definition for foreknowledge. It will be logical, intelligent, and reasonable when you read it. And it will be contextual. Here it is.

Rom 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew.

Paul was still an Israelite though he had been saved since Acts 9, which was in AD 37. He said in Ro 11:1 "I say then" driving us back to why he said it. Let's just look at the last few verses of Rom 10; You should read the whole chapter for context;

Rom 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18 But I say, Have they (Israel in context) not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.
19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.
20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.
21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.

The imagery here is a father holding out his arms and asking his son to come to him.

The scriptures defines it's terms. Calvinist have added many terms to the scriptures that God has not used. It is called adding to the word of God. God does not think in those TULIP terms. He just don't. I ask you to consider these truths.

 

[guest1]

I'm not interested in your sermonettes jds............................

 

[JDS]

Sorry your lost tribes theology is flawed

Acts 2:5 —KJV
“¶ And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.”

I would have thought better out of you than to think you would misrepresent what I said. I said nothing about lost tribes. If they were lost, how did Peter know where to send his letters? They were under the judgment of God because of their wickedness and their idolatry. Read about them in Hosea and you will see some prophecy concerning them that is coming to pass in Peter's day.

As for you suggesting that Jews dwelling in Jerusalem bolsters your position, whatever it is, The context is the festival of the feast of weeks (Pentecost), one of the three where Israel men over the age of 20 were commanded under the ceremonial OT law to appear in Jerusalem every year. They were from about 17 nations represented at this feast according to Luke, who wrote the Acts.

Let's keep it honest..

 

[JDS]

Its Armstrongism much like the late tv preacher Gene Scott taught.

Generally speaking, men who have been been forced to defend a position by actually looking at what is said and find it impossible to do will begin accusing the preacher if their heart is hardened against the truth. Instead of falsely slandering me by likening me to a heretic and a heretical movement, why not refute me by giving the sense of the passages I have been dealing with.

This really should tell you something about yourselves and you shouldn't like it.

 

[TibiasDad]

Quote box deleted.

It took a lot longer than I expected for someone to get punny with his name! 273 posts pun free! Not too bad! I thought it would have come a lot sooner!

Doug

 

[guest1]

Generally speaking, men who have been been forced to defend a position by actually looking at what is said and find it impossible to do will begin accusing the preacher if their heart is hardened against the truth. Instead of falsely slandering me by likening me to a heretic and a heretical movement, why not refute me by giving the sense of the passages I have been dealing with.

This really should tell you something about yourselves and you shouldn't like it.

I love irony and the ad hominems coming from you jds with everyone in this thread and your condescending attitude that you are right and everyone else is wrong.

Also this should tell you something which should be a red flag for you as this is an Arminian and Calvinist forum yet both groups are uniting together against your teachings.

Things that make you go hmmmm.............................

 

[TomFL]

I would have thought better out of you than to think you would misrepresent what I said. I said nothing about lost tribes. If they were lost, how did Peter know where to send his letters? They were under the judgment of God because of their wickedness and their idolatry. Read about them in Hosea and you will see some prophecy concerning them that is coming to pass in Peter's day.

As for you suggesting that Jews dwelling in Jerusalem bolsters your position, whatever it is, The context is the festival of the feast of weeks (Pentecost), one of the three where Israel men over the age of 20 were commanded under the ceremonial OT law to appear in Jerusalem every year. They were from about 17 nations represented at this feast according to Luke, who wrote the Acts.

Let's keep it honest..

Indeed you used the word separated tribes but you did not object to the term lost previously

the passage I quoted however shows they were not so separated

Acts 2:5 —KJV
“¶ And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.”

so that they should be referred to as two folds

and as for

Peter

1 Pet. 5:1–4 —KJV
Ҧ The elders which are among you I exhort, who am also an elder, and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, and also a partaker of the glory that shall be revealed:
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind;
Neither as being lords over God’s heritage, but being ensamples to the flock.
And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.”

The idea that Church elders should only feed Jewish believers is without merit

1 Pet. 2:9–10 —KJV
“But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.”

That refers to gentiles

Matt. 25:32 —KJV
“And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:”

Matt. 25:33 —KJV
“And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.”


as to your bifurcation of the people of God

Ephesians 2:11–16 (KJV 1900)
11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; 12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

 

[JDS]

I love irony and the ad hominems coming from you jds with everyone in this thread and your condescending attitude that you are right and everyone else is wrong.

Also this should tell you something which should be a red flag for you as this is an Arminian and Calvinist forum yet both groups are uniting together against your teachings.

Things that make you go hmmmm.............................

All this proves is Calvinism does not have a lock on false doctrine or the attitude that words in the scriptures does not have any meaning other than what the founder of your religion says it is. When you reject the words God uses to reveal himself and his ways and substitute a whole bunch of new ones, then I will look at you as suspect. God does not think in terms that Calvinists thinks in. My evidence for that is the absence of your terms in the scriptures.

The only difference I can see between you and me and between the other fellows you are referencing is that I believe the words as written in the texts, and you fellows don't. It has nothing to do with condescension but it may seem that way to you if I am calling you on the practice of looking at one word and seeing another and making up some to fill in the gaps.

Forgive me for being so blunt but you need to wake up and realize what you are doing. I am not your enemy here just because I tell you the truth.

 

[TomFL]

All this proves is Calvinism does not have a lock on false doctrine or the attitude that words in the scriptures does not have any meaning other than what the founder of your religion says it is. When you reject the words God uses to reveal himself and his ways and substitute a whole bunch of new ones, then I will look at you as suspect. God does not think in terms that Calvinists thinks in. My evidence for that is the absence of your terms in the scriptures.

The only difference I can see between you and me and between the other fellows you are referencing is that I believe the words as written in the texts, and you fellows don't. It has nothing to do with condescension but it may seem that way to you if I am calling you on the practice of looking at one word and seeing another and making up some to fill in the gaps.

Forgive me for being so blunt but you need to wake up and realize what you are doing. I am not your enemy here just because I tell you the truth.

Actually what it proves is you are posting off topic and your posts have nothing to do with the purpose of this forum

 

[guest1]

All this proves is Calvinism does not have a lock on false doctrine or the attitude that words in the scriptures does not have any meaning other than what the founder of your religion says it is. When you reject the words God uses to reveal himself and his ways and substitute a whole bunch of new ones, then I will look at you as suspect. God does not think in terms that Calvinists thinks in. My evidence for that is the absence of your terms in the scriptures.

The only difference I can see between you and me and between the other fellows you are referencing is that I believe the words as written in the texts, and you fellows don't. It has nothing to do with condescension but it may seem that way to you if I am calling you on the practice of looking at one word and seeing another and making up some to fill in the gaps.

Forgive me for being so blunt but you need to wake up and realize what you are doing. I am not your enemy here just because I tell you the truth.

And both Arminians and Calvinists on this forum agree that you are the one promoting false doctrine. Once again you do not see the irony in that do you jds ?

Its easy to mud sling but just remember as you are pointing your finger at us there are 10 pointing right back at you. We are not interested in your crusade........................

 

[Theo1689]

All this proves is Calvinism does not have a lock on false doctrine

That's because Calvinism doesn't CONTAIN "false doctrine".

or the attitude that words in the scriptures does not have any meaning other than what the founder of your religion says it is.

Well, the "founder" of our religion is Jesus Christ.
"Calvinism" is simply a label our enemies gave us.

When you reject the words God uses to reveal himself and his ways and substitute a whole bunch of new ones, then I will look at you as suspect.

But we don't do that.

God does not think in terms that Calvinists thinks in.

Actually, you are wrong.

My evidence for that is the absence of your terms in the scriptures.

You mean like "election", "predestination", etc.?

The only difference I can see between you and me and between the other fellows you are referencing is that I believe the words as written in the texts, and you fellows don't.

Actually, it's the other way around.
We believe them. YOU don't.

It has nothing to do with condescension but it may seem that way to you if I am calling you on the practice of looking at one word and seeing another and making up some to fill in the gaps.

Um, that's what YOU do.

Forgive me for being so blunt but you need to wake up and realize what you are doing. I am not your enemy here just because I tell you the truth.

You are not telling us "the truth".
You are "telling us" false doctrines.
It is YOU who needs to "wake up".

 

[brightfame52]

He died for all, the world, every man

John 6:51 (KJV 1900)
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

2 Corinthians 5:14–15 (KJV 1900)
14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: 15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

Hebrews 2:9 (KJV 1900)
9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

He died for every Sheep!