15+ Dead In Texas School Shooting; 18-y.o. student Salvador Ramos Identified As Shooter

vibise

Well-known member
The whining is no more useful than the prayers you ridiculed.
Not interested in whining or prayers.
Am interested in legislative action with teeth to address gun violence in America.

This country is an outlier among developed countries in gun violence and as gun sales skyrocket and restrictions are removed, we see more and more needless deaths, of schoolchildren, shoppers, churchgoers, subway riders.
And the RW response is, so what! Let's do nothing except sell more guns! Arm everyone!!
 

Gondwanaland

Well-known member
Newest reports say 18 students dead (3rd and 4th graders), 1 teacher, several in critical condition including the grandmother.
Yeah seeing that now
The shooter purchased 2 assault weapons on his 18th birthday.
No such thing.
Why should an 18 year old be able to purchase such deadly weapons.

Actually, who needs to own such weapons?
People who want to defend themselves from nutjobs like this.
 

Gondwanaland

Well-known member
yes, we all pray for them, but prayers will not stop the carnage. We need legislation.
We need to stop the proliferation of ever more powerful weapons sold with little to no oversight to people with no reason to own such deadly weapons.
What legislation would have prevented this whackjob from doing what he did? You guys always bleat 'legislation' yet can never actually give a constitutionally sound example of a law that would have prevented the shootings you use to gin up outrage while stepping on the still warm bodies.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
And do you think the deaths of innocent children is worth making gun ownership legal, just to allow people to pretend to be Rambo, or to feed their irrational fears of marauding home invaders or their treasonous goal of bringing down the federal govt?
You think the deaths of innocent unborn children to be acceptable.
How many guns do you own?

How about we stop selling military-styled weapons to civilians.
No bump stocks, large magazines, ghost guns.
Crackdown on straw purchases and gun shops that supply criminals in places like Chicago and NYC.
Make sure all gun-owners register and insure their weapons so that they are fully responsible for crimes committed with them.
Serious and complete background checks for all purchases or transfers.
Red flag laws.
No guns under 18 years old.
limits on the numbers of guns per person and ammo restrictions.
No guns for felons or anyone under a restraining order.
No open or concealed carry.
Gun purchasers should have a reason to own a gun. Like hunting.
Guns in airplane carryon bags confiscated, and owners made to pay a huge fine. Jail on second offense.
Safety requirements so that only the purchaser can fire the gun.
Serious training in advance of purchase, and yearly updated training, all at the gun owner's expense.
Fully fund federal research into the use and abuse of guns.
This is an excellent example of how liberals do not trust the general public. These shooters are a small minority of Gun owners.
 
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vibise

Well-known member
So you consider God as useless
Well, your side has been praying away since before Sandy Hook and how has that worked out? Explain that to the parents of those 18 dead kids in Texas. I am sure they will be grateful and satisfied with that all your past, present and future prayers. :rolleyes:

We are faced with a tragedy that can be addressed by political action and your side refuses to do anything meaningful.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
Well, your side has been praying away since before Sandy Hook and how has that worked out? Explain that to the parents of those 18 dead kids in Texas. I am sure they will be grateful and satisfied with that all your past, present and future prayers. :rolleyes:

We are faced with a tragedy that can be addressed by political action and your side refuses to do anything meaningful.
If you consider God as useless then why do you pretend you are a Christian and continue to attend church. You would be more honest if you called yourself an atheist.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
Well, your side has been praying away since before Sandy Hook and how has that worked out? Explain that to the parents of those 18 dead kids in Texas. I am sure they will be grateful and satisfied with that all your past, present and future prayers. :rolleyes:

We are faced with a tragedy that can be addressed by political action and your side refuses to do anything meaningful.
I told you several days ago to read Job 38 for the answer.
 

vibise

Well-known member
How would any of that have prevented this tragedy?

Two guns thank you
All of what I out lined taken together would reduce the number of guns in this country, and the guns in the hands of people who should not have them. This would decrease gun deaths by murder as well as suicide.

You have no practical suggestions on how to reduce gun deaths. Or if you do, you have been very silent on this. And no, prayers are not what will fix this problem, a problem unique to the USA, because of our lax gun laws.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
All of what I out lined taken together would reduce the number of guns in this country, and the guns in the hands of people who should not have them. This would decrease gun deaths by murder as well as suicide.

You have no practical suggestions on how to reduce gun deaths. Or if you do, you have been very silent on this. And no, prayers are not what will fix this problem, a problem unique to the USA, because of our lax gun laws.
Answer the question of why should only criminals have access to guns?
 

vibise

Well-known member
If you consider God as useless then why do you pretend you are a Christian and continue to attend church. You would be more honest if you called yourself an atheist.
God helps those who help themselves.
If you sit on the sidelines in the face of tragedy, and do nothing, then nothing gets done.
God is not coming down from heaven to take guns away from murderers. Not now, not in the past, and not in the future.
He gave us free will and the ability to run our own societies, so it is up to us to do something.
Sitting around with long faces while failing to address the actual problems is what you are proposing. Not going to fix anything.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
God helps those who help themselves.
If you sit on the sidelines in the face of tragedy, and do nothing, then nothing gets done.
God is not coming down from heaven to take guns away from murderers. Not now, not in the past, and not in the future.
He gave us free will and the ability to run our own societies, so it is up to us to do something.
Sitting around with long faces while failing to address the actual problems is what you are proposing. Not going to fix anything.
Where in scripture do you find that saying.
 

vibise

Well-known member
Answer the question of why should only criminals have access to guns?
You start to limit guns and ammo, then criminals will lose access as well.
If you have strict gun control laws, you can charge criminals with violating those laws and imprison them.
If there are few guns in society, how can criminals gain access to them?

And seriously, do you sit on your recliner every night with your gun in hand waiting for those home invaders to show up?
Do you take your gun to the bakery in case you run into a robber?
If so, you should maybe see a therapist.

Why do you need a gun? Why does anyone who is not a criminal or psychopath?
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
You start to limit guns and ammo, then criminals will lose access as well.
If you have strict gun control laws, you can charge criminals with violating those laws and imprison them.
If there are few guns in society, how can criminals gain access to them?

And seriously, do you sit on your recliner every night with your gun in hand waiting for those home invaders to show up?
Do you take your gun to the bakery in case you run into a robber?
If so, you should maybe see a therapist.

Why do you need a gun? Why does anyone who is not a criminal or psychopath?
You are ducking my question
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
You start to limit guns and ammo, then criminals will lose access as well.
If you have strict gun control laws, you can charge criminals with violating those laws and imprison them.
If there are few guns in society, how can criminals gain access to them?

And seriously, do you sit on your recliner every night with your gun in hand waiting for those home invaders to show up?
Do you take your gun to the bakery in case you run into a robber?
If so, you should maybe see a therapist.

Why do you need a gun? Why does anyone who is not a criminal or psychopath?
Criminals have no problem doing illegal things. Acquitting guns would be easy boy someone willing to break the law.
 

Gondwanaland

Well-known member
How many guns do you own?
Stop asking creepy stalker questions of people.
How about we stop selling military-styled weapons to civilians.
What are "military-styled weapons"?


How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.


No bump stocks, large magazines, ghost guns.
What are 'large magazines'?

And how would any of these three things have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Crackdown on straw purchases and gun shops that supply criminals in places like Chicago and NYC.
You were fine with Obama pushing untrackable straw purchases in his F&F program. But how are you going to determine when a straw purchase has occurred?

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Make sure all gun-owners register
You do know that will simply lead to more thefts and 3d printing, right?

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
and insure their weapons so that they are fully responsible for crimes committed with them.
Are you fully responsible for crimes committed with your car by someone that stole it?

Again, how would that have prevented this shooting given the shooter is dead? Be specific.
Serious and complete background checks for all purchases or transfers.
How would you feasibly oversee such a thing? A Big Brother omnipresent camera system? How are you going to prevent exchanges in the woods?

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Red flag laws.
Red flag laws didn't work in New York with the Buffalo shooter.

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
No guns under 18 years old.
Ownership? Sure. Unless one is emancipated.

But how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
limits on the numbers of guns per person and ammo restrictions.
WHat sort of limits?

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
No guns for felons or
Already the case in most places. Interesting though, the left fighting for the right for felons to vote but then this.....

But how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
anyone under a restraining order.
Violation of due process.

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
No open or concealed carry.
So, no guns allowed to be carried anywhere? Unconstitutional.

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Gun purchasers should have a reason to own a gun. Like hunting.
How about self defense? Collection? Or do we now not have the basic right to do either of those things?

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Guns in airplane carryon bags confiscated, and owners made to pay a huge fine. Jail on second offense.
No issue there.

But how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Safety requirements so that only the purchaser can fire the gun.
Hell to the no. My wife should be able to defend herself with my guns, as should my teens, should I not be around. Not to mention that's absolutely unenforceable.

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Serious training in advance of purchase, and yearly updated training, all at the gun owner's expense.

That's incredibly racist.

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.
Fully fund federal research into the use and abuse of guns.
No one is stopping research into gun use. Obama had a very nice CDC run study that he promptly released at the end of the day on a Friday in hopes that little attention was paid to it, because it showed people with guns were more likely to escape a dangerous situation unscathed, and because it showed that defensive gun uses absolutely dwarf gun deaths even when one dishonestly includes suicides as gun deaths.

But again, how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

I did not see a single thing in your list that would have prevented this shooting. If you think otherwise, answer one of my questions with specifics on how it would have done so.
 

glenlogie

Well-known member
Stop asking creepy stalker questions of people.

What are "military-styled weapons"?


How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.



What are 'large magazines'?

And how would any of these three things have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

You were fine with Obama pushing untrackable straw purchases in his F&F program. But how are you going to determine when a straw purchase has occurred?

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

You do know that will simply lead to more thefts and 3d printing, right?

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

Are you fully responsible for crimes committed with your car by someone that stole it?

Again, how would that have prevented this shooting given the shooter is dead? Be specific.

How would you feasibly oversee such a thing? A Big Brother omnipresent camera system? How are you going to prevent exchanges in the woods?

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

Red flag laws didn't work in New York with the Buffalo shooter.

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

Ownership? Sure. Unless one is emancipated.

But how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

WHat sort of limits?

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

Already the case in most places. Interesting though, the left fighting for the right for felons to vote but then this.....

But how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

Violation of due process.

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

So, no guns allowed to be carried anywhere? Unconstitutional.

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

How about self defense? Collection? Or do we now not have the basic right to do either of those things?

How would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

No issue there.

But how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

Hell to the no. My wife should be able to defend herself with my guns, as should my teens, should I not be around. Not to mention that's absolutely unenforceable.

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.


That's incredibly racist.

And how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

No one is stopping research into gun use. Obama had a very nice CDC run study that he promptly released at the end of the day on a Friday in hopes that little attention was paid to it, because it showed people with guns were more likely to escape a dangerous situation unscathed, and because it showed that defensive gun uses absolutely dwarf gun deaths even when one dishonestly includes suicides as gun deaths.

But again, how would that have prevented this shooting? Be specific.

I did not see a single thing in your list that would have prevented this shooting. If you think otherwise, answer one of my questions with specifics on how it would have done so.
She believes that her proposed laws would magically stop criminals from getting guns.
 

Gondwanaland

Well-known member
You think the deaths of innocent unborn children to be acceptable.

This is an excellent example of how liberals do not trust the general public. These shooters are a small minority of Gun owners.
And indeed, even a smaller minority of actual gun homicides. Most of those are black on black inner city crime. But liberals don't care about that.
 
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