1John 5:1 regeneration before faith

fltom

Well-known member
Amen

It does not say the drawing is the enabling. You told a story
Jesus clearly did

John 6:65 (NIV) — 65 He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled them.”

as he comments on what was stated in John 6:44
 

Reformedguy

Well-known member
You have isolated John 6:44.

John 6:40
For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

Above we see everyone who believes in the Son will have eternal life and be raised on the last day.

John 6:44
No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day.

So above no one can come unless they are drawn

John 12:32
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw everyone to Myself.”

And when Jesus Ascends to heaven post Resurrection is when all men/everyone will be drawn.

So John 12:32 is the fulfillment of Johns 6:44. No one was drawn until Jesus Ascended which began at Pentecost and Jesus promise and commandment of the Great Commission in Matthew 28:18-20. It began in Jerusalem and spread to the entire world.

hope this helps !!!
So your a universa
No I stated what I meant

Do any here have the same level of Greek scholarship as that of the NIV committee?

Answered that already. Way to pay attention.
 

Synergy

Well-known member
Who causes us to repent without the spirit of repentance? The spirit convicts of sin and empowers us to change our thinking and empowers us to obey. Only spiritual inertia can break through carnal inertia and head us in the right direction and that only applies to new spiritual creations that God is at work in. God bless you. :)
I agree that the Holy Spirit convicts. My point is that you still have to repent because God does not repent for you. That point aligns itself perfectly with Acts 2:38 where Saint Peter clearly says that repentance precedes the gift of the Holy Spirit.
 

Synergy

Well-known member

Reformedguy

Well-known member
Exhortation is non-sensical if irresistible grace is in force.

So you're confirming that you did not repent of your former ways before you were regenerated? Am I right in saying that?

You don't know that. You never asked me. How can you make that judgment without asking me? Fascinating.....
Why is that?

Correct. I repented of my former ways because I was regenerated.
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Jesus clearly did

John 6:65 (NIV) — 65 He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled them.”

as he comments on what was stated in John 6:44

Jesus didn't translate the NIV.
More translation shopping on your part.
 

Alexander the adequate

Well-known member
Jesus clearly did

John 6:65 (NIV) — 65 He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled them.”

as he comments on what was stated in John 6:44
I see what you mean. not sure i would call it enabling, but at the same time that is one way to describe what happens,
Until you are drawn you are unable to go, not because of inability, but because of ignorance
 

Alexander the adequate

Well-known member
Unless what? What is mans part in this paticular verse? Coming? Why do you come?
You are changing your issue now.
First you claimed there was no conditional word there, but clearly "unless" is a conditional word. For me, before asking another question, I would think thath you should acknowlege your mistatement and admit there is a condition: unless

But as to you next three part question:
1. Unless what? Unless God draws, meaning if God draws you can, if He does not draw you can not
2. Man's part in this particular verse is to come; that is our response to being drawn
3. Why we come does not have one answer for everyone. Why i came and why you came could be different,
For me, I had been looking into world religions and when when I was drawn to Jesus, I understood that he wa the God I was after.
How did you come?
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
2. Man's part in this particular verse is to come; that is our response to being drawn

We came because God drew us.

3. Why we come does not have one answer for everyone. Why i came and why you came could be different,

Nope.
Everyone comes for the same reason. Because we were drawn.

A card comes because it is drawn.
Blinds come because they were drawn.
A pistol comes because it is drawn.
A sword comes because it is drawn.
A bucket of water comes because it is drawn.
A net of fish comes because it is drawn.
A carriage comes because it is drawn.
A breath comes because it is drawn.

It's not difficult.
The only thing that makes it difficult is man's theology, and the need to try to smuggle in "free will".
 

Alexander the adequate

Well-known member
We came because God drew us.



Nope.
Everyone comes for the same reason. Because we were drawn.

A card comes because it is drawn.
Blinds come because they were drawn.
A pistol comes because it is drawn.
A sword comes because it is drawn.
A bucket of water comes because it is drawn.
A net of fish comes because it is drawn.
A carriage comes because it is drawn.
A breath comes because it is drawn.

It's not difficult.
The only thing that makes it difficult is man's theology, and the need to try to smuggle in "free will".
I don't know what things you do or do not know, and I do not want to sound condescending, but you are speaking of a figurative drawing as if it is literal.
The drawing that God does is expressed figuratively, not literally
All your examples are literal, but we are talking about an event described figuratively
What the sources say is the figurative use of this word equals attraction. not irresistible dragging,
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
I don't know what things you do or do not know, and I do not want to sound condescending,

Well, here's some advice...
Don't assume I'm ignorant simply because I disagree with your false teachings.

but you are speaking of a figurative drawing as if it is literal.

No, actually, I'm not.
God doesn't merely "figuratively" draw us.
That's simply your way of denying Scripture.
God LITERALLY draws us.
It simply isn't done "physically".
He does it Spiritually, by regenerating us, giving us a new heart of flesh, and giving us faith.

The drawing that God does is expressed figuratively, not literally

What is your evidence for this bogus and bankrupt claim?

All your examples are literal, but we are talking about an event described figuratively

No, we aren't.
There's nothing in the text that suggests that God's drawing of us is merely "figurative".
That is simply your unsubstantiated ASSUMPTION.

What the sources say is the figurative use of this word equals attraction. not irresistible dragging,

And "attraction" is 100% efficacious, just like "drawing" is.
 
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