381 ce= the council of Constantinople

The "substance" of deity is spirit and spiritual attributes. In the bible the word is used to refer to someone's wealth, means or possessions.

If that's what you mean by substance, so be it. Jesus said "All that the Father has is mine." Jn 16:15.

The idea is comprehendible.

The idea of Gods begetting Gods in heaven, which is where the Trinitarians idea of substance comes from, is not.


It's historical formulations are not scriptural or in scriptural language. Even Calvin deprecated the language of the Nicene creed, which is monstrous - even if its ideas are well-intended and in some sense reconcilable with the bible.


Be real. "Trinity" formulations are an attempt to formulate biblical concepts in non-biblical language. Why?


If Trinitarians preached what the bible says rather than gobbledygook, then may be there wouldn't be so many heresies.



Roman Trinity and Orthodox Trinity do not agree. They are not the same Trinity. The idea that there is agreement amongst all Trinitarians is sheer propaganda.


You're wrong to suggest that anyone who doesn't credit non-biblical verbal formulations of God cannot worship the Lord.

Adoptionists however do have a problem, I'll grant, but I'm not one of them.
We do not believe that " Gods begetting Gods" Scripture is Isa 43:10. You must have LDS in mind.
 
 
We do not believe that " Gods begetting Gods" Scripture is Isa 43:10. You must have LDS in mind.
I'm just quoting your Trinitarian creed, as modified by the Council of Constantinople in AD 381.

"And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds (æons),"​

Don't accuse me of what your own creed advances. That's hypocrisy.
 
I'm just quoting your Trinitarian creed, as modified by the Council of Constantinople in AD 381.

"And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds (æons),"​

Don't accuse me of what your own creed advances. That's hypocrisy.
The only-begotten is correctly translated as Unique Thanks for correcting my misunderstanding of what you wrote, friend.
 
The only-begotten is correctly translated as Unique Thanks for correcting my misunderstanding of what you wrote, friend.
"Unique" (or one of a kind) is not what only-begotten means in this context of Father and Son. In the bible, only begotten means "only progeny" whenever it is used of people/persons. So "unique" is an ex post facto redaction to the Nicene creed to cater for its overtly non-biblical terminology when monogenes is used contextual to Father and Son in heaven - an inherently gnostic formulation akin to Valentianism and symptomatic of the problems with so many Trinitarian formulations, which concern the improper use of non-scriptural language or non-contextual use of scriptural language.
 
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"Unique" (or one of a kind) is not what only-begotten means in this context of Father and Son. In the bible, only begotten means "only progeny" whenever it is used of people/persons. So "unique" is an ex post facto redaction to the Nicene creed to cater for its overtly non-biblical terminology when monogenes is used contextual to Father and Son in heaven - an inherently gnostic formulation akin to Valentianism and symptomatic of the problems with so many Trinitarian formulations, which concern the improper use of non-scriptural language or non-contextual use of scriptural language.
It really does mean Unique.

Monogenes has two primary definitions, "pertaining to being the only one of its kind within a specific relationship" and "pertaining to being the only one of its kind or class, unique in kind". Its Greek meaning is often applied to mean "one of a kind, one and only". Monogenēs may be used as an adjective.

Luke 7:12-13: Now when he came nigh to the gate of the city, behold, there was a dead man carried out, the only (μονογενης) son of his mother, and she was a widow … And when the Lord saw her, he had compassion on her, and said unto her, Weep not.

Luke 8:41-42: And, behold, there came a man named Jairus, and he was a ruler of the synagogue: and he fell down at Jesus’ feet, and besought him that he would come into his house: for he had one only (μονογενης) daughter, about twelve years of age, and she lay a dying.

Luke 9.38: And, behold, a man of the company cried out, saying, Master, I beseech thee, look upon my son: for he is my only child (μονογενης).


“In the preface of the New King James Bible, we are told that the ‘literal’ meaning of MONOGENES… is ‘only begotten’… All of this is linguistic nonsense.”
–D. A. Carson, Exegetical Fallacies, p. 28 (see also pp. 30-31)

“‘Only-begotten’ fails the etymology test, as it would require a different word… MONOGENES derives instead from a different root, GENOS, leading to the meaning ‘one of a kind.'”
–Craig Keener, The Gospel of John, Vol. 1, pp. 412-13

“We should not read too much into ‘only begotten’… To English ears this sounds like a metaphysical relationship, but the Greek term means no more than ‘only,’ ‘unique.'”
–Leon Morris, The Gospel according to John, p. 93

“The emphasis is not that Jesus was ‘begotten’ of God, but that God had only one Son, and this ‘one and only’ Son he sent into the world…”
–Colin Kruse, The Letters of John, p. 159

There is little Greek justification for the translation of MONOGENES as ‘only begotten.'”
–Raymond Brown, The Gospel according to John (i-xii), p. 13

“MONOGENES therefore means not ‘only begotten,’ but ‘one-of-a-kind’ son…”
–Andreas Kostenberger, John, p. 43

As I said, I could go on with a list of examples as long as my arm. New Testament scholars routinely dismiss the “only begotten” interpretation of MONOGENES.
 
Journal of Biblical Literature:

Dale Moody, “God’s Only Son: The Translation of John 3:16 in the Revised Standard Version,” Journal of Biblical Literature 72, no. 4 (1953): 213–19.

113016_0532_OnMONOGENES2.jpg
Moody’s article defends the RSV’s translation of MONOGENES, arguing that “only begotten” is an etymological, linguistic, and historical error. He certainly was not the first one to have made this case, but his arguments in particular seem to have influenced at least two generations of New Testament scholarship. I think this is due in no small part to the fact that Moody’s article is the first one cited in BDAG’s entry on MONOGENES (BDAG is the most important and authoritative lexicon of New Testament words; see right). Anyone looking to BDAG for a definition of MONOGENES is going to be confronted with the non-generative interpretation of the term that is reflected in Moody’s article.

(One interesting historical note: Dale Moody was a professor at The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary during its former liberal era. Moody’s work is apparently based on Francis Warden’s Ph.D. dissertation written at SBTS in 1938. Over the summer, I went to SBTS’s library and found the dissertation. It is still unpublished, but a summary of Warden’s conclusions appeared in April of 1953 in the journal Review & Expositor. Moody’s article appeared later that same year in December in the Journal of Biblical Literature.)

Many NT scholars view Moody’s article as the definitive word on MONOGENES, but I believe that Moody was wrong—really wrong. And here’s why.

1. Moody claims the suffix –GENES means “kind” without any notion of generation.

Moody is correct that the Greek suffix –GENES derives from the word GENOS. But Moody is wrong about the semantic range of GENOS and the suffix derived from it. In some contexts GENOS means “kind,” but in other contexts it means “offspring.” In fact, in John’s one use of the term GENOS, it clearly refers to “offspring” or “one that is begotten from another” (Revelation 22:16). “Offspring” is the only attested meaning for this term in John’s writings! Moody is also wrong about the semantic range of the –GENES suffix. There are many examples of this suffix that indicate “begottenness.” For example, OIKOGENES means “home-born” (Gen. 15:3 LXX). Paul uses the term EUGENES to mean “well-born” (1 Cor. 1:26). Again, Moody has misconstrued both the meaning of GENOS and the suffix derived from it.

2. Moody says that if John had meant “only-begotten” he would have used the term MONOGENNETOS.

Why does Moody claim that John would have used the term MONOGENNETOS, not MONOGENES, if he had meant “only begotten”? Because the former is derived from the verb GENNAO, which everyone agrees denotes generation. We’ve already seen that Moody is mistaken about GENOS, but he’s also mistaken about MONOGENNETOS. The term MONOGENNETOS does not appear to be attested in ancient Greek literature before the second century (it does not appear in Liddell-Scott’s lexicon). If John were to have used the term, he would have to have been the one to coin it. But why would John coin a new term when MONOGENES was ready at hand? This is a term, after all, that means “only-begotten” in numerous texts across ancient Greek literature (according to Lee Irons’s recent research in which he has located 60+ examples of MONOGENES in non-biblical Greek before the second century).

3. Moody argues that MONOGENES in Hebrews 11:17 cannot possibly mean “only-begotten.”

Moody cites Hebrews 11:17 as decisive evidence against the “only-begotten” interpretation of MONOGENES. Hebrews 11:17 says that “Abraham… was offering up his MONOGENES son.” Moody says that because Abraham had other children (e.g., Ishmael), the term can’t mean that Isaac was his “only begotten.” MONOGENES must indicate that Isaac was his “unique” son. But this is mistaken as well. The writer of Hebrews is specifically pointing out that Isaac is “uniquely begotten.” The author is showing incredible sensitivity to the wider context of Genesis in which Abraham had once questioned whether his heir would come from his own body (Gen. 15:2-4) and whether that heir from his own body would be Ishmael (Gen. 17:18, 21). “Begotten” addresses the first question, and “uniquely” addresses the second. In other words, the idea of “begottenness” is necessary in this context. Moody has this completely backwards.

4. Moody’s linguistic arguments are not sensitive to the context of John’s use of the term.

In every instance that John uses the term MONOGENES, it follows a passage/context in which he uses the term GENNAO to refer to the “new birth”—every single instance (see John 1:14, 18; 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). That is no accident. John is intentionally drawing a distinction between the new birth that we experience and the Son’s unique begottenness from the Father. John seems to be saying that while Christians have been “begotten” by the Holy Spirit, Jesus is the “uniquely begotten” Son of God. His “begottenness” is different from ours and indeed utterly without parallel.
 
Journal of Biblical Literature:

Dale Moody, “God’s Only Son: The Translation of John 3:16 in the Revised Standard Version,” Journal of Biblical Literature 72, no. 4 (1953): 213–19.

113016_0532_OnMONOGENES2.jpg
Moody’s article defends the RSV’s translation of MONOGENES, arguing that “only begotten” is an etymological, linguistic, and historical error. He certainly was not the first one to have made this case, but his arguments in particular seem to have influenced at least two generations of New Testament scholarship. I think this is due in no small part to the fact that Moody’s article is the first one cited in BDAG’s entry on MONOGENES (BDAG is the most important and authoritative lexicon of New Testament words; see right). Anyone looking to BDAG for a definition of MONOGENES is going to be confronted with the non-generative interpretation of the term that is reflected in Moody’s article.

(One interesting historical note: Dale Moody was a professor at The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary during its former liberal era. Moody’s work is apparently based on Francis Warden’s Ph.D. dissertation written at SBTS in 1938. Over the summer, I went to SBTS’s library and found the dissertation. It is still unpublished, but a summary of Warden’s conclusions appeared in April of 1953 in the journal Review & Expositor. Moody’s article appeared later that same year in December in the Journal of Biblical Literature.)

Many NT scholars view Moody’s article as the definitive word on MONOGENES, but I believe that Moody was wrong—really wrong. And here’s why.

1. Moody claims the suffix –GENES means “kind” without any notion of generation.

Moody is correct that the Greek suffix –GENES derives from the word GENOS. But Moody is wrong about the semantic range of GENOS and the suffix derived from it. In some contexts GENOS means “kind,” but in other contexts it means “offspring.” In fact, in John’s one use of the term GENOS, it clearly refers to “offspring” or “one that is begotten from another” (Revelation 22:16). “Offspring” is the only attested meaning for this term in John’s writings! Moody is also wrong about the semantic range of the –GENES suffix. There are many examples of this suffix that indicate “begottenness.” For example, OIKOGENES means “home-born” (Gen. 15:3 LXX). Paul uses the term EUGENES to mean “well-born” (1 Cor. 1:26). Again, Moody has misconstrued both the meaning of GENOS and the suffix derived from it.

2. Moody says that if John had meant “only-begotten” he would have used the term MONOGENNETOS.

Why does Moody claim that John would have used the term MONOGENNETOS, not MONOGENES, if he had meant “only begotten”? Because the former is derived from the verb GENNAO, which everyone agrees denotes generation. We’ve already seen that Moody is mistaken about GENOS, but he’s also mistaken about MONOGENNETOS. The term MONOGENNETOS does not appear to be attested in ancient Greek literature before the second century (it does not appear in Liddell-Scott’s lexicon). If John were to have used the term, he would have to have been the one to coin it. But why would John coin a new term when MONOGENES was ready at hand? This is a term, after all, that means “only-begotten” in numerous texts across ancient Greek literature (according to Lee Irons’s recent research in which he has located 60+ examples of MONOGENES in non-biblical Greek before the second century).

3. Moody argues that MONOGENES in Hebrews 11:17 cannot possibly mean “only-begotten.”

Moody cites Hebrews 11:17 as decisive evidence against the “only-begotten” interpretation of MONOGENES. Hebrews 11:17 says that “Abraham… was offering up his MONOGENES son.” Moody says that because Abraham had other children (e.g., Ishmael), the term can’t mean that Isaac was his “only begotten.” MONOGENES must indicate that Isaac was his “unique” son. But this is mistaken as well. The writer of Hebrews is specifically pointing out that Isaac is “uniquely begotten.” The author is showing incredible sensitivity to the wider context of Genesis in which Abraham had once questioned whether his heir would come from his own body (Gen. 15:2-4) and whether that heir from his own body would be Ishmael (Gen. 17:18, 21). “Begotten” addresses the first question, and “uniquely” addresses the second. In other words, the idea of “begottenness” is necessary in this context. Moody has this completely backwards.

4. Moody’s linguistic arguments are not sensitive to the context of John’s use of the term.

In every instance that John uses the term MONOGENES, it follows a passage/context in which he uses the term GENNAO to refer to the “new birth”—every single instance (see John 1:14, 18; 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). That is no accident. John is intentionally drawing a distinction between the new birth that we experience and the Son’s unique begottenness from the Father. John seems to be saying that while Christians have been “begotten” by the Holy Spirit, Jesus is the “uniquely begotten” Son of God. His “begottenness” is different from ours and indeed utterly without parallel.
 
Journal of Biblical Literature:

Dale Moody, “God’s Only Son: The Translation of John 3:16 in the Revised Standard Version,” Journal of Biblical Literature 72, no. 4 (1953): 213–19.

Moody’s article defends the RSV’s translation of MONOGENES, arguing that “only begotten” is an etymological, linguistic, and historical error. He certainly was not the first one to have made this case, but his arguments in particular seem to have influenced at least two generations of New Testament scholarship. I think this is due in no small part to the fact that Moody’s article is the first one cited in BDAG’s entry on MONOGENES (BDAG is the most important and authoritative lexicon of New Testament words; see right). Anyone looking to BDAG for a definition of MONOGENES is going to be confronted with the non-generative interpretation of the term that is reflected in Moody’s article.

(One interesting historical note: Dale Moody was a professor at The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary during its former liberal era. Moody’s work is apparently based on Francis Warden’s Ph.D. dissertation written at SBTS in 1938. Over the summer, I went to SBTS’s library and found the dissertation. It is still unpublished, but a summary of Warden’s conclusions appeared in April of 1953 in the journal Review & Expositor. Moody’s article appeared later that same year in December in the Journal of Biblical Literature.)

Many NT scholars view Moody’s article as the definitive word on MONOGENES, but I believe that Moody was wrong—really wrong. And here’s why.

1. Moody claims the suffix –GENES means “kind” without any notion of generation.

Moody is correct that the Greek suffix –GENES derives from the word GENOS. But Moody is wrong about the semantic range of GENOS and the suffix derived from it. In some contexts GENOS means “kind,” but in other contexts it means “offspring.” In fact, in John’s one use of the term GENOS, it clearly refers to “offspring” or “one that is begotten from another” (Revelation 22:16). “Offspring” is the only attested meaning for this term in John’s writings! Moody is also wrong about the semantic range of the –GENES suffix. There are many examples of this suffix that indicate “begottenness.” For example, OIKOGENES means “home-born” (Gen. 15:3 LXX). Paul uses the term EUGENES to mean “well-born” (1 Cor. 1:26). Again, Moody has misconstrued both the meaning of GENOS and the suffix derived from it.

2. Moody says that if John had meant “only-begotten” he would have used the term MONOGENNETOS.

Why does Moody claim that John would have used the term MONOGENNETOS, not MONOGENES, if he had meant “only begotten”? Because the former is derived from the verb GENNAO, which everyone agrees denotes generation. We’ve already seen that Moody is mistaken about GENOS, but he’s also mistaken about MONOGENNETOS. The term MONOGENNETOS does not appear to be attested in ancient Greek literature before the second century (it does not appear in Liddell-Scott’s lexicon). If John were to have used the term, he would have to have been the one to coin it. But why would John coin a new term when MONOGENES was ready at hand? This is a term, after all, that means “only-begotten” in numerous texts across ancient Greek literature (according to Lee Irons’s recent research in which he has located 60+ examples of MONOGENES in non-biblical Greek before the second century).

3. Moody argues that MONOGENES in Hebrews 11:17 cannot possibly mean “only-begotten.”

Moody cites Hebrews 11:17 as decisive evidence against the “only-begotten” interpretation of MONOGENES. Hebrews 11:17 says that “Abraham… was offering up his MONOGENES son.” Moody says that because Abraham had other children (e.g., Ishmael), the term can’t mean that Isaac was his “only begotten.” MONOGENES must indicate that Isaac was his “unique” son. But this is mistaken as well. The writer of Hebrews is specifically pointing out that Isaac is “uniquely begotten.” The author is showing incredible sensitivity to the wider context of Genesis in which Abraham had once questioned whether his heir would come from his own body (Gen. 15:2-4) and whether that heir from his own body would be Ishmael (Gen. 17:18, 21). “Begotten” addresses the first question, and “uniquely” addresses the second. In other words, the idea of “begottenness” is necessary in this context. Moody has this completely backwards.

4. Moody’s linguistic arguments are not sensitive to the context of John’s use of the term.

In every instance that John uses the term MONOGENES, it follows a passage/context in which he uses the term GENNAO to refer to the “new birth”—every single instance (see John 1:14, 18; 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). That is no accident. John is intentionally drawing a distinction between the new birth that we experience and the Son’s unique begottenness from the Father. John seems to be saying that while Christians have been “begotten” by the Holy Spirit, Jesus is the “uniquely begotten” Son of God. His “begottenness” is different from ours and indeed utterly without parallel.
 
It really does mean Unique.

Monogenes has two primary definitions, "pertaining to being the only one of its kind within a specific relationship" and "pertaining to being the only one of its kind or class, unique in kind". Its Greek meaning is often applied to mean "one of a kind, one and only". Monogenēs may be used as an adjective.

Luke 7:12-13: Now when he came nigh to the gate of the city, behold, there was a dead man carried out, the only (μονογενης) son of his mother, and she was a widow … And when the Lord saw her, he had compassion on her, and said unto her, Weep not.

Luke 8:41-42: And, behold, there came a man named Jairus, and he was a ruler of the synagogue: and he fell down at Jesus’ feet, and besought him that he would come into his house: for he had one only (μονογενης) daughter, about twelve years of age, and she lay a dying.

Luke 9.38: And, behold, a man of the company cried out, saying, Master, I beseech thee, look upon my son: for he is my only child (μονογενης).


“In the preface of the New King James Bible, we are told that the ‘literal’ meaning of MONOGENES… is ‘only begotten’… All of this is linguistic nonsense.”
–D. A. Carson, Exegetical Fallacies, p. 28 (see also pp. 30-31)

“‘Only-begotten’ fails the etymology test, as it would require a different word… MONOGENES derives instead from a different root, GENOS, leading to the meaning ‘one of a kind.'”
–Craig Keener, The Gospel of John, Vol. 1, pp. 412-13

“We should not read too much into ‘only begotten’… To English ears this sounds like a metaphysical relationship, but the Greek term means no more than ‘only,’ ‘unique.'”
–Leon Morris, The Gospel according to John, p. 93

“The emphasis is not that Jesus was ‘begotten’ of God, but that God had only one Son, and this ‘one and only’ Son he sent into the world…”
–Colin Kruse, The Letters of John, p. 159

There is little Greek justification for the translation of MONOGENES as ‘only begotten.'”
–Raymond Brown, The Gospel according to John (i-xii), p. 13
Jesus was born, however, which is doubtless why the bible uses "monogenes." This very important when establishing that Jesus came in the flesh, because one major heresy from the inception of Christianity asserted the Son/Christ wasn't "born" but descended upon the man Jesus.

"Some interpretations of the word "unique" attempt to preclude birth, yet the full Greek meaning is always in the context of a child (genes). A unique child is also a born child, hence the full meaning of the word "begotten" as found in John 3:16 (KJV), for example. In applying this to Christ's begottenness, He is unique (virgin birth, for example), but also still the Son of God by birth." Wiki.

“MONOGENES therefore means not ‘only begotten,’ but ‘one-of-a-kind’ son…”
–Andreas Kostenberger, John, p. 43
Unique is an adjective, and is a translation of the Greek word μόνος, but monogenes although an adjective is often used as if it was a noun. E.g. Luke 9.38. "for a 'monogenes' he is to me." In this sense monogenes infers "only-born [child]."

monogenes huios = "only born son."

γένος means "offspring, family, race, nation, kind." (People related contexts infer "birth").

The point is that "monogenes" must mean more than "unique" because it comprises of two words "mono" + "genes."

As I said, I could go on with a list of examples as long as my arm. New Testament scholars routinely dismiss the “only begotten” interpretation of MONOGENES.
There are no examples in the bible of monogenes precluding birth in a Father/Son context.

If the word "unique" (excluding birth) had been intended, the appropriate adjective in the Nicene Creed would have been μόνος.
 
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Journal of Biblical Literature:

Dale Moody, “God’s Only Son: The Translation of John 3:16 in the Revised Standard Version,” Journal of Biblical Literature 72, no. 4 (1953): 213–19.

Moody’s article defends the RSV’s translation of MONOGENES, arguing that “only begotten” is an etymological, linguistic, and historical error. He certainly was not the first one to have made this case, but his arguments in particular seem to have influenced at least two generations of New Testament scholarship. I think this is due in no small part to the fact that Moody’s article is the first one cited in BDAG’s entry on MONOGENES (BDAG is the most important and authoritative lexicon of New Testament words; see right). Anyone looking to BDAG for a definition of MONOGENES is going to be confronted with the non-generative interpretation of the term that is reflected in Moody’s article.

(One interesting historical note: Dale Moody was a professor at The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary during its former liberal era. Moody’s work is apparently based on Francis Warden’s Ph.D. dissertation written at SBTS in 1938. Over the summer, I went to SBTS’s library and found the dissertation. It is still unpublished, but a summary of Warden’s conclusions appeared in April of 1953 in the journal Review & Expositor. Moody’s article appeared later that same year in December in the Journal of Biblical Literature.)

Many NT scholars view Moody’s article as the definitive word on MONOGENES, but I believe that Moody was wrong—really wrong. And here’s why.

1. Moody claims the suffix –GENES means “kind” without any notion of generation.

Moody is correct that the Greek suffix –GENES derives from the word GENOS. But Moody is wrong about the semantic range of GENOS and the suffix derived from it. In some contexts GENOS means “kind,” but in other contexts it means “offspring.” In fact, in John’s one use of the term GENOS, it clearly refers to “offspring” or “one that is begotten from another” (Revelation 22:16). “Offspring” is the only attested meaning for this term in John’s writings! Moody is also wrong about the semantic range of the –GENES suffix. There are many examples of this suffix that indicate “begottenness.” For example, OIKOGENES means “home-born” (Gen. 15:3 LXX). Paul uses the term EUGENES to mean “well-born” (1 Cor. 1:26). Again, Moody has misconstrued both the meaning of GENOS and the suffix derived from it.

2. Moody says that if John had meant “only-begotten” he would have used the term MONOGENNETOS.

Why does Moody claim that John would have used the term MONOGENNETOS, not MONOGENES, if he had meant “only begotten”? Because the former is derived from the verb GENNAO, which everyone agrees denotes generation. We’ve already seen that Moody is mistaken about GENOS, but he’s also mistaken about MONOGENNETOS. The term MONOGENNETOS does not appear to be attested in ancient Greek literature before the second century (it does not appear in Liddell-Scott’s lexicon). If John were to have used the term, he would have to have been the one to coin it. But why would John coin a new term when MONOGENES was ready at hand? This is a term, after all, that means “only-begotten” in numerous texts across ancient Greek literature (according to Lee Irons’s recent research in which he has located 60+ examples of MONOGENES in non-biblical Greek before the second century).

3. Moody argues that MONOGENES in Hebrews 11:17 cannot possibly mean “only-begotten.”

Moody cites Hebrews 11:17 as decisive evidence against the “only-begotten” interpretation of MONOGENES. Hebrews 11:17 says that “Abraham… was offering up his MONOGENES son.” Moody says that because Abraham had other children (e.g., Ishmael), the term can’t mean that Isaac was his “only begotten.” MONOGENES must indicate that Isaac was his “unique” son. But this is mistaken as well. The writer of Hebrews is specifically pointing out that Isaac is “uniquely begotten.” The author is showing incredible sensitivity to the wider context of Genesis in which Abraham had once questioned whether his heir would come from his own body (Gen. 15:2-4) and whether that heir from his own body would be Ishmael (Gen. 17:18, 21). “Begotten” addresses the first question, and “uniquely” addresses the second. In other words, the idea of “begottenness” is necessary in this context. Moody has this completely backwards.

4. Moody’s linguistic arguments are not sensitive to the context of John’s use of the term.

In every instance that John uses the term MONOGENES, it follows a passage/context in which he uses the term GENNAO to refer to the “new birth”—every single instance (see John 1:14, 18; 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9). That is no accident. John is intentionally drawing a distinction between the new birth that we experience and the Son’s unique begottenness from the Father. John seems to be saying that while Christians have been “begotten” by the Holy Spirit, Jesus is the “uniquely begotten” Son of God. His “begottenness” is different from ours and indeed utterly without parallel.
Further to the above, I am informed that μοναδικός (not μόνος) is the Greek word for "unique." I accept that γεννάω (to be born) is not the same as γένος (offspring, progeny, kind), but it is a very closely related word. In the context of the Nicene creed, your argument is superfluous, as both words are adjacent to each other:

τὸν Υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ, τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων·
So the correlation between μονογενῆς and γεννάω is established by context. Here μονογενῆς is being decontextualized from its human-birth scenario, and made to apply to something occuring in heaven itself. There is no hint in the gospels that monogenes refers to other than the human Son. Thus the Logos (of God) is not itself described as "τὸν Υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ, τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων."

So this application of both
μονογενῆς and γεννάω to the Logos seems to be an extra-biblical invention of the Nicene Creed itself.
 
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Jesus was born, however, which is doubtless why the bible uses "monogenes." This very important when establishing that Jesus came in the flesh, because one major heresy from the inception of Christianity asserted the Son/Christ wasn't "born" but descended upon the man Jesus.

"Some interpretations of the word "unique" attempt to preclude birth, yet the full Greek meaning is always in the context of a child (genes). A unique child is also a born child, hence the full meaning of the word "begotten" as found in John 3:16 (KJV), for example. In applying this to Christ's begottenness, He is unique (virgin birth, for example), but also still the Son of God by birth." Wiki.


Unique is an adjective, and is a translation of the Greek word μόνος, but monogenes although an adjective is often used as if it was a noun. E.g. Luke 9.38. "for a 'monogenes' he is to me." In this sense monogenes infers "only-born [child]."

monogenes huios = "only born son."

γένος means "offspring, family, race, nation, kind." (People related contexts infer "birth").

The point is that "monogenes" must mean more than "unique" because it comprises of two words "mono" + "genes."


There are no examples in the bible of monogenes precluding birth in a Father/Son context.

If the word "unique" (excluding birth) had been intended, the appropriate adjective in the Nicene Creed would have been μόνος.
Wiki. really???
 
Further to the above, I am informed that μοναδικός (not μόνος) is the Greek word for "unique." I accept that γεννάω (to be born) is not the same as γένος (offspring, progeny, kind), but it is a very closely related word. In the context of the Nicene creed, your argument is superfluous, as both words are adjacent to each other:

τὸν Υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ, τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων·
So the correlation between μονογενῆς and γεννάω is established by context. Here μονογενῆς is being decontextualized from its human-birth scenario, and made to apply to something occuring in heaven itself. There is no hint in the gospels that monogenes refers to other than the human Son. Thus the Logos (of God) is not itself described as "τὸν Υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ, τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων."

So this application of both
μονογενῆς and γεννάω to the Logos seems to be an extra-biblical invention of the Nicene Creed itself.
You are using Modern Greek, not Biblical Greek. The difference is word endings I think. I am tired.


The Creed

Πιστεύομεν εἰς ἕνα Θεὸν Πατέρα παντοκράτορα
ποιητὴν οὐρανοῦ καὶ γῆς ὁρατῶν τε πάντων καὶ ἀοράτων·
καὶ εἰς ἕνα Κύριον Ἰησοῦν Χριστὸν
τὸν υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν Μονογενῆ,
τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων,
Φῶς ἐκ Φωτός,
Θεὸν ἀληθινὸν ἐκ Θεοῦ ἀληθινοῦ,


We believe in one God,
the Father almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all things visible and invisible;
And in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only begotten Son of God,
begotten from the Father before all ages,
light from light,
true God from true God,
begotten not made,
of one substance with the Father,
 
Further to the above, I am informed that μοναδικός (not μόνος) is the Greek word for "unique." I accept that γεννάω (to be born) is not the same as γένος (offspring, progeny, kind), but it is a very closely related word. In the context of the Nicene creed, your argument is superfluous, as both words are adjacent to each other:

τὸν Υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ, τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων·
So the correlation between μονογενῆς and γεννάω is established by context. Here μονογενῆς is being decontextualized from its human-birth scenario, and made to apply to something occuring in heaven itself. There is no hint in the gospels that monogenes refers to other than the human Son. Thus the Logos (of God) is not itself described as "τὸν Υἱὸν τοῦ Θεοῦ τὸν μονογενῆ, τὸν ἐκ τοῦ Πατρὸς γεννηθέντα πρὸ πάντων τῶν αἰώνων."

So this application of both
μονογενῆς and γεννάω to the Logos seems to be an extra-biblical invention of the Nicene Creed itself.
 
google only begotten Son Linguistic Analysis
Although this word is often translated “only begotten,” such a translation is misleading, since in English it appears to express a metaphysical relationship. The word in Greek was used of an only child (a son [Luke 7:12; 9:38] or a daughter [Luke 8:42]). It was also used of something unique (only one of its kind) such as the mythological Phoenix (1 Clement 25:2). From here it passes easily to a description of Isaac (Heb 11:17 and Josephus, Ant. 1.13.1 [1.222]) who was not Abraham’s only son, but was one-of-a-kind because he was the child of the promise. Thus the word means “one-of-a-kind” and is reserved for Jesus in the Johannine literature of the NT. While all Christians are children of God (τέκνα θεοῦ, tekna theou), Jesus is God’s Son in a unique, one-of-a-kind sense. The word is used in this way in all its uses in the Gospel of John (1:14, 18; 3:16, 18).

“A search of Thesaurus Linguae Graecae—a comprehensive database of ancient, Koine, and medieval Greek—reveals that the word monogenēs is used most basically and frequently in contexts having to do with biological offspring. Its fundamental meaning is ‘only begotten’ or ‘only child’ in the sense of having no siblings.” Though there are occasional uses of the term to mean something like “unique” or “one of a kind,” they’re often metaphorical. Context is key, and John’s five uses are all in the context of sonship.
 
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