Atheism doesn't exist in reality, because all knowledge of the truth and reality requires a belief in reality. And if atheism is just a lack of belief or unbelief, then atheism cannot be known to exist in reality. So, if you think atheism exists in reality, then that is just you demonstrating your own self-deception.
Atheism doesn't exist in reality.
- Thread starter Tercon
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Temujin
Active member
Well, you have certainly managed a powerful demonstration of self-deception.
Whatsisface
Active member
What comes first, knowledge or belief?
If belief is necessary in order to make the truth and reality known to us, then a belief in reality must occur before the truth is known to us in reality.
Whatsisface
Active member
How can I believe something i have no knowledge of?
rossum
Active member
So your disbelief in Thor, Durga and the Yellow Emperor does not exist. As a Christian you are presumably an atheist with respect to the vast majority of gods worshipped by humans. Are you wrong to disbelieve in all those gods?
What belief in reality do you have that you also have "no knowledge of" silly?
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Nope, as if I have no belief in "Thor, Durga and the Yellow Emperor", then I have no knowledge of their existence either.
Strawman, as I don't believe in the existence of any unbelief including atheism, when in reality ALL knowledge of the truth requires a belief in reality and not a lack of belief or unbelief, because in reality there is no knowledge graspable or knowable to be had in or from any unbelief. Why? Because belief is necessary (and not unbelief) to make the truth and reality known.
Temujin
Active member
Do you know everything that there is to be known? Is there no fact or object existing that you do not know about?
Whatsisface
Active member
You seem to have misunderstood me. I asked...
...to which you replied...
So you're saying that to know the truth and reality of something, i must first believe it. I'm asking how can I believe something before I know about it in truth and reality?
What I do know is that if belief is necessary in order to make ALL knowledge of the truth and reality known to us and the only way and place that is capable of making the truth and reality known to us is a believing mind, then the truth and reality must be the product of a believing mind. And you cannot show or demonstrate otherwise.
Nouveau
Active member
Baldness is just a lack of hair. Yet bald people exist in reality. How is this possible? What belief is required for bald people to exist?
Nouveau
Active member
No, you don't know that, and everyone has demonstrated otherwise.
Non sequitur, as if YOU "must first believe" something in reality before you can "know the truth and reality of something," then belief must come before any knowledge of the truth and reality, because it is our belief that makes the truth and reality known to us.
Whatsisface
Active member
What? That makes no sense. How can I believe the truth of say, Australia before I know about it?
Sure I know that in and about the truth and reality, because YOU (nor can anyone else) show another way or place outside of a believing mind that the truth and reality can be known and made known to exist. It is YOUR silence and ignorance of another way or place outside of a believing mind that insures me of the truth of my argument.
What knowledge of Australia do you have that YOU don't believe about it as well?
Nouveau
Active member
That's just not true, and you know it. You've been told a dozen times that MIPUST is an alternative location for existence. You need to try harder at being honest.
Diogenes
Member
Atheism, as a lack of a belief, refers to an individuals set of beliefs. The person exists. The person has a set of beliefs. The set does not include a belief in God. In that sense, it's not a knowledge claim of reality per se but rather a claim about a person's set of beliefs. In that sense, it's not a self-deception.