Baptism does not atone for sin.

[Saxon]

Leviticus 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

Definition of atonement
1: reparation for an offense or injury: SATISFACTION
a story of sin and atonement
He wanted to find a way to make atonement for his sins.
2: the reconciliation of God and humankind through the sacrificial death of Jesus Christ
3: Christian Science: the exemplifying of human oneness with God
4: obsolete: RECONCILIATION

Synonyms & Near Synonyms for atonement
amends, expiation, reparation
absolution, condonation, forgiveness, pardon, remission
compensation, damages, indemnification, indemnity, quittance, recompense, recoupment, redress, remuneration, reprisal(s), requital, restitution, satisfaction
compurgation
whitewash
acquittal, clearance, clearing, exculpation, exoneration, vindication
rebirth, regeneration, restoration
grace, redemption, salvation
cleansing, sanctification
alibi, apology, defense, excuse, justification, plea, reason
refund, reimbursement, repayment

It is the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for you. Blood, not water. Water baptism is after you are save by the blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

Matthew 26:28 for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Mark 14:24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.

Luke 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

Romans 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Hebrews 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Ephesians 2:13 but now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Hebrews 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

Hebrews 12:24 and to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Hebrews 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

1 Peter 1:2 elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

1 John 1:7 but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

 

[VDMA]

It is the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for you…

I agree (emphasis added) it’s the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for sinners. You can’t separate the blood of Jesus and His finished work on the cross from baptism. You have no baptism without Jesus. Holy Baptism is one of the means of which God gives faith, faith in the shedding of His blood for sinners, faith in Christ and His finished work. Holy Baptism is an objective means of grace.

Thread 'Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture'

Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture

Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture. Baptism saves…by the washing of water with the word. The sacrament of Holy baptism (sacraments imparts divine grace). Jesus defined baptism as an integral part of making disciples and commanded his followers to baptize in connection with God’s action...

forums.carm.org

 

[Saxon]

I agree it’s the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for sinners. You can’t separate the blood of Jesus and His finished work on the cross from baptism. You have no baptism without Jesus.

Thread 'Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture'

Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture

Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture. Baptism saves…by the washing of water with the word. The sacrament of Holy baptism (sacraments imparts divine grace). Jesus defined baptism as an integral part of making disciples and commanded his followers to baptize in connection with God’s action...

forums.carm.org

What takes away sin, the blood of Jesus or is it baptism? If the blood of Christ takes away the sins of the world, baptism can't cleanse you from what has already been removed.

1 John 2:2 and he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

Definition of propitiation
1: the act of gaining or regaining the favor or goodwill of someone or something : the act of propitiating : APPEASEMENT
a sacrifice in propitiation of the gods
… she showed every possible desire to conciliate him, and there was an air of humble propitiation in all she did, such as I have seen pervade the bearing of a child towards a hard master.
— Charles Dickens
2: something that propitiates or appeases
specifically : an atoning sacrifice

You say that you believe that it is the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for sinners. You don't seem to know what atonement means even though I included a definition and many synonyms for atonement. You would rather die in your church traditions than believe what the Bible is saying.

No, you can't separate the blood of Jesus and His finished work on the cross from baptism, because there is no biblical connection.

Hebrews 9:26 for then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

 

[VDMA]

What takes away sin, the blood of Jesus or is it baptism? If the blood of Christ takes away the sins of the world, baptism can't cleanse you from what has already been removed.

1 John 2:2 and he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

Definition of propitiation
1: the act of gaining or regaining the favor or goodwill of someone or something : the act of propitiating : APPEASEMENT
a sacrifice in propitiation of the gods
… she showed every possible desire to conciliate him, and there was an air of humble propitiation in all she did, such as I have seen pervade the bearing of a child towards a hard master.
— Charles Dickens
2: something that propitiates or appeases
specifically : an atoning sacrifice

You say that you believe that it is the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for sinners. You don't seem to know what atonement means even though I included a definition and many synonyms for atonement. You would rather die in your church traditions than believe what the Bible is saying.

No, you can't separate the blood of Jesus and His finished work on the cross from baptism, because there is no biblical connection.

Hebrews 9:26 for then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

You are trying to divorce Holy Baptism from Jesus. As a Confession Lutheran I cannot divorce Jesus from baptism because that would be unscriptural. There are promises attached to baptism (e.g. forgiveness of sins, washing, renewal, promise of the Holy Spirit). Where there is forgiveness of sins there is life. Faith trust in those promises received in baptism.

Baptism is one of the means in which God gives faith and applies the atonement…the blood of Jesus to sinners. All the finished work of Christ is received in Holy baptism and is received by faith. Baptism is something God does for us (emphasis added), it’s a gift, it’s an objective means of grace, baptism most certainly is not something we do God.

I conveniently linked to a thread I created on what baptism is and what baptism does according to sacred scripture. Title thread: 'Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture'.

All the baptismal passages; to cleaning, to washing, to rebirth, to renewal, all are baptismal references. Mere symbolism is not taught in sacred scripture. To trust in your baptism is to have faith and trust in the blood of Jesus and His atonement and His finish work on the cross. Baptism is not get all jail card to live a life of unrepentant sin, a baptized saint lives daily repentance and by faith.

Baptismal regeneration is the apostolic, historic biblical view of Holy baptism once delivered to the saints.

 

[Saxon]

You are trying to divorce Holy Baptism from Jesus. As a Confession Lutheran I cannot divorce Jesus from baptism because that would be unscriptural. There are promises attached to baptism (e.g. forgiveness of sins, washing, renewal, promise of the Holy Spirit). Where there is forgiveness of sins there is life. Faith trust in those promises received in baptism.

Forgiveness of sins, washing, renewal, promise of the Holy Spirit, is in the blood sacrifice of Jesus. Those promises are received in Christ. A Christian is baptised because they are a Christian, that is what Christians do.
Matthew 26:28 for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Baptism is one of the means in which God gives faith and applies the atonement…the blood of Jesus to sinners. All the finished work of Christ is received in Holy baptism and is received by faith. Baptism is something God does for us (emphasis added), it’s a gift, it’s an objective means of grace, baptism most certainly is not something we do God.

Man lives by faith from birth to death, it is the default operating system for man. the lower animals all live by instinct. Faith is before salvation. How can you be saved by grace through faith if it isn't there before you are saved? The last I saw, Jesus told us to go and do the baptising. Why would he say that and then go and do it himself?

2 Peter 2:12
But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction, (ESV)

I conveniently linked to a thread I created on what baptism is and what baptism does according to sacred scripture. Title thread: 'Holy Baptism according to Sacred Scripture'.

All the baptismal passages; to cleaning, to washing, to rebirth, to renewal, all are baptismal references. Mere symbolism is not taught in sacred scripture. To trust in your baptism is to have faith and trust in the blood of Jesus and His atonement and His finish work on the cross. Baptism is not get all jail card to live a life of unrepentant sin, a baptized saint lives daily repentance and by faith.

Baptismal regeneration is the apostolic, historic biblical view of Holy baptism once delivered to the saints.

Baptism always occurs AFTER salvation.

 

[VDMA]

Baptism always occurs AFTER salvation.

What do all the verbs describe in the baptism passages, is it something we do for God as the Baptist teach, or is it something God does for us as the Bible teaches? Well, the answer that question is obvious, Holy baptism is something God does for us as His work and His gift to us.

We baptize infants and then instruct them; we instruct adults and then baptize them.

With infants, we baptize them that God might give them faith. We instruct them that the faith God began (in baptism) may be nourished and sustained. We baptize those children whose parents request Baptism for them (we baptize infants of believers only). With adults, we instruct them and then baptize them. When Philip met the Ethiopian, he first told him the good news about Jesus. Then the Ethiopian requested Baptism for himself.

Baptism is necessary because God wills it, but a person could be saved without Baptism (as long as Baptism has not been despised).

Mat 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Luk 7:30 but the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected the purpose of God for themselves, not having been baptized by him.)

Baptism is something God does for us (emphasis added), it’s a gift, it’s an objective means of grace, baptism most certainly is not something we do for God as the Baptist teach. Holy Baptist is more than mere symbolism or a sign and seal into the visible church, it also gives life and salvation for all those who trust in the promises received in the baptism. It’s a objective means of grace.

You will find zero (emphasis on zero) Church Father or Councils that rejected baptismal regeneration. Baptismal regeneration is the apostolic, historic biblical view of Holy baptism once delivered to the saints.

 

[Saxon]

What do all the verbs describe in the baptism passages, is it something we do for God as the Baptist teach, or is it something God does for us as the Bible teaches? Well, the answer that question is obvious, Holy baptism is something God does for us as His work and His gift to us.

Matthew 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

You do not listen or believe what the Bible states. Jesus is plainly commanding that we (believers) go and do the baptising. Why would he send us to do what you claim he does? There is no consistency between the scriptures and what you claim is being said.

We baptize infants and then instruct them; we instruct adults and then baptize them.

A heavy emphasis on "we".

With infants, we baptize them that God might give them faith. We instruct them that the faith God began (in baptism) may be nourished and sustained. We baptize those children whose parents request Baptism for them (we baptize infants of believers only). With adults, we instruct them and then baptize them. When Philip met the Ethiopian, he first told him the good news about Jesus. Then the Ethiopian requested Baptism for himself.

As I said before, faith is from birth. We need faith before salvation as we are saved by grace through faith. Without faith in Christ there is no salvation. The problem with that is God has no grandchildren, we all com to answer the calling of God on our own as we respond. Your parents cannot respond for you, it is your own personal decision.

Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
(Note that the condition of being baptized in water is that you must be a believer (saved))

Baptism is necessary because God wills it, but a person could be saved without Baptism (as long as Baptism has not been despised).

The fact that you can be saved without baptism, as you say, should open your eyes to the fact that baptism does not save. God is no respecter of persons, he treats all the same. He does not require some to be baptised and then just skip it with others. Show the scripture for your bracketed statement.

Mat 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Just to repeat, You do not listen or believe what the Bible states. Jesus is plainly commanding the we (believers) go and do the baptising. Why would he send us to do what you claim he does? There is no consistency between the scriptures and what you claim is being said.

Luk 7:30 but the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected the purpose of God for themselves, not having been baptized by him.)

You are out of context. This is speaking of John's (John the Baptists) baptism, and has absolutely nothing to do with the baptism that Jesus commanded. Two different baptisms with two different purposes.

Baptism is something God does for us (emphasis added), it’s a gift, it’s an objective means of grace, baptism most certainly is not something we do for God as the Baptist teach. Holy Baptist is more than mere symbolism or a sign and seal into the visible church, it also gives life and salvation for all those who trust in the promises received in the baptism. It’s a objective means of grace.

I totally disagree. I want to see scripture that states it as you claim, book, chapter and verse.

You will find zero (emphasis on zero) Church Father or Councils that rejected baptismal regeneration. Baptismal regeneration is the apostolic, historic biblical view of Holy baptism once delivered to the saints.

And you will find zero church fathers that are inspired of God that are without error. When they say something that is contrary to the Bible, the Bible is correct and the church fathers are wrong, not right and in total error.

2 Timothy 3:15 and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2 Timothy 3:17 that the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

All scripture is given by inspiration of God; not all theology writings. You are gambling away you salvation on 1500 years of corrupt writings of corrupt writers and ignoring the inspired eye witnesses that wrote the scriptures as they were moved by God!

 

[Slyzr]

What do all the verbs describe in the baptism passages, is it something we do for God as the Baptist teach, or is it something God does for us as the Bible teaches? Well, the answer that question is obvious, Holy baptism is something God does for us as His work and His gift to us.

We baptize infants and then instruct them; we instruct adults and then baptize them.

With infants, we baptize them that God might give them faith. We instruct them that the faith God began (in baptism) may be nourished and sustained. We baptize those children whose parents request Baptism for them (we baptize infants of believers only). With adults, we instruct them and then baptize them. When Philip met the Ethiopian, he first told him the good news about Jesus. Then the Ethiopian requested Baptism for himself.

Baptism is necessary because God wills it, but a person could be saved without Baptism (as long as Baptism has not been despised).

Mat 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Luk 7:30 but the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected the purpose of God for themselves, not having been baptized by him.)

Baptism is something God does for us (emphasis added), it’s a gift, it’s an objective means of grace, baptism most certainly is not something we do for God as the Baptist teach. Holy Baptist is more than mere symbolism or a sign and seal into the visible church, it also gives life and salvation for all those who trust in the promises received in the baptism. It’s a objective means of grace.

You will find zero (emphasis on zero) Church Father or Councils that rejected baptismal regeneration. Baptismal regeneration is the apostolic, historic biblical view of Holy baptism once delivered to the saints.

Natural baptism is a woman giving birth.

The other baptism is not.

 

[BJ Bear]

Leviticus 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

Definition of atonement
1: reparation for an offense or injury: SATISFACTION
a story of sin and atonement
He wanted to find a way to make atonement for his sins.
2: the reconciliation of God and humankind through the sacrificial death of Jesus Christ
3: Christian Science: the exemplifying of human oneness with God
4: obsolete: RECONCILIATION

Synonyms & Near Synonyms for atonement
amends, expiation, reparation
absolution, condonation, forgiveness, pardon, remission
compensation, damages, indemnification, indemnity, quittance, recompense, recoupment, redress, remuneration, reprisal(s), requital, restitution, satisfaction
compurgation
whitewash
acquittal, clearance, clearing, exculpation, exoneration, vindication
rebirth, regeneration, restoration
grace, redemption, salvation
cleansing, sanctification
alibi, apology, defense, excuse, justification, plea, reason
refund, reimbursement, repayment

It is the blood that Jesus shed for you on the cross that makes the atonement for you. Blood, not water. Water baptism is after you are save by the blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

Matthew 26:28 for this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Mark 14:24 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many.

Luke 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you.

Romans 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Hebrews 9:22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Ephesians 2:13 but now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Hebrews 10:19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

Hebrews 12:24 and to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Hebrews 13:20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

1 Peter 1:2 elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

1 John 1:7 but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

Baptism unites the one baptized to Christ, therefore, baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ. Or so Scripture says and some people believe it.

To say that Scripture doesn't say that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ is to in KJV terms make God the liar and sinful man the truth teller.

 

[JonHawk]

“John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” Acts 19:4

Baptism unites the one baptized to Christ, therefore, baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ. Or so Scripture says and some people believe it.

To say that Scripture doesn't say that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ is to in KJV terms make God the liar and sinful man the truth teller.

Beginning from the baptism of John to that day when He was taken up from us, one of these must become a witness with us of His resurrection. Acts 1:22

By this faith you are saved [reborn from above]
For I passed on to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day ...

And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is fruitless and powerless; you are still in bondage, under the dominion of sin, dead in your sins. 1 Cor 15

God raised us up from death when He raised up Christ Jesus. He has shown us His loving-kindness through Christ Jesus. Eph 2:5-7 NLV
Through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. Rom 5:1-2
So that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe... that by faith we receive the promise of the Spirit.
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Gal 3
This water symbolizes baptism that now saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22 who has gone into heaven and is at God’s right hand—one Lord above all. 1 Peter 3

The Priestly Prayer of Jesus
1 After this, Jesus raised his eyes to heaven and said, “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son,
so that your Son may glorify you, 2 since you have given him authority over all people,
so that he may give eternal life to all those you have given him.
3 And eternal life is this: to know you, the only true God, and the one you have sent, Jesus Christ. John 17

 

[BJ Bear]

“John’s baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” Acts 19:4

Beginning from the baptism of John to that day when He was taken up from us, one of these must become a witness with us of His resurrection. Acts 1:22

By this faith you are saved [reborn from above]
For I passed on to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day ...

And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is fruitless and powerless; you are still in bondage, under the dominion of sin, dead in your sins. 1 Cor 15

God raised us up from death when He raised up Christ Jesus. He has shown us His loving-kindness through Christ Jesus. Eph 2:5-7 NLV
Through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. Rom 5:1-2
So that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe... that by faith we receive the promise of the Spirit.
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. Gal 3
This water symbolizes baptism that now saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22 who has gone into heaven and is at God’s right hand—one Lord above all. 1 Peter 3

The Priestly Prayer of Jesus
1 After this, Jesus raised his eyes to heaven and said, “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son,
so that your Son may glorify you, 2 since you have given him authority over all people,
so that he may give eternal life to all those you have given him.
3 And eternal life is this: to know you, the only true God, and the one you have sent, Jesus Christ. John 17

Is that a long way to say that you agree with Peter and the rest of Scripture that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ?

If it is not an agreement then where do you find in the passages you cited a contradiction or exclusion to baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ?

 

[JonHawk]

Is that a long way to say that you agree with Peter and the rest of Scripture that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ?

I certainly agree with Peter and the rest of Scripture that we are saved through the death and resurrection of Christ.
A Heavenly Inheritance
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has granted us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, 1 Peter 1

If it is not an agreement then where do you find in the passages you cited a contradiction or exclusion to baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ?

Obviously the contradiction is rooted in those who are saying,
"Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished; 2 Peter 3

Hear the Heavenly Voice
Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant,...
See that you do not refuse Him who speaks. For if they did not escape who refused Him who spoke on earth,
much more shall we not escape if we turn away from Him who speaks from heaven, Heb 12:24-25

 

[BJ Bear]

I certainly agree with Peter and the rest of Scripture that we are saved through the death and resurrection of Christ.
A Heavenly Inheritance
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His abundant mercy has granted us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, 1 Peter 1

There is no contradiction or exclusion here in the text itself.

Obviously the contradiction is rooted in those who are saying,
"Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished; 2 Peter 3

There is no contradiction or exclusion here in the text itself and you have failed to state the actual contradiction you claim to see.

Hear the Heavenly Voice
Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant,...
See that you do not refuse Him who speaks. For if they did not escape who refused Him who spoke on earth,
much more shall we not escape if we turn away from Him who speaks from heaven, Heb 12:24-25

There is also no contradiction or exclusion stated here in the text itself.

A person won't reach a right understanding of Scripture by taking bits and pieces out of context to try and assert what Scripture doesn't say in it's God given perfect immediate context.

 

[JonHawk]

There is no contradiction or exclusion here in the text itself.

There is no contradiction or exclusion here in the text itself and you have failed to state the actual contradiction you claim to see.

There is also no contradiction or exclusion stated here in the text itself.

A person won't reach a right understanding of Scripture by taking bits and pieces out of context to try and assert what Scripture doesn't say in it's God given perfect immediate context.

You're preaching to the choir.

We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.1 John 5:20

 

[JonHawk]

And this is what he promised us—eternal life. 1 John 2:24-26

BJ Bear said:
There is no contradiction or exclusion here in the text itself.

There is no contradiction or exclusion here in the text itself and you have failed to state the actual contradiction you claim to see.

There is also no contradiction or exclusion stated here in the text itself.
A person won't reach a right understanding of Scripture by taking bits and pieces out of context to try and assert what Scripture doesn't say in it's God given perfect immediate context.

You're preaching to the choir. "These are they which testify of Me." (John 5:38-40)

We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.1 John 5:20

 

[BJ Bear]

You're preaching to the choir.

We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.1 John 5:20

Then you should acknowledge, if only to yourself, that your previous claim of contradiction is without scriptural merit and false.

 

[BJ Bear]

And this is what he promised us—eternal life. 1 John 2:24-26

Then don't deny the manner in which God says He unites us to the Eternal Life, incarnate, crucified, and raised for all men.

You're preaching to the choir. "These are they which testify of Me." (John 5:38-40)

We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.1 John 5:20

Amen. Obviously, John also believed, taught, and confessed that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ.

 

[JonHawk]

And this is what he promised us—eternal life. 1 John 2:24-26

You're preaching to the choir. "These are they which testify of Me." (John 5:38-40)

We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.1 John 5:20

Then you should acknowledge, if only to yourself, that your previous claim of contradiction is without scriptural merit and false.

How about if you acknowledge that you concurred thrice openly, that there were no claims of contradictions in the texts posted.

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"I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly." John 10:10-11

Then don't deny the manner in which God says He unites us to the Eternal Life, incarnate, crucified, and raised for all men.

'Now the just shall live by faith; But if anyone draws back, My soul has no pleasure in him.' Heb 10:37-38

Amen. Obviously, John also believed, taught, and confessed that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ.

In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him. 1 Jn 4:9-10
By this we know that we abide in Him, and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.
We have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son to be the Savior of the world. 1 John 4:13-14

 

[Saxon]

Baptism unites the one baptized to Christ, therefore, baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ. Or so Scripture says and some people believe it.

To say that Scripture doesn't say that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ is to in KJV terms make God the liar and sinful man the truth teller.

1 Peter 3;21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

What is the "like figure"? The like figure of baptism is the death burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. This is an act of grace. (See Ephesians 2:8 and 9) For by grace are you saved; not baptism.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians 2:9 not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[JonHawk]

1 Peter 3;21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

What is the "like figure"? The like figure of baptism is the death burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. This is an act of grace. (See Ephesians 2:8 and 9) For by grace are you saved; not baptism.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians 2:9 not of works, lest any man should boast.

Now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Gal 3