Being Forgiven

[brightfame52]

Regarding the bolded red:
That is a false doctrine because that is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you have just posted.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you have posted. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . . BEFORE
you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for who Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
(By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for who Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ dies are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

``

No its not false. They have forgiveness through the Blood of Christ. Matt 26 28. Another great verse Eph 1 7

in whom[Christs death] we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

 

[JAG]

No its not false. They have forgiveness through the Blood of Christ. Matt 26 28. Another great verse Eph 1 7

in whom[Christs death] we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Regarding your posts in this thread as noted below:
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for who Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

 

[brightfame52]

Regarding your posts in this thread as noted below:
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for who Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

The sinners Christ died for have the forgiveness of sins through His Blood. They don't do anything for it. They're born with it.

 

[JAG]

The sinners Christ died for have the forgiveness of sins through His Blood. They don't do anything for it. They're born with it.

Regarding the bolded red: False. They are NOT "born with it."
Also regarding your posts in this thread as noted below:
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they were
born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

``

 

[brightfame52]

Regarding the bolded red: False. They are NOT "born with it."
Also regarding your posts in this thread as noted below:
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they were
born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

``

They are born with it. Christ shed His Blood for before they were born.

 

[JAG]

They are born with it. Christ shed His Blood for before they were born.

Regarding your posts in this thread as noted below and noted up-thread.
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they were
born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

 

[Cynthia]

I did not see these verses on the list.

For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. Matthew 6:14-15

and how does God forgive us?

After we have repented. Those who have not repented are not forgiven in advance.

 

[brightfame52]

Regarding your posts in this thread as noted below and noted up-thread.
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they were
born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

Christ blood gave them forgiveness of sins conditioned on His Blood. They were not born yet but Christ still shed His Blood for them. That is what matters.

 

[JAG]

Christ blood gave them forgiveness of sins conditioned on His Blood. They were not born yet but Christ still shed His Blood for them. That is what matters.

The chronological order of the events within the salvation process matters ALSO.

The chronological order is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER our conversion
{or simultaneously at the time of our conversion} we are forgiven.

The people for whom Christ died are NOT forgiven BEFORE they are converted
and they are NOT forgiven WHEN they enter this world at birth.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are
forgiven BEFORE conversion or forgiven WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

``

 

[brightfame52]

The chronological order of the events within the salvation process matters ALSO.

The chronological order is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER our conversion
{or simultaneously at the time of our conversion} we are forgiven.

The people for whom Christ died are NOT forgiven BEFORE they are converted
and they are NOT forgiven WHEN they enter this world at birth.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are
forgiven BEFORE conversion or forgiven WHEN they enter this world.

JAG

``

Christ death alone , His Blood accomplished forgiveness of sins for the many. They're forgiven. Whether they been born or not. All that matters is the blood.

 

[JAG]

Christ death alone , His Blood accomplished forgiveness of sins for the many. They're forgiven. Whether they been born or not. All that matters is the blood.

Regarding your posts in this thread as noted below and noted up-thread.
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they were
born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet.

JAG

PS
You have lost all credibility and you are doing serious damage to yourself by teaching your
FALSE doctrines. If there are any people reading this thread, you have lost all credibility with
what you have posted in this thread. You only hurt yourself and your reputation when
you continue to teach FALSE and ABSURD doctrine such as "they are forgiven whether they
have been born or not" -- that is an ABSURD doctrine. They do not even exist before they are
born.

``

 

[brightfame52]

Regarding your posts in this thread as noted below and noted up-thread.
You teach FALSE doctrines.
You teach false doctrines because your false doctrine is NOT the way the New Testament
presents the gospel and the plan of salvation.

There is not a single Bible verse that actually says what you teach.

The New Testament teaches the very opposite of what you teach. The chronological order
is to be converted FIRST and then AFTER {or simultaneously} you are forgiven and NOT . . .
BEFORE you are converted and NOT when you enter this world.

There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they were
born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine
destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet.

JAG

PS
You have lost all credibility and you are doing serious damage to yourself by teaching your
FALSE doctrines. If there are any people reading this thread, you have lost all credibility with
what you have posted in in this thread. You only hurt yourself and your reputation when you
continue to teach FALSE and ABSURD doctrine.

``

Jesus Christ is Salvation. His Blood gives forgiveness of sins Matt 26 28. It's that simple.

 

[JAG]

Jesus Christ is Salvation. His Blood gives forgiveness of sins Matt 26 28. It's that simple.

You teach FALSE doctrines by MIXING your FALSE doctrines with truth.
See your false doctrines up-thread.

You have lost all credibility and you are doing serious damage to yourself by teaching your
FALSE doctrines. If there are any people reading this thread, you have lost all credibility with
what you have posted in this thread. You only hurt yourself and your reputation when
you continue to teach FALSE and ABSURD doctrine such as "they are forgiven whether they
have been born or not" -- that is an ABSURD doctrine. They do not even exist before they are
born.

_____________________


There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they
were born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false
doctrine destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation
is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet.

JAG


``

 

[brightfame52]

You teach FALSE doctrines by MIXING your FALSE doctrines with truth.
See your false doctrines up-thread.

You have lost all credibility and you are doing serious damage to yourself by teaching your
FALSE doctrines. If there are any people reading this thread, you have lost all credibility with
what you have posted in this thread. You only hurt yourself and your reputation when
you continue to teach FALSE and ABSURD doctrine such as "they are forgiven whether they
have been born or not" -- that is an ABSURD doctrine. They do not even exist before they are
born.

_____________________


There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they
were born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false
doctrine destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how salvation
is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet.

JAG


``

My Doctrine is Christ and His Blood Matt 26 28. If you call that false doctrine shame on you.

 

[JAG]

My Doctrine is Christ and His Blood Matt 26 28. If you call that false doctrine shame on you.

You teach FALSE doctrines by MIXING your FALSE
doctrines with truth.
See your false doctrines up-thread.

You have lost all credibility and you are doing serious damage to yourself by teaching your
FALSE doctrines. If there are any people reading this thread, you have lost all credibility with
what you have posted in this thread. You only hurt yourself and your reputation when
you continue to teach FALSE and ABSURD doctrine such as "they are forgiven whether they
have been born or not" -- that is an ABSURD doctrine. They do not even exist before they are
born.

_____________________


There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they
were born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false
doctrine destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how
salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet.

JAG

 

[brightfame52]

You teach FALSE doctrines by MIXING your FALSE
doctrines with truth.
See your false doctrines up-thread.

You have lost all credibility and you are doing serious damage to yourself by teaching your
FALSE doctrines. If there are any people reading this thread, you have lost all credibility with
what you have posted in this thread. You only hurt yourself and your reputation when
you continue to teach FALSE and ABSURD doctrine such as "they are forgiven whether they
have been born or not" -- that is an ABSURD doctrine. They do not even exist before they are
born.

_____________________


There is NOT a single Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven WHEN
they enter this world. THAT is something that YOU made up out of your imagination. See up-thread
where you said they were forgiven WHEN they entered this world. That is False doctrine.

It is incorrect to use "logic" to reach a conclusion that is not supported by a single Bible verse.

And there is not even one {1} Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were
forgiven BEFORE they were converted or WHRN they entered this world. There is not a single
Bible verse that says the people for whom Christ died were born with forgiveness. If they
were born with forgiveness they would never need to pray the sinner's prayer because they were,
on your lights, saved at the time they were born. You teach false doctrine. Your false
doctrine destroys the New Testaments chronological order of how
salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet.

JAG

Christ blood is that which gives forgiveness. He died and put away sins of those He died for. They did not have to be born for Christ to die for their sins. Neither did they have to be born for their sins He died for to be forgiven.

 

[JAG]

Christ blood is that which gives forgiveness. He died and put away sins of those He died for. They did not have to be born for Christ to die for their sins. Neither did they have to be born for their sins He died for to be forgiven.

You teach FALSE doctrines by MIXING your FALSE
doctrines with truth.
See your false doctrines up-thread.

JAG

 

[brightfame52]

You teach FALSE doctrines by MIXING your FALSE
doctrines with truth.
See your false doctrines up-thread.

JAG

Did people have to be born in order for Christ to die for their sins?

 

[JAG]

Did people have to be born in order for Christ to die for their sins?

Your false doctrines have laid the foundation for you to ask absurd questions
{and to reach ABSURD conclusions.} This is what happens when you embrace FALSE doctrines.

People that have not been born do not exist. Christ cannot die for people that do not exist.
You have also said up-thread that people were forgiven BEFORE they were converted. This is a FALSE
doctrine. Nobody can be forgiven BEFORE they are converted to faith in Christ as their Savior.

You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine destroys the New Testament's
chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet and therefore do not exist.

JAG

``

 

[Redeemed]

Your false doctrines have laid the foundation for you to ask absurd questions
{and to reach ABSURD conclusions.} This is what happens when you embrace FALSE doctrines.

People that have not been born do not exist. Christ cannot die for people that do not exist.
You have also said up-thread that people were forgiven BEFORE they were converted. This is a FALSE
doctrine. Nobody can be forgiven BEFORE they are converted to faith in Christ as their Savior.

You teach false doctrine. Your false doctrine destroys the New Testament's
chronological order of how salvation is actually realized.
Here are the chronological steps:

Step One.
{1} We are born sinners and in need of a Savior.
By the way, if we were ALREADY saved at birth we would then NOT need to be saved
and ALL the Bible verses that say we need to be saved would be nonsense because on
your lights we are ALREADY saved WHEN we enter this world and so we would NEVER
need to pray the sinner's prayer because we are ALREADY saved at birth.
You teach FALSE doctrine.

Step Two.
{2} When we sincerely pray the sinner's prayer, then we are saved and NOT before we pray
the sinner's prayer.

You are teaching a false doctrine and you have been shown why it is false and yet you
are locked down on your false doctrine. Was it not YOU who mentioned being answerable
to Christ? I suggest you recant your false doctrine. You are not doing Christianity any good
by teaching the false doctrine that says the people for whom Christ died are forgiven BEFORE
they are converted and the false doctrine that the people for whom Christ died are forgiven
WHEN they enter this world.

Your statement "they are forgiven whether they have been born or not" is not only a
FALSE doctrine, it is also an ABSURD doctrine. It is 100% ABSURD to teach that people can be
forgiven when they have not even been born yet and therefore do not exist.

JAG

``

If you are forgiven before you were born you wouldn't even need to be forgiven Ever again. It would be a done deal. But we know it doesn't work that way. It's in the Bible. And where would sanctification fit into that theory. And what would happen when we do sin? It wouldn't count because we were forgiven before we were born?

1 John 1:7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
8If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

So according the first John 1:7 we need the blood of Jesus to cleanse us from all sin past, present, future. That happens when I'm walking in the light. When I accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior. Before I knew Jesus I was walking in the darkness my sins were not forgiven.

Verse eight says that if I say I have no sin I'm a liar. Well if I was forgiven before I was born I wouldn't have any sin. How can I be a liar if I was forgiven? If God forgave me before I was born and now that I'm born Do I fall back into being a sinner. Well that forgiveness didn't work too good did it? So that just doesn't work.

First nine says I need to confess my sin and then what is God Going to do he's faithful and just to forgive us our sins to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. That sounds like it's happening in the present to me. If all my sins were forgiven before I was born why would I need to confess my sin why... would I need to be forgiven... why Would I need to be cleansed of all unrighteousness? So that just doesn't work either.

JAG Is spot on.

I think that Before we were born bucket has too many holes in it. It's not holding any water. The order of salvation makes more sense to me. Paul tells us that those whom God foreknew He also predestined. Predestined means it hasn't happened yet for sure it's going to happen (inevitability) but it hasn't happened yet. So if you're not born yet and your predestined, when you're born at some point in your life you're going to come to Christ your sins are going to be forgiven Your Going to be born again you Will be walking in the light... Bam