By nature we are separated from God!

[Gary Mac]

Let's stop beating around the bush; gnosticism is what you described as illumination through another spirit at the tree of knowledge.

His way always is gnostic for you as you continually accuse Him of. You think I wrote the Bible for all I do is repeat to you that what Jesus said you would be if you followed him to his God he called Father.

You think His knowledge is a tree, I have news for you His knowledge is by His Spirit, mind, be in you as He was in Jesus. But because Jesus teachings are gnosticism, you go without.

You're entitled to your gnostic opinions.

So are you about your beliefs of He is gnostic.

For what if some did not believe?

It isn't a what if, you are perfect example.

Will their unbelief make the faithfulness of God without effect?

Absolutely. He can do noting in you because to you His ways are gnostic and you just do not believe Him in His ways.

4 Certainly not! Indeed, let God be true but every gnostic a liar. Rom 3

You should let God come into you as Jesus did in Matt 3:16, that way you can drop your beliefs that His ways are gnostic.

Now God has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

Nope' God came to me the same way He came to Jesus. Adam, Moses, Abraham, 120 by His Spirit where we are not appointed heir of all things, but has receieved His gifts of having His same mind, the mind of Christ to be Gods anointed yourself and have in us all that He is.

3 The Son is the radiance of God’s divine glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. Heb 1

And I am His son for sure, exact image of His being and sustain all things by the power of His mind, Spirit, be my own where when I saw Him as He is I became exactly like Him, 1 John 3 and has sat down with Him in His throne Rev 3:21. For just as with Jesus I have overcome the teachings of man and has lost God do that work in me where I am not of self but of God and walk in His power of mind.

You dont have a clue what that means.

 

[JonHawk]

His way always is gnostic for you as you continually accuse Him of. You think I wrote the Bible for all I do is repeat to you that what Jesus said

You clearly have your own interpretation where in your corrupt gnostic mind you claim your jesus is a sinner who was regenerated in Gen 3:22
and run amok blabbing about receiving the same spirit at the tree of knowledge.

You think His knowledge is a tree, I have news for you His knowledge is by His Spirit,....

You obviously can't fathom that the gift of the Spirit is granted to all believers based on faith, Eph 1:13.

 

[Tercon]

But beliefs are not real, one can believer anything about a god. The only truth in the God who Jesus obeyed and prayed to is if He is manifest in you, come to life in you to have His same mind, or Spirit it is called, and walk in it as He walks in it.

Stop for a minute and think about what you are saying here.

Does Jesus "believe anything about a God"? Does Jesus believe the Father?

And if "beliefs are not real" and according to the Bible belief is God's ordained mode of communication with His children, also known as believers, then what does that say about your reasoning in this matter?

 

[Tercon]

And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace. Rom 11:6

But God's grace is received by belief as well and belief isn't based on the works of man, belief is a gift of God, belief is God's ordained mode of communication with His children, also known as believers.

 

[JonHawk]

JonHawk said:
And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace. Rom 11:6

But God's grace is received by belief as well and belief isn't based on the works of man, belief is a gift of God, belief is God's ordained mode of communication with His children, also known as believers.

So that you may know what is the exceeding greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the working of His mighty power 20 which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand; Eph 1

Even when we were dead in trespasses, God made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), Eph 2:5

Therefore, brothers and sisters, be sure to confirm your call and election so that and you will never be lost. 2 Peter 1:10

 

[Gary Mac]

Stop for a minute and think about what you are saying here.

Indeed all should do that for sure.

Does Jesus "believe anything about a God"? Does Jesus believe the Father?

Nope' if Jesus only believed in a god with no reality of His being he would have been like most here in this forum who has a belief for their god, some believe they. have tree of them. Jim Jones and David Koresh said the believed in God did they Not? What is the reality in their beliefs for God?

And if "beliefs are not real" and according to the Bible belief is God's ordained mode of communication with His children, also known as believers, then what does that say about your reasoning in this matter?

Belief is not a mode for communication at all. The only communication one can have with God is prayer. Prayer is is communication with God, not dictating to Him ones own desires.

When Jesus took his disciples up on the mountain to pray he said the most profound and simple statement, he said, watch WITH me, not for me. How many here are watching for Him to come instead of with Him this day as Jesus did AFTER Matt 3:16.

Before Matt 3:16 Jesus only had a belief about a god and preached it in the temples even from a young age. Can you not see the difference in his beliefs for a god before Matt 3:16 and the laws of that temple he once taught to regulate that belief from what happened in Matt 3:16 that was not a belief but the manifestation of?

Without the manifestation of God coming to you and putting in you His anointing, Christ in you by His Spirit and open to you who He really is and all of His heaven, all that you have is a belief about Him regulated by the laws of what ever establishment one is of.

If God had to come to Jesus and open up in him who He is and all of His heaven -- What makes you exempt from the same ... beliefs instead?

Which belief is correct?
Catholics beliefs for a god?
Mormons beliefs for a god?
Penticostals beliefs for a god?
Muslims beliefs for a god?
Hindues?
Baptists?
COCs,
AOGs?

Which of these beliefs is the right one? There is no reality of God in any one these only a belief about one.

One cant know who God is at all without knowing Him one on one as Jesus was introduced to Him in Matt 3:16 yourselves.

If you think Jesus only had a belief for a god then I do understand why beliefs are your gods instead of the One who does manifest Himself in Man to have His same mind and walk in it as He walks in it with the same signs following. Jesus referred to this manifestation of God to have His same Mind, or Spirit it is called, as born again, ye must be born agin as he was in Matt 3;16 or you never will know who God really is at all and only believe certain things about him.

 

[Gary Mac]

But God's grace is received by belief as well and belief isn't based on the works of man, belief is a gift of God, belief is God's ordained mode of communication with His children, also known as believers.

Actually grace is received from God Himself that we may have His same mind of grace and walk in it as He walks in it just as Jesus received His grace in Matt 3:16 ands we exchange grace for grace, and what a novel idea that is.

 

[JonHawk]

Belief is not a mode for communication at all.

“Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” Rom 10:13

Which belief is correct?

We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, Acts 15:11

Actually grace is received from God Himself ... we exchange grace for grace, and what a novel idea that is.

We have seen the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:12-14

 

[Tercon]

JonHawk said:
And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace. Rom 11:6

So that you may know what is the exceeding greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the working of His mighty power 20 which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand; Eph 1

Even when we were dead in trespasses, God made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), Eph 2:5

Therefore, brothers and sisters, be sure to confirm your call and election so that and you will never be lost. 2 Peter 1:10

Do you think belief is "works" and originated in you?

 

[Tercon]

Actually grace is received from God Himself that we may have His same mind of grace and walk in it as He walks in it just as Jesus received His grace in Matt 3:16 ands we exchange grace for grace, and what a novel idea that is.

How can you "have His same mind of grace" without believing in accordance with Him or believing as He believes?

 

[Tercon]

Indeed all should do that for sure.

Nope' if Jesus only believed in a god with no reality of His being he would have been like most here in this forum who has a belief for their god, some believe they. have tree of them. Jim Jones and David Koresh said the believed in God did they Not? What is the reality in their beliefs for God?

Strawman. The truth and reality comes from God and not man.

Belief is not a mode for communication at all. The only communication one can have with God is prayer. Prayer is is communication with God, not dictating to Him ones own desires.

How about "faith", is that at belief?

When Jesus took his disciples up on the mountain to pray he said the most profound and simple statement, he said, watch WITH me, not for me. How many here are watching for Him to come instead of with Him this day as Jesus did AFTER Matt 3:16.

We need to believe in accordance with Christ in order to know God and His Kingdom as Christ does.

Before Matt 3:16 Jesus only had a belief about a god and preached it in the temples even from a young age. Can you not see the difference in his beliefs for a god before Matt 3:16 and the laws of that temple he once taught to regulate that belief from what happened in Matt 3:16 that was not a belief but the manifestation of?

And after Matt 3:16 Christ still believed.

Without the manifestation of God coming to you and putting in you His anointing, Christ in you by His Spirit and open to you who He really is and all of His heaven, all that you have is a belief about Him regulated by the laws of what ever establishment one is of.

That's unbiblical at best. According the the Bible belief is how God makes Himself known to believers.

 

[Gary Mac]

“Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” Rom 10:13

But first you must call on the Lord as Jesus did to receieve His salvation. See Matt 3:16 this is when Jesus yielded to Gods salvation.

You dont know what Gods salvation is do you?

We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, Acts 15:11

I received the same grace that Jesus received form God in Matt 3:16.

We have seen the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:12-14

And we all who has seen Him He is are like Him. 1 John 3. Jesus saw Him in Matt 3:16. You dont know what that Intel's do you?

 

[Gary Mac]

Strawman. The truth and reality comes from God and not man.

That is what I just said. Wihout the reality of God manifest in you then all you have is a believe about a god.

How about "faith", is that at belief?

Nope, faith will produce anything that you are determined to produce.

We need to believe in accordance with Christ in order to know God and His Kingdom as Christ does.

Actually one needs to receive from God that what Jesus did in Matt 3:16 in order to know who God is and all of His heaven.

Are you exempt from the same as Jesus received from God in Matt 3:16? If so you put yourself above Him.

And after Matt 3:16 Christ still believed.

Christ is not a belief LOL. Christ is Gods anointing in you, or is supposed to be anointed of Gods Spirit to walk as He walks in His same light with the same signs following. They dont follow you do they? You are trying to explain away that what is foreign to your understanding, obviously from lack in receieveg from God that what Jesus did in Matt 3:16, Adam did in Gen 3:22, Abraham did, Moses did, 120 did.

God will come to anyone who will stop their beliefs for a god and actually receive Him as Jesus did and these others did we read of who became like God to know this difference and in His same image.

That's unbiblical at best. According the the Bible belief is how God makes Himself known to believers.

It is only unbiblical for you if you do not know the spiritual connotation of the writings, and you cant know that reality until He is manifest in you. In reality the kingdom fo God doesnt come with observation as mosts BELIEFS say a man as a god is going to come someday and save you, but according to Jesus in Luke 17:20-21the kingdom of God is within you. Jesus was very clear but most has other BELIEFS from that what Jesus says and received for God to be in him as well.

You only haver a belief for a god.
Catholics has a belief about their gods,
Mormons has a belief for their god,
Muslims has a belief for their god,
Pentecostals has a belief,
Baptists has a belief.
AOGs has a belief.
you have a beleif
Jesus had the manifest ration of God that is not a belief and so do I and us all who has receieved from God Himself in real time manifestation.

That is why His ways to receive from God Himself to be in His same image is unbiblical for you. Ironic is that when you see Him as He is ye shall be like Him, 1 John 3. You only believe, as with Jesus in Matt 3:16 I have received, and no one can know God without that same manifestation where only God Himself can open to you who He is and all of His heaven in you by God Himself. Read Matt 3:16, this is how God did id in man starting in Adam to all who will receieve Him right down to this very day. There is no reality in a belief.

 

[Gary Mac]

How can you "have His same mind of grace" without believing in accordance with Him or believing as He believes?

By setting aside my beliefs, giving up the right to myself in my beliefs and receiving from God His same mind, or Spirit the mind is called and let Him give me His truths just as He did in Jesus and these others who received His mind and walk in it as He walks in it.

 

[JonHawk]

But first you must call on the Lord as Jesus did to receieve His salvation. See Matt 3:16 this is when Jesus yielded to Gods salvation.

You dont know what Gods salvation is do you?

For we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. 11 For it is written:
“As I live, says the Lord,
Every knee shall bow to Me,
And every tongue shall confess to God.”
12 So then each of us shall give account of himself to God.
13 Therefore let us not judge one another anymore, but rather resolve this, not to put a stumbling block or a cause to fall in our brother’s way.

I received the same grace that Jesus received form God in Matt 3:16. And we all who has seen Him He is are like Him. 1 John 3. Jesus saw Him in Matt 3:16. You dont know what that Intel's do you?

Based on your account, since you claim your jesus was a sinner like you, therefore you reject Jesus Christ's unblemished sacrifice on the cross and the oath in Jesus Christ our forerunner, Heb 6:19-20 and then you brazenly approach God and tell him to his face that you are a perfectly delusional gnostic.

 

[Tercon]

That is what I just said. Wihout the reality of God manifest in you then all you have is a believe about a god.

But you can't have "the reality of God" manifest to you without believing it first? As all knowledge of the truth and reality requires belief in order to make it known to you.

And his way is according to believing Him, as that's how God makes Himself known to believers. You are caught in some unbiblical unbelief of how God operates.

Now Thomas, one of the twelve, called the Twin, was not with them when Jesus came. So the other disciples told him, “We have seen the Lord.” But he said to them, “Unless I see in his hands the mark of the nails, and place my finger into the mark of the nails, and place my hand into his side, I will never believe.”
Eight days later, his disciples were inside again, and Thomas was with them. Although the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you.” Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe.” Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” 29 Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”
John 20:24-29

 

[JonHawk]

JonHawk said:
And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace. Rom 11:6

So that you may know what is the exceeding greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the working of His mighty power 20 which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand; Eph 1

Even when we were dead in trespasses, God made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), Eph 2:5

Therefore, brothers and sisters, be sure to confirm your call and election so that and you will never be lost. 2 Peter 1:10

Do you think belief is "works" and originated in you?

The word of God did not originate from man.

He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.
Through Christ Jesus you believe in God, who raised him from the dead and glorified him,
so that your faith and assurance of eternal life are [centered and rest] in God. 1 Peter 1:20-21
For the word of the Lord endures forever. 1 Peter 1:25, Isaiah 40:6-9

 

[Baltic]

So how do we get back to God?

God is Spirit. Humans are mixed bags of flesh and spirit, meet God in "spirit and truth", need to learn separating spirit from flesh (e.g. Heb 5).

 

[Tercon]

JonHawk said:
And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace. Rom 11:6

The belief/faith that saved me originated in and with God, as that's how He took me from a unbeliever to a believer. So, saving faith, grace and His will all comes to the believer in believing in accordance with Him. If you have some other way that God administers His gifts other than belief, then spit it out. If not, then stop pretending you do.

So that you may know what is the exceeding greatness of His power toward us who believe, according to the working of His mighty power 20 which He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand; Eph 1

That is all accomplish through belief.

Even when we were dead in trespasses, God made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), Eph 2:5

Therefore, brothers and sisters, be sure to confirm your call and election so that and you will never be lost. 2 Peter 1:10

The elect are all believers.

The word of God did not originate from man.

Strawman. Neither did saving belief/faith originate from man, as it's all from God.

He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.
Through Christ Jesus you believe in God, who raised him from the dead and glorified him,
so that your faith and assurance of eternal life are [centered and rest] in God. 1 Peter 1:20-21
For the word of the Lord endures forever. 1 Peter 1:25, Isaiah 40:6-9

Yes, all through believing in accordance with God.

 

[JonHawk]

The word of God did not originate from man.

Strawman. Neither did saving belief/faith originate from man, as it's all from God.

He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.
Through Christ Jesus you believe in God, who raised him from the dead and glorified him,
so that your faith and assurance of eternal life are [centered and rest] in God. 1 Peter 1:20-21
For the word of the Lord endures forever. 1 Peter 1:25, Isaiah 40:6-9

The belief/faith that saved me originated in and with God, ....If you have some other way that God administers His gifts other than belief, then spit it out. If not, then stop pretending you do.

Pretending to agree that the inheritance is by grace through faith and being suspicious of someone declaring that it is by grace through faith at the same time makes you look unstable.

Knowing that from the Lord you receive the reward of the inheritance, Col 3:24