tbeachhead
Well-known member
Thanks for your response. Nice to meet you.Read the written word of God. The answer is obvious. after the resurrection what did Jesus do and say with the apostles regarding the reception of the Holy Spirit? And what happened on Pentecost that was distinctively different?
Just an observation: This is kind of specious, don't you think? But, fine. I don't know you. I'll play along: I asked, "What proof do you accept that this (the baptism of the Holy Spirit) has happened? Is it a matter of mere claim? Or is there power involved in some way?" To which you say, "The answer is obvious."
I don't know if you've noticed, but the concept of Pentecost does not have singularity of interpretation. The Word of God depicts tongues of fire and supernatural tongues spoken as Jesus promised, where they were universally understood by all listeners present, each hearing what was spoken in their own language. Is that what you're talking about?
Or...a single speaker speaks, and leads three thousand to conversion and acknowledgement of Jesus as Lord? Is that the evidence you see when someone claims to be filled?
Moving on to Samaria, where Philip preached with great success and multiple baptisms, but no outpouring of the Holy Spirit until Peter and John came from Jerusalem. Then, when they brought Jesus' baptism, such power was displayed that a magician offered money to Peter and John to buy the trick. Is that what you saw? Or experienced personally? Moving on to the next time, in Cornelius' the Centurion's house, the Holy Spirit came on every member of the household so that they all spoke in tongues that no one could have understood (or they would not have been recognized by Peter as the same gift he received at Pentecost.) Is a display of foreign language that no one understands the sign you accept?
That would be OK...and sustainable if you go with Paul to Ephesus, where he finds a crowd of "disciples" who clearly found conversion through Apollos' teaching, but since he knew nothing of the baptism of the Spirit, none of his disciples knew of the Holy Spirit until Paul brought Him to them...and they all spoke in languages no one around could understand.
But that is naive to believe that everyone filled with the Spirit and baptized by Jesus speaks in tongues, and I don't even go that route.
But tell me. You think you have the fullness of the Spirit. Do you have a testimony of deeds and power as Paul describes it, so that faith is placed in the Power of God, and not the wisdom of men...which is the method in Corinth that Paul found so much more effective than his strategy in Athens?
So...is it a matter of mere claim? Or do you have the miracles of power that the Word of God contends accompany the baptism of the Spirit?