Can you judge God and succeed in your goal?

[Open Heart]

There was a tailor who lived in Lizensk, Poland. One day on the eve of YOM KIPPUR he spoke to God and said -
“Oh God, first I recounted all my sins. Now I list yours; all the suffering, all the tragedy in the world. It’s too long a list, my God. It’s too terrible a list. Master of the Universe, in truth it appears you owe me more than I owe you. But I’d rather not keep strict accounts. This is a time of forgiveness. So why don’t I just forgive You, and You forgive me?”

Awesome story!

Why is it that only Jews tell these kind of stories? I've always felt that it gives Jews far more moral credibility, because we are willing to say about suffering, "I really don't know why. My religion doesn't have the answer. But I still trust that God knows what he is doing."

One instance that I really appreciate is that in Auschwitz, a collection of Orthodox rabbis met as a bet din, and charged God with breaking his covenant with Israel. They found God guilty.

 

[SteveB]

To ask the question about humans judging God, one has to start thinking about humanity's relationship with God in a new modern way.
Lots of people who call themselves religious monotheists relate to God as children. The Bible says we are created in the image of God. Whatever that may mean, it means at least that we are partners with God. God is a parent. That is, one of His titles is "Father". OK. When you were a child ad misbehaved, your parent may have smacked you. Now you are an adult. If you do something that displeases your parent and that parent smacks you, how are you going to feel about that? You may lose respect for him/her.
There was a tailor who lived in Lizensk, Poland. One day on the eve of YOM KIPPUR he spoke to God and said -
“Oh God, first I recounted all my sins. Now I list yours; all the suffering, all the tragedy in the world. It’s too long a list, my God. It’s too terrible a list. Master of the Universe, in truth it appears you owe me more than I owe you. But I’d rather not keep strict accounts. This is a time of forgiveness. So why don’t I just forgive You, and You forgive me?”
Many religious people want so desperately to absolve God from the horrors of history, their own and the world's that they just claim they are felons because with God, it's never a misdemeanor. It's our fault. We are all sinners. NO, WE AIN'T! In truth, most people are NOT sinners. Most people are good even they they commit small, sins out of ignorance, laziness, or temptation. That does not make us Sinners with an upper-case S.
Eve was the first person to judge God. She challenged Him. "Why can't we eat that fruit? Why did You put it there? The snake said it was because You don't want us to be like You, and I'll bet that's true. Well, we ARE like You so I'm gonna eat and just see what You do about it. Because You are the most petulant!

And then Adam ate, and now women suffer in pregnancy, are constantly trying to control others, especially their husbands, and the entire human race dies.

Sounds like God is true to his Word.

And ironically, the Polish guy is right, except for one thing....

All the evil in the world is due entirely to Adam's eating the fruit.

 

[Open Heart]

And then Adam ate, and now women suffer in pregnancy, are constantly trying to control others, especially their husbands, and the entire human race dies.

Sounds like God is true to his Word.

And ironically, the Polish guy is right, except for one thing....

All the evil in the world is due entirely to Adam's eating the fruit.

I'm going to pass over the point that Adam is not a historical person, and that suffering existed long before homo sapiens evolved...

Many people would say that God works through humans. There is prayer by Teresa of Avila:

"Christ has no body now but ours,​

No hands, no feet on earth but ours,​

Ours are the eyes through which He looks​

With compassion on this world.​

Ours are the feet with which He walks to do good,​

Ours are the hands with which He blesses all the world."​

Although we Jews would say God rather than Christ, we can resonate with those words. It is why such a huge part of Judaism is Tikkun Olam, repair of the world. We emphasize the responsibility of human beings to correct the sufferings of the world.

There is a Christian midrash I've heard many times. An individual rails at God, Why? Why do you allow such suffering? Why do little kids die painfully from cancer? Where are you when people starve in Africa? Why did you not come help when so many died from the hurricane? And God replies, That's why I sent you.

 

[SteveB]

I'm going to pass over the point that Adam is not a historical person,

oh. Well then. Apparently you were actually alive back then.
must be nice knowing so much, without actually having first hand evidence.
I'm curious...
how does being an observant Jew work when you call YHVH (the source of the laws you observe) a liar (by saying he didn't actually do what he says he did in several places)?

Now, before you go off on me, please continue reading.

and that suffering existed long before homo sapiens evolved...

That is indeed the opinions of people who weren't actually alive or around back then.
I'm satisfied with the only Person who actually was around to know what happened, and how.
And while I'll agree that the documents which detail YHVH's working is threadbare, I've considered this issue, and have come to the awareness that had he actually given us a comprehensive and detailed explanation for everything in Genesis 1, it'd be a compendium of several million or several billion volumes, with Genesis 1:1 taking up the first 20 million volumes, and the rest of the chapter, the final collection of volumes.

furthermore, I'm thinking that the first 20 million volumes would be so detailed and complicated, our finest minds would have done exactly what the ancient Jewish scholars did-- but in scientific vernacular-- written thousands upon thousands of volumes of notes, asking questions, making comments which expressed sheer consternation, frustration, and incredulity at their inability to understand what YHVH was talking about.
But instead, YHVH was gracious enough to leave it simple enough for us to get, and then stated through Moses-
There are secret things that are kept secret, but I've given plenty for you to live by. Deuteronomy 29:29
And he then gave David the grace and wisdom to recognize that those who fear YHVH and keep his commandments, would be welcomed into friendship with him, and given his covenant. Psalms 25:14
Then he gave Solomon the wisdom to recognize that it's the glory of God to conceal things, and the honor of kings to search them out. Proverbs 25:2
Thus opening the door to learn the secrets concealed in YHVH's act of creation through diligently seeking truth and understanding.

Many people would say that God works through humans.

Yep.
That's what I'm seeing in the law, prophets, writings, and the new testament.

There is prayer by Teresa of Avila:

"Christ has no body now but ours,​

No hands, no feet on earth but ours,​

Ours are the eyes through which He looks​

With compassion on this world.​

Ours are the feet with which He walks to do good,​

Ours are the hands with which He blesses all the world."​

that is what is written in 1 Corinthians 12-14, Ephesians 4, Romans 12, and other locations.

Although we Jews would say God rather than Christ, we can resonate with those words.

Jesus is God. The prophets make that abundantly clear.
granted, this is where a more detailed Bible study comes to bear, but it'd take way longer than I have time for at the moment.

It is why such a huge part of Judaism is Tikkun Olam, repair of the world. We emphasize the responsibility of human beings to correct the sufferings of the world.

And in biblical Christianity, we have a two-fold aspect of that.
We're still to do justice as the Jewish law/prophets describe. Eg., James 1:27, is an overview of Isaiah 58. Matthew 5-7.
But the first and foremost aspect of this justice is restoration of the human being to YHVH, through Jesus, who paid the penalty for our sin.
He is our pesach lamb.
as John the baptizer said- Behold!
the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
as he is described in Isaiah 53.

There is a Christian midrash I've heard many times. An individual rails at God, Why? Why do you allow such suffering? Why do little kids die painfully from cancer? Where are you when people starve in Africa? Why did you not come help when so many died from the hurricane? And God replies, That's why I sent you.

I wouldn't have considered that a midrash, but ok.

This is true.

As is written in Micah 6:8.

To do justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

 

[Open Heart]

oh. Well then. Apparently you were actually alive back then.
must be nice knowing so much, without actually having first hand evidence.
I'm curious...
how does being an observant Jew work when you call YHVH (the source of the laws you observe) a liar (by saying he didn't actually do what he says he did in several places)?

Pay close attention, because this may likely be very new for you.

I don't think God lies. What I do think is that the bible is made up of many different genres: history, myth, legend, songs, proverbs, books of law, and more. Part of understanding a book in the Bible is knowing what genre it is.

For example, in your Bible, Jesus spoke in parables. Parables are fictitious stories that teach moral and religious lessons. They are not historical. There was never a Good Samaritan in reality. Does that make the story a lie? Absolutely not. There is nothing wrong with using fiction to teach a valuable lesson. It's why we tell fables to children. You can understand that the Good Samaritan is fiction, and STILL say that you BELIEVE it, because you believe the LESSON it teaches: that we need to reach out in compassion to all those who are suffering, regardless of their ethnicity.

Many people, especially atheists, think the word myth means lie. It doesn't, at least not in the literary sense. Myth is one of the most powerful genres there is. It is insurmountable in teaching deep, unconscious cultural values. Therefore, I'm not at all surprised that the Bible would include myth. Just as with Jesus' parables, I value myths for what they teach. In that sense, I absolutely DO believe in the six day creation, the flood, the tower of babel, etc. I believe it the same way you believe in the Good Samaritan.

It would be a gross error for someone to say to you, "Because you do not believe the Good Samaritan to be historical, you are calling God a liar." You are making this mistake with me.

If you care to delve into this in greater depth, a fabulous essay on this topic was written by a Christian, JRR Tolkien, called "On Fairy Stories." You can read it online here on this Christian website:

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coolcalvary.com

 

[Open Heart]

That is indeed the opinions of people who weren't actually alive or around back then.

It's a view that is based on actual evidence, rather than on faith.

As is written in Micah 6:8.

To do justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.

Ah! Perhaps my all time most favorite verse.

 

[Caroljeen]

Awesome story!

Why is it that only Jews tell these kind of stories? I've always felt that it gives Jews far more moral credibility, because we are willing to say about suffering, "I really don't know why. My religion doesn't have the answer. But I still trust that God knows what he is doing."

One instance that I really appreciate is that in Auschwitz, a collection of Orthodox rabbis met as a bet din, and charged God with breaking his covenant with Israel. They found God guilty.

How can you remain faithful to a God who doesn't remain faithful to you?

Did God truly break his covenant? For the most part the Hebrew scriptures portray a God who is faithful and his people who are repeatedly unfaithful and are punished for their unfaithfulness.

 

[franzschein]

And then Adam ate, and now women suffer in pregnancy, are constantly trying to control others, especially their husbands, and the entire human race dies.

Sounds like God is true to his Word.

And ironically, the Polish guy is right, except for one thing....

All the evil in the world is due entirely to Adam's eating the fruit.

Oh yes, Steve. All the evil and all the good. I say all the good as well. We were not meant to remain in Eden forever. If we did, we would never realize our full potential as godlike creatures. God does not mind being confronted the way He is by Abraham and Job.
BTW - the labor pain of women is not what is meant by Genesis' statement “To the woman he said, 'I will surely multiply your pain in childbearing; in pain you shall bring forth children. What the verse means is that children are a pain in the ass and raising them sometimes brings grief to the parents.

 

[franzschein]

Awesome story!

Why is it that only Jews tell these kind of stories? I've always felt that it gives Jews far more moral credibility, because we are willing to say about suffering, "I really don't know why. My religion doesn't have the answer. But I still trust that God knows what he is doing."

One instance that I really appreciate is that in Auschwitz, a collection of Orthodox rabbis met as a bet din, and charged God with breaking his covenant with Israel. They found God guilty.

Jews tell these stories because, unlike Christians, we do not believe that He is always right. But unlike Christians or any other nonJews, we have a special relationship with Him that transcends ordinary deity-human relationships. Christianity posits the physical incarnation of God on earth. So does Jewish mysticism. KABALA declares that the physical incarnation of God on earth is the Jewish People. Our Trinity states that
God, TORAH, and Israel - they are ONE!

 

[SteveB]

Pay close attention, because this may likely be very new for you.

I don't think God lies. What I do think is that the bible is made up of many different genres: history, myth, legend, songs, proverbs, books of law, and more. Part of understanding a book in the Bible is knowing what genre it is.

For example, in your Bible, Jesus spoke in parables. Parables are fictitious stories that teach moral and religious lessons. They are not historical. There was never a Good Samaritan in reality. Does that make the story a lie? Absolutely not. There is nothing wrong with using fiction to teach a valuable lesson. It's why we tell fables to children. You can understand that the Good Samaritan is fiction, and STILL say that you BELIEVE it, because you believe the LESSON it teaches: that we need to reach out in compassion to all those who are suffering, regardless of their ethnicity.

Curious that you think a narrative of how someone is treated is on the same level as YHVH creating the cosmos. Especially when it's reiterated in Psalms 33:6-9 that he spoke the cosmos into existence.

It's further curious that you think Adam was a fictional character, when the whole reason why Jesus showed up and died to save the world from our sin and destruction was because of Adam's sin. John 3:16-21, Romans 5:8-12.
Even Paul, a former pharisees (what I'm guessing was Orthodox) back when, was quite convinced that Adam and Eve were real people, whom YHVH had created.

So that I can have a coherent conversation with you, since you said the Bible has myth, fiction, legends, etc...

As I recall, the hebrew Bible Canon was defined at the Jamnia council in 95AD.
The Christian bible Canon was defined in the Nicean council, during the second quarter if the 4th century.

The apochryphal texts were not defined as inspired by YHVH.

So, which books do you think are myth, fiction, legend, not actual history?

Which books do you think are actual history?
wisdom/Proverbs?

Many people, especially atheists, think the word myth means lie. It doesn't, at least not in the literary sense. Myth is one of the most powerful genres there is. It is insurmountable in teaching deep, unconscious cultural values. Therefore, I'm not at all surprised that the Bible would include myth. Just as with Jesus' parables, I value myths for what they teach. In that sense, I absolutely DO believe in the six day creation, the flood, the tower of babel, etc. I believe it the same way you believe in the Good Samaritan.

I'm thinking that Jesus ran across the guy who robbed the guy whom the Samaritan took care of, and ministered to him.
Jesus did say he came to call sinners to repentance.

It would be a gross error for someone to say to you, "Because you do not believe the Good Samaritan to be historical, you are calling God a liar." You are making this mistake with me.

You just conflated fundamental doctrine with narrative.

If you care to delve into this in greater depth, a fabulous essay on this topic was written by a Christian, JRR Tolkien, called "On Fairy Stories." You can read it online here on this Christian website:

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coolcalvary.com

Interesting.
I've downloaded it. Will read it at some point.

That said, just because a follower of Jesus wrote something interesting, it doesn't make it doctrine.
The best it can do is increase clarity of existing biblical doctrine.

 

[franzschein]

I have not said, on this forum, that anything in the Bible is fiction. But the Bible has to be looked at poetically from a modern point of view

 

[SteveB]

Jews tell these stories because, unlike Christians, we do not believe that He is always right. But unlike Christians or any other nonJews, we have a special relationship with Him that transcends ordinary deity-human relationships. Christianity posits the physical incarnation of God on earth. So does Jewish mysticism. KABALA declares that the physical incarnation of God on earth is the Jewish People. Our Trinity states that
God, TORAH, and Israel - they are ONE!

YHVH the Torah, and Israel are one.
But I don't think that means they are the same.
The Torah states.

Shma Israel
YHVH elohenu
YHVH echad.

So, YHVH's Word is his expression of himself to the human race.

Which is exactly what John states in his gospel.

Joh 1:1-5 WEB 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through him. Without him, nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness hasn’t overcome it.

Joh 1:9-14 WEB 9 The true light that enlightens everyone was coming into the world. 10 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, and the world didn’t recognize him. 11 He came to his own, and those who were his own didn’t receive him. 12 But as many as received him, to them he gave the right to become God’s children, to those who believe in his name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. 14 The Word became flesh and lived among us. We saw his glory, such glory as of the only born Son of the Father, full of grace and truth.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

A member just asked the question,
Can I judge God?

Sure. Most people who speak of God judge God. Judging is good as long as we have enough relevant information to base our judgment on. If God is real, then he would welcome judgment because he knows that he has the qualities to withstand the toughest scrutiny. A phony God, on the other hand, would supposedly get angry with being judged. Of course, any alleged angry objection on the part of a God men created is just the words that that God's creators stuffed into his mouth.

The short answer is yes.

But in doing so, you're putting yourself in a deadly situation.

This image describes the situation clearly.

You're the one holding the gun.

Google Image Result for https://newfastuff.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/shooting_someone_on_plank.png

How long do you want to play this game?

I see the game you're playing. You're making claims and telling all those who don't believe you that the God you believe in will harm them if they continue to doubt you. Of course, if said God does exist, then he would want people to believe him rather than people like you who appoint yourselves as his prophets.

 

[SteveB]

Sure. Most people who speak of God judge God. Judging is good as long as we have enough relevant information to base our judgment on.

And how do you think we'd go about getting the necessary relevant information to base our judgment on?

If God is real, then he would welcome judgment because he knows that he has the qualities to withstand the toughest scrutiny.

And how would you know if you actually have an accurate perspective to make such a tough scrutiny?

A phony God, on the other hand, would supposedly get angry with being judged.

I wouldn't know. I've never believed in false gods.
sounds like you are though.

Of course, any alleged angry objection on the part of a God men created is just the words that that God's creators stuffed into his mouth.

like what you're doing now, and have been doing?

I see the game you're playing.

Definitely sounds like you are.

You're making claims and telling all those who don't believe you that the God you believe in will harm them if they continue to doubt you.

Nope.
I'm simply stating what the Bible says and then warning you about what strikes me as the bad news of the gospel of Jesus.

I've further, repeatedly stated that it's entirely on your own shoulders.
I'm not your mom, I'm not your sister. I'm not from the church affiliation your family attended.

I simply don't want you to go to hell. But based on your description of how your mom treated you, I'd say that you're so jacked up by your youth that you're too bitter and angry to recognize that everything I'm describing is contained entirely in the Bible and you can read for yourself.

Of course, if said God does exist, then he would want people to believe him rather than people like you who appoint yourselves as his prophets.

So nobody who's statements you don't like couldn't possibly be following Jesus?

Then let's make it easier for you... oh. Wait. I actually stated this already.
Clearly you are unable to handle yourself, because you keep complaining, and don't know what you're talking about.

You should either turn to YHVH from your sin, stop blaming others for your rage against your family, and deal directly with him.

Until you do, you're only demonstrating your immaturity.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Then let's make it easier for you... oh. Wait. I actually stated this already.
Clearly you are unable to handle yourself, because you keep complaining, and don't know what you're talking about.

You should either turn to YHVH from your sin, stop blaming others for your rage against your family, and deal directly with him.

Until you do, you're only demonstrating your immaturity.

If you really followed a God of goodness and love, then you wouldn't be lobbing these obnoxious insults at people.

 

[SteveB]

If you really followed a God of goodness and love, then you wouldn't be lobbing these obnoxious insults at people.

So you're not actually able to answer me then.

Better figure it out before you get too far in life.

 

[5wize]

I've further, repeatedly stated that it's entirely on your own shoulders.

Yeah, but you’re full of crap. And so is your life. Your life has been crap from very early on so you coated yourself with more crap so you didn’t have to smell the first layer of crap.

There is no reason to listen to you. You’ve been lost and empty and desperate for too long. So long that there is no trusting what you’ve glommed onto to make yourself feel better. We know what you believe is worthless because it gives you what you want, to feel superior to those around you in some way. It’s just your method of getting back at the world... having something up on them that you never had but always wanted. That’s how we know it is false.

 

[SteveB]

Yeah, but you’re full of crap.

sounds like you're pissed off that you are choosing to destroy yourself, in spite of the fact that YHVH is offering you everlasting life.

And so is your life.

that would explain why YHVH is filling my heart, mind, and soul with joy and peace beyond describability, and understanding. Sustaining me with himself.

Your life has been crap from very early on so you coated yourself with more crap so you didn’t have to smell the first layer of crap.

That is why I came to Jesus.
Cr88 stinks, and I don't like it.
The fresh, and sweet aroma of life is much more enjoyable.
Oh.... that's right! I'd forgotten.
what is the aroma of life to us who follow Jesus is the stench of death to those who are perishing.
no wonder you find it smelling like cr88!
you're among those who are perishing.


2Co 2:15-16 WEB 15 For we are a sweet aroma of Christ to God in those who are saved and in those who perish: 16 to the one a stench from death to death, to the other a sweet aroma from life to life. Who is sufficient for these things?

There is no reason to listen to you.

yet here you are listening and ranting about your envy, regarding your contempt and disgust for all things godly.

You’ve been lost and empty and desperate for too long.

Again, why i came to Jesus.

His indwelling Spirit brings fullness and Joy, which is infinitely better than my emptiness, desperation, and lostness.

Furthermore, since he's been to death, and rose from the dead, He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, so we who've met, and are following Jesus have been found, and as Jesus is the Good Shepherd, I have Him to guide my way, and lead me to my eternal Home.

So long that there is no trusting what you’ve glommed onto to make yourself feel better.

you really should learn to understand what i say more clearly.
i don't need you to trust me at all!
it's Jesus you need to deal with.
So, take your unbelief up with Jesus.
It is after all, your life.

We know what you believe is worthless because it gives you what you want, to feel superior to those around you in some way.

So you're worthless?
because I believe what YHVH says about you.
you possess infinite intrinsic worth and value, which is exactly why Jesus died for you.
if i didn't believe what YHVH says about you, i wouldn't be wasting my time on the internet.
I would have found a tropical island decades ago, and be living la vida loca!


Considering that we who follow Jesus are the offscouring of the earth (that which you view as the scum to be scraped off your shoes), I'm thinking that you're just afraid of what you cannot control.
Furthermore, as we who follow Jesus are viewed by you as weak, inept, and despicable, God has explicitly stated he's going to use us to glorify himself to those who view themselves as superior, erudite, strong, and the "pretty people."


1Co 4:13 KJV Being defamed, we intreat: we are made as the filth of the world, and are the offscouring of all things unto this day.

1Co 1:26-29 WEB 26 For you see your calling, brothers, that not many are wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, and not many noble; 27 but God chose the foolish things of the world that he might put to shame those who are wise. God chose the weak things of the world that he might put to shame the things that are strong. 28 God chose the lowly things of the world, and the things that are despised, and the things that don’t exist, that he might bring to nothing the things that exist, 29 that no flesh should boast before God.


So, yeah. That must be why you despise me so much.

It’s just your method of getting back at the world... having something up on them that you never had but always wanted.

so, my method of getting back at the world is to put up with the verbal abuse, and manipulations of people who despise me because I believe that God actually loved you enough to give his only begotten Son to take your place in judgment due sin, so he could give you everlasting life, making it clear that to YHVH you possess infinite intrinsic worth and value.

That’s how we know it is false.

Sounds like you've got it all figured out.

 

[5wize]

that would explain why YHVH is filling my heart, mind, and soul with joy and peace beyond describability, and understanding. Sustaining me with himself.
The fresh, and sweet aroma of life is much more enjoyable.

But that’s not what you’ve granted yourself. You’ve suspended this life and living it honestly for a promise of a future life of bliss after death. That’s all that you are filled with... a hope and promise of a future life that helps you bridge over actually having to live and be present in this life any more at all.

So, yeah. That must be why you despise me so much.

Well, yes. You lie and attempt to instill fear into people that are actually living this life fully just because you couldn’t deal with it and bear up under it. You found a psychological out of your pain. But that was just your pain. No one shares that need to escape this life like you did. Now you want to convince everybody to be afraid of their good lives and be fearful and miserable in them like you were until they join you in some promise of better future that they don’t need. They have a good and rich life now.

Sounds like you've got it all figured out.

I do when it comes to you.

 

[SteveB]

But that’s not what you’ve granted yourself.

nope. YHVH gives it to everyone who believes in Jesus.
so why would I need to give something that unattainable on human terms to myself?

You’ve suspended this life and living it honestly for a promise of a future life of bliss after death.

that is what YHVH does for those who believe in Jesus.

My life is set in a secure place by YHVH himself.

2Ti 1:12 WEB For this cause I also suffer these things. Yet I am not ashamed, for I know him whom I have believed, and I am persuaded that he is able to guard that which I have committed to him against that day.

Col 3:1-4 WEB 1 If then you were raised together with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated on the right hand of God. 2 Set your mind on the things that are above, not on the things that are on the earth. 3 For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. 4 When Christ, our life, is revealed, then you will also be revealed with him in glory.

So why on earth would I believe your way is better?

That’s all that you are filled with... a hope and promise of a future life that helps you bridge over actually having to live and be present in this life any more at all.

A lot more profound and powerful than anything you can offer.

what YHVH gives his adopted children is something you'll never be able to give people from your poverty.
YHVH gives from his abundance.


Jer 29:11-14 WEB 11 For I know the thoughts that I think toward you,” says Yahweh, “thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you hope and a future. 12 You shall call on me, and you shall go and pray to me, and I will listen to you. 13 You shall seek me and find me, when you search for me with all your heart. 14 I will be found by you,” says Yahweh, ....

Well, yes. You lie and attempt to instill fear into people that are actually living this life fully just because you couldn’t deal with it and bear up under it.

No need to lie.
you should be afraid....
until YHVH satisfies your heart's longing.
why would you choose death when life is offered freely.

the old classic song,
Amazing Grace.

Grace taught my heart to fear, and my fears relieved.

Grace teaches us.
Grace saves us.
Grace motivates, and guides, and leads us to life, and the ever increasing beautiful day of Jesus.

You found a psychological out of your pain.

actually, Jesus IS the healing of my pain.

Isa 53:5 WEB But he was pierced for our transgressions. He was crushed for our iniquities. The punishment that brought our peace was on him; and by his wounds we are healed.

His blood atones, pays for my sin. So he brings peace to the tortured souls.

But that was just your pain.

Not JUST mine.
the entire human race.


Isa 53:6 WEB All we like sheep have gone astray. Everyone has turned to his own way; and Yahweh has laid on him the iniquity of us all.
Joh 3:16-17 WEB 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only born Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 17 For God didn’t send his Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world should be saved through him.


The ENTIRE human race.

No one shares that need to escape this life like you did.

actually, the entire human race needs to escape the judgment due sin.
otherwise, YHVH never would have given Jesus.

Now you want to convince everybody to be afraid of their good lives and be fearful and miserable in them like you were until they join you in some promise of better future that they don’t need.

Sounds like you're describing yourself.
This natural Life ends in death.
Sin has separated the human race from God.
that means that when people who have not chosen Jesus die, they end up in hell.
not because that's where God wants us, but we did not choose God's solution to the problem of sin.

They have a good and rich life now.

If they did, they wouldn’t be arguing about something they don't believe is real, on some backwoods internet forum with strangers they despise.

I do when it comes to you.

Yet here you are, still talking.
Why is that?
Seems quite clear that you don't actually do so.