Can You Put Old Wine Into Old Wine Skins?

SeventhDay

Well-known member
Can You Put Old Wine Into Old Wine Skins?
Luk 5:37 And no man putteth new wine into old bottles; else the new wine will burst the bottles, and be spilled, and the bottles shall perish.
Luk 5:38 But new wine must be put into new bottles; and both are preserved.
Jesus is speaking of the "wine" as the Holy Spirit and when is that given to us? Also, old wineskin or old bottles represent the old carnal man dead in trespasses and sins!
I ask you what is Jesus atoning for the sins of the world for the old man or the new spiritual man? Is Jesus reforming the old man or putting him away? Who is Jesus calling to himself the old man or the new spiritual man?

Does the law state that the soul that sins shall die? Is Jesus atoning for the sins of the world changing the Law? Is God consistent or not? However God is saving humanity but how? God did send us a Saviour! Jesus rose out of death for our justification but who is being justified the old man or the new spiritual man?

How is God saving humanity? God is quickening humanity out of the death state thus we have a new spiritual humanity and God has put the old man away!
Co 5:14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead:
2Co 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.
2Co 5:16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.
2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
You see God is putting new wine into new wine skins thus when the good news is preached it is the new spiritual man with a spiritual disposition that God calls to himself that can spiritually hear and respond to God's calling. This is through God's grace that provides us faith and we receive the indwelling Holy Spirit. It is not the old dead in trespasses and sins that can receive the good news message and God has put the old man away!
Eph 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
Now, some teach that the old man can believe Christ when God calls him but God is not calling him because he is dead with Christ in his death.
God is putting new wine into new wineskins

God bless you. 🙂
 

Dant01

Well-known member
.
Can You Put Old Wine Into Old Wine Skins?

A 40 year-old bottle of pressed grapes in our day has very different characteristics
than a skin of pressed grapes the same age in their day. In our day, the liquid is
still suitable for a beverage because bottling arrests fermentation, whereas they
had no effective way that I know of to arrest fermentation in their day; which is
why I believe the fruit of the vine that Jesus' men imbibed at his last supper was
likely alcoholic because fresh grapes weren't available till Summer/Autumn whereas
Passover is in Spring.


NOTE: I'm pretty confident, at least in my own mind, that Jesus' parables were
intended as teaching aids for his Jewish countrymen rather than intended for
Gentiles. In other words: I really think it's a huge mistake for non Jews to go about
christianizing his parables when they are meant to instruct folks believing and
practicing Judaism.

There are lots of Gentiles out there very proficient at defending so-called
replacement theology, but I do not recommend listening to them any more than I
would whole-heartily recommend listening to Homer's sirens.
_
 

SeventhDay

Well-known member
.


A 40 year-old bottle of pressed grapes in our day has very different characteristics
than a skin of pressed grapes the same age in their day. In our day, the liquid is
still suitable for a beverage because bottling arrests fermentation, whereas they
had no effective way that I know of to arrest fermentation in their day; which is
why I believe the fruit of the vine that Jesus' men imbibed at his last supper was
likely alcoholic because fresh grapes weren't available till Summer/Autumn whereas
Passover is in Spring.


NOTE: I'm pretty confident, at least in my own mind, that Jesus' parables were
intended as teaching aids for his Jewish countrymen rather than intended for
Gentiles. In other words: I really think it's a huge mistake for non Jews to go about
christianizing his parables when they are meant to instruct folks believing and
practicing Judaism.

There are lots of Gentiles out there very proficient at defending so-called
replacement theology, but I do not recommend listening to them any more than I
would whole-heartily recommend listening to Homer's sirens.
_
God did change the wineskins or bottles did he not? One thing for sure is that we need to hear the voice of the Holy Spirit and take heed. It is one thing to receive knowledge but we need wisdom and understanding to go with it so God's truth has application in our lives. We really need to understand the practical application of Jesus death and resurrection and how it impacts our lives. Thank you for your input. God bless you.
 

Dant01

Well-known member
.
Were I a Jew; I'd be very curious to know how Luke 5:37-38 applies to my people
seeing as how Jesus' parables were meant for their instruction rather than for
Gentiles.

With that in mind:

Old wine can be likened to Israel's current governance and old wine skins can be
likened to the people of Israel in the spiritual condition they are now; present day.

Some time in the future, the people of Israel will be governed by a new God-given
regime headed by the man that most Jews know as Messiah. Well, the thing is, he
is predicted to be a righteous man and a champion of peace and prosperity; but the
Jews living in today's Israel-- they and their governance --are neither righteous nor
peaceful; in point of fact, more than fifty percent of the Jews living in the State of
Israel right now today are hiloni (secular) and the land has been in a perpetual
state of war since the day of its inception in 1948 and nobody is safe over there.

The Jews' gross lack of piety caused them to be conquered and enslaved by
Nebuchadnezzar. Well; the thing is, although Messiah will be an okay guy himself,
he would lose control of the land of Israel to a foreign power all over again were his
people allowed to continue today's status quo, viz: in order for Messiah's kingdom
to survive and prosper under the auspices of God, he will need a new breed of
reliable Jews to occupy the land with him; viz: he will need Jews for whom piety is
their very life's blood; so to speak.
_
 

SeventhDay

Well-known member
.
Were I a Jew; I'd be very curious to know how Luke 5:37-38 applies to my people
seeing as how Jesus' parables were meant for their instruction rather than for
Gentiles.

With that in mind:

Old wine can be likened to Israel's current governance and old wine skins can be
likened to the people of Israel in the spiritual condition they are now; present day.

Some time in the future, the people of Israel will be governed by a new God-given
regime headed by the man that most Jews know as Messiah. Well, the thing is, he
is predicted to be a righteous man and a champion of peace and prosperity; but the
Jews living in today's Israel-- they and their governance --are neither righteous nor
peaceful; in point of fact, more than fifty percent of the Jews living in the State of
Israel right now today are hiloni (secular) and the land has been in a perpetual
state of war since the day of its inception in 1948 and nobody is safe over there.

The Jews' gross lack of piety caused them to be conquered and enslaved by
Nebuchadnezzar. Well; the thing is, although Messiah will be an okay guy himself,
he would lose control of the land of Israel to a foreign power all over again were his
people allowed to continue today's status quo, viz: in order for Messiah's kingdom
to survive and prosper under the auspices of God, he will need a new breed of
reliable Jews to occupy the land with him; viz: he will need Jews for whom piety is
their very life's blood; so to speak.
_
Thus we need new wine with new wineskins which requires a change of heart which is a spiritual condition and the Holy Spirit to minister to that new spiritual condition.

God bless you. :)
 
Can You Put Old Wine Into Old Wine Skins?


Jesus is speaking of the "wine" as the Holy Spirit and when is that given to us? Also, old wineskin or old bottles represent the old carnal man dead in trespasses and sins!
I ask you what is Jesus atoning for the sins of the world for the old man or the new spiritual man? Is Jesus reforming the old man or putting him away? Who is Jesus calling to himself the old man or the new spiritual man?

Does the law state that the soul that sins shall die? Is Jesus atoning for the sins of the world changing the Law? Is God consistent or not? However God is saving humanity but how? God did send us a Saviour! Jesus rose out of death for our justification but who is being justified the old man or the new spiritual man?

How is God saving humanity? God is quickening humanity out of the death state thus we have a new spiritual humanity and God has put the old man away!




You see God is putting new wine into new wine skins thus when the good news is preached it is the new spiritual man with a spiritual disposition that God calls to himself that can spiritually hear and respond to God's calling. This is through God's grace that provides us faith and we receive the indwelling Holy Spirit. It is not the old dead in trespasses and sins that can receive the good news message and God has put the old man away!






Now, some teach that the old man can believe Christ when God calls him but God is not calling him because he is dead with Christ in his death.
God is putting new wine into new wineskins

God bless you. 🙂
Old wine in old wine skins?
 
.


A 40 year-old bottle of pressed grapes in our day has very different characteristics
than a skin of pressed grapes the same age in their day. In our day, the liquid is
still suitable for a beverage because bottling arrests fermentation, whereas they
had no effective way that I know of to arrest fermentation in their day; which is
why I believe the fruit of the vine that Jesus' men imbibed at his last supper was
likely alcoholic because fresh grapes weren't available till Summer/Autumn whereas
Passover is in Spring.


NOTE: I'm pretty confident, at least in my own mind, that Jesus' parables were
intended as teaching aids for his Jewish countrymen rather than intended for
Gentiles. In other words: I really think it's a huge mistake for non Jews to go about
christianizing his parables when they are meant to instruct folks believing and
practicing Judaism.

There are lots of Gentiles out there very proficient at defending so-called
replacement theology, but I do not recommend listening to them any more than I
would whole-heartily recommend listening to Homer's sirens.
_
When grafted in you are part of the same tree, receiving the same nourishing waters provide by the roots. Don't know who is telling people that grafted in folks are not recipients of Jesus's parables? I mean considering, He spoke to Jews in parables, and it was only to those who were elect that He revealed the meaning of them to. Most Jews did not know their meanings.

Romans 11:
The Ingrafting of the Gentiles
…17Now if some branches have been broken off, and you, a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others to share in the nourishment of the olive root, 18do not boast over those branches. If you do, remember this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you.

Acts 10
Good News for Gentiles
33So I sent for you immediately, and you were kind enough to come. Now then, we are all here in the presence of God to listen to everything the Lord has instructed you to tell us.” 34Then Peter began to speak: “I now truly understand that God does not show favoritism, 35but welcomes those from every nation who fear Him and do what is right.…
 
Old wine was likely already in an old wine skin so that pouring from one into
another the same age would fail to effect any improvements.
_
Huh. I thought it was new wine into old wine skins. I thought there was a typo or something. Thought the poster was going to give an understanding to that. Thanks.
 
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