Christ obtained Eternal Redemption for us !

brightfame52

Well-known member
Do you not tire of ignoring the word of God

All men cannot be limited to just elect

All men is not some men

And the word elect does not appear in the passage

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”
He obtained eternal redemption for all the Sheep
 

TomFL

Well-known member
He obtained eternal redemption for all the Sheep
Why are you attempting to change the topic ?

All men cannot be limited to just elect

All men is not some men

And the word elect does not appear in the passage

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Why are you attempting to change the topic ?

All men cannot be limited to just elect

All men is not some men

And the word elect does not appear in the passage

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”
Yes all men are the elect. All the Elect it's simple
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Yes all men are the elect. All the Elect it's simple

only in your assumed theology

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
only in your assumed theology

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.
It all comes down to being all the Elect of God
 

TomFL

Well-known member
It all comes down to being all the Elect of God
Not if you examine the evidence

only in your assumed theology

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Not if you examine the evidence

only in your assumed theology

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.
Yes no matter what it boils down to all the Sheep or Elect .
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Yes no matter what it boils down to all the Sheep or Elect .
The evidence shows otherwise

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
The evidence shows otherwise

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation
He obtained eternal redemption for the Sheep!
 

TomFL

Well-known member
He obtained eternal redemption for the Sheep!
The issue is the meaning of all, all men

Stick to the issue

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
The issue is the meaning of all, all men

Stick to the issue

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation
All men meaning all the Sheep. You technically the Sheep are men and women.
 

TomFL

Well-known member
All men meaning all the Sheep. You technically the Sheep are men and women.
Sorry that is not the meaning of the lexicon

The issue is the meaning of all, all men

Stick to the issue

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Sorry that is not the meaning of the lexicon

The issue is the meaning of all, all men

Stick to the issue

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation
It's the meaning of the scriptures. Who is Christ in Jn 10:11 and who did He specifically say He died for?
 

TomFL

Well-known member
It's the meaning of the scriptures. Who is Christ in Jn 10:11 and who did He specifically say He died for?
Scripture also states Christ died for Paul

Do you add alone to the statement?

Did Christ die for Paul alone ?

well alone does not appear in John 10

and this is scriptureT

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

It account for Paul , those who are mentioned in John 10 and more
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Scripture also states Christ died for Paul

Do you add alone to the statement?

Did Christ die for Paul alone ?

well alone does not appear in John 10

and this is scriptureT

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

It account for Paul , those who are mentioned in John 10 and more
Paul was a Sheep. Anyone who is a sheep Christ died for. If they weren't a Sheep Christ didn't die for them. Whenever the scriptures mentions the death of Christ for men, it's the Sheep exclusively!
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Paul was a Sheep. Anyone who is a sheep Christ died for. If they weren't a Sheep Christ didn't die for them. Whenever the scriptures mentions the death of Christ for men, it's the Sheep exclusively!
But Christ did not die for Paul alone

Did you miss the point ?

Scripture also states Christ died for Paul

Do you add alone to the statement?

Did Christ die for Paul alone ?

well alone does not appear in John 10

and this is scriptureT

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

It account for Paul , those who are mentioned in John 10 and more
 

TomFL

Well-known member
It's the meaning of the scriptures. Who is Christ in Jn 10:11 and who did He specifically say He died for?
Sorry no

Your theology is not scripture

The issue is the meaning of all, all men

Stick to the issue

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation

As for John10

It's too bad for your theology the word alonre is not there

just like it was not there for PauI
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
But Christ did not die for Paul alone

Did you miss the point ?

Scripture also states Christ died for Paul

Do you add alone to the statement?

Did Christ die for Paul alone ?

well alone does not appear in John 10

and this is scriptureT

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

It account for Paul , those who are mentioned in John 10 and more
Lol Paul wasn't the only Sheep Christ died for. That's nothing new.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Sorry no

Your theology is not scripture

The issue is the meaning of all, all men

Stick to the issue

1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

just ignoring evidence is not persuasive argumentation

As for John10

It's too bad for your theology the word alonre is not there

just like it was not there for PauI
Sorry yes. You are in a no win situation. Christ died only for the Sheep according to Jn 10
 

TomFL

Well-known member
Sorry yes. You are in a no win situation. Christ died only for the Sheep according to Jn 10
That's laughable

As the word alone does not appear in John 10

you add to scripture what is not there



1 Tim. 2:1–6 —KJV
Ҧ I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.”

δ. to denote the highest degree full, greatest, all (Pla., Rep. 9 p. 575A; Demosth. 18, 279 al.; LXX) μετὰ παρρησίας πάσης Ac 4:29. ἐν πάσῃ ἀσφαλείᾳ 5:23. πάσῃ συνειδήσει ἀγαθῇ in all good conscience 23:1. Cf. 17:11; 24:3; 2 Cor 9:8b; 12:12; Eph 4:2. ἐν πάσῃ προσκαρτερήσει with the greatest perseverance 6:18c. Cf. Phil 1:20; 2:29; Col 1:11a, b; 1 Ti 2:2b, 11; 3:4; 4:9; 5:2; Tit 2:15; Js 1:2; 2 Pt 1:5; Jd 3 al. ἀσκεῖν πᾶσαν ὑπομονήν practice patient endurance to the limit Pol 9:1 (Kleist).

b. w. a noun in the pl., without the art. πάντες ἄνθρωποι all men, everyone (Lysias 12, 60; Andoc. 3, 25; X., Cyr. 7, 5, 52, Mem. 4, 4, 19; Demosth. 8, 5; 18, 72) Ac 22:15; Ro 5:12a, 18a, b; 12:17, 18; 1 Cor 7:7; 15:19; 2 Cor 3:2; Phil 4:5; 1 Th 2:15; 1 Ti 2:4; 4:10; Tit 2:11. πάντες ἄγγελοι θεοῦ Hb 1:6 (Dt 32:43. Cf. Demosth. 18, 294 πάντες θεοί).

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.

William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature : A Translation and Adaption of the Fourth Revised and Augmented Edition of Walter Bauer’s Griechisch-Deutsches Worterbuch Zu Den Schrift En Des Neuen Testaments Und Der Ubrigen Urchristlichen Literatur (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1979), 631.
 
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