"come to know Him"--and obeying the commandments

brotherofJared

Well-known member
Eternal life is the gift God gives.
Indeed. It is a gift that God gives to those that keep his commandments.
We keep His commandments because we are following the Savior.
That sounds like the cart leading the horse. Those who keep the commandments follow the Savior, those who don't, don't regardless of the reason they think they are doing it.
We know that we know Him because we love Him
Well, I don't think it matters what you think you know. He knows and has stated that those who love him, keep his commandments. So, if you don't keep them, then you don't love him. It's a pretty simple formula.
, we love the Bible, we love and forgive others, we were brought to the Son by the Father, we aren't climbing up some other way!
I think if you aren't keeping the commandments, then you're climbing up some other way.
God guides and comforts and blesses us every day.
Uh huh. Yea. Sure. Keep telling yourself that.
 

Magdalena

Well-known member
Indeed. It is a gift that God gives to those that keep his commandments.

That sounds like the cart leading the horse. Those who keep the commandments follow the Savior, those who don't, don't regardless of the reason they think they are doing it.

Well, I don't think it matters what you think you know. He knows and has stated that those who love him, keep his commandments. So, if you don't keep them, then you don't love him. It's a pretty simple formula.

I think if you aren't keeping the commandments, then you're climbing up some other way.

Uh huh. Yea. Sure. Keep telling yourself that.
What commandments do you think we’re not keeping?
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
The word "then" is not in John 3:21.

It doesn't need to be, as "cometh to the light" follows "doeth truth"--which means it's at the same time--or afterward. Both of those possibilities violate the theology preached here by the critics.

John3:21
"But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in GOD."
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
A great example of this is Cornelius whose righteousness caught the attention of God. His life as a non-Christian/non-Jew clearly creates a problem for those who subscribe to the total depravity theory.

I agree.

Acts 10:34-35---King James Version
34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
It doesn't need to be, as "cometh to the light" follows "doeth truth"--which means it's at the same time--or afterward. Both of those possibilities violate the theology preached here by the critics.

John3:21
"But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in GOD."
You don't understand Christianity. And you're stuck in a rut.

John 3
6That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

No one does truth until they are born again.

Romans 8
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
 
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Janice Bower

Well-known member
Perhaps you could explain for us how your study of Mormonism, or your idea "Non-Christians don't keep his commandments"--somehow changes the testimony of the scriptures:

1 John 2:3-4---King James Version
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

That connects keeping the commandments with eternal life.
Only those with the Spirit of Christ belong to Him. Eternal life is the work of Christ, not of ourseves.
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
I agree with 1 John2:3-4. Only true Christians can obey Christ ---- we recognize them by their fruits. Liars are not Christians because Christians have become speakers of truth. False prophets are liars who heap non-biblical requirements on their followers.
 

brotherofJared

Well-known member
Only those with the Spirit of Christ belong to Him.
That may be true, but the question is, who belongs to Christ? How does one know? I think those who belong to Him follow him and keep his commandments regardless of what religion they belong to. Isn't that what the Bible teaches? "But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him."
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
I agree with 1 John2:3-4. Only true Christians can obey Christ ---- we recognize them by their fruits.

I was thinking Christ judged them by their fruits:

Matthew 7:19---King James Version
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

IMO--that doesn't bode well for your claims.
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
Only those with the Spirit of Christ belong to Him.

There seems to be a fly in the soup, according to the testimony of the scriptures:

Acts 5:31-32---King James Version
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

How do you reconcile that to your claims?

Eternal life is the work of Christ, not of ourseves.

For me--the question isn't whether eternal life is the work of Jesus Christ. It is.

The question remains--who does Jesus give His Eternal Life to--as a personal reception?

Hebrews 5:9---King James Version
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
 

Janice Bower

Well-known member
There seems to be a fly in the soup, according to the testimony of the scriptures:

Acts 5:31-32---King James Version
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

How do you reconcile that to your claims?



For me--the question isn't whether eternal life is the work of Jesus Christ. It is.

The question remains--who does Jesus give His Eternal Life to--as a personal reception?

Hebrews 5:9---King James Version
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Those who obey have been born again. Prior to receiving His Spirit, you can't obey and you don't belong to Christ. Eternal life is NOT a result of obedience to temple covenants or Mormon gods.. Mormons worship a false god and false prophets.

Ephesians 2: not of yourselves lest any man should boast (as Joseph Smith did).


Proverbs 16:18
Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall.

Romans 8:9
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
 
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Janice Bower

Well-known member
I was thinking Christ judged them by their fruits:

Matthew 7:19---King James Version
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

IMO--that doesn't bode well for your claims.
I claimed that God told us we would know Christians by their fruits.


Matthew 7:16
Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
 

dberrie2020

Well-known member
Those who obey have been born again. Prior to receiving His Spirit, you can't obey ....

That's your tale.

Here is the Biblical witness:

Acts 5:31-32---King James Version
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

Acts 2:38---King James Version

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
 
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