= a child of God
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Cornelius and the Gentiles with him had the gift of the Holy Spirit poured on them (Acts 10:45)
- Thread starter Fred
- Start date
= a child of God
Are you claiming that God did not?So you claim God commanded Jesus to be baptised by John.
Choose your translation from HERECan you show us where God said that?
I don't need to see your commontary. Just the verse where God tells Jesus to go and be baptised by John.
And if he endures to the end he will be saved...= a child of God
And if he endures to the end he will be saved...
All those saved will endure until the end, otherwise they were never justified to begin with,
Shilohsfoal
Well-known member
Fulfilling riteousness isn't the same as being commanded to do something.
So what do you believe Jesus needed repentance of?
No I don'tYou also seem to have a problem with John saying he needed baptism.
Jesus went to get baptized...John was the one who said it. Not Jesus.
Jesus needed to be baptized. John was expecting him...I could understand you believing Jesus needed baptism if Jesus said that, but he didn't. John did.
John 1:33
And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
Do you actually have a bible? Have you ever read a bible?
So why was John expecting him...I could see the righteousness in Christ humbling himself to someone who he didn't even consider his family, or someone who was not of the kingdom of heaven. But I don't believe Jesus needed the baptism of John.
John 1:33
And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
Jesus was setting the precedent for believers to follow... Do you think Jesus needed a bath from John?Mathew 3:11
“I baptize you with water for repentance."
What is it that you think Jesus was repenting of seeing that you believe Jesus needed johns baptise of water for repentance?
Show the chapter and verse where that is written.All those saved will endure until the end, otherwise they were never justified to begin with,
Shilohsfoal
Well-known member
Well, you suddenly seem to agree with me that Jesus didn't need johns baptism for repentence.No I don't
Jesus went to get baptized...
Jesus needed to be baptized. John was expecting him...
John 1:33
And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
Do you actually have a bible? Have you ever read a bible?
So why was John expecting him...
John 1:33
And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.
Jesus was setting the precedent for believers to follow... Do you think Jesus needed a bath from John?
Or do you still believe Jesus needed to repent?
Show the chapter and verse where that is written.
The Holy Spirit will never depart the believer.
Isaiah 59:21
“As for Me, this is My covenant with them,” says the LORD: “My Spirit which is upon you, and My words which I have put in your mouth shall not depart from your mouth, nor from the mouth of your offspring, nor from the mouth of your offspring’s offspring,” says the LORD, “from now and forever." (NASB, the underlined is mine)
1. New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (NIDNTT): the Servant of the Lord extends the blessings of his rule (already described in ch. 11) to include the Gentiles (42:1-4; 49:1-6), the covenant promise being fulfilled in God's irrevocable gift of his Spirit (59:21; cf. Joel 2:28 f.) (3:692, Spirit, J. D. G. Dunn, the underlined and bold face are mine).
How so? Why would Jesus do something that he did not need to do? Jesus was baptized by John was he not? Whay are you saying that he did not need to do it?Well, you suddenly seem to agree with me that Jesus didn't need johns baptism for repentence.
Of course, he needed to. Just like you need to. Are you better than Jesus?Or do you still believe Jesus needed to repent?
Shilohsfoal
Well-known member
What sin do you believe Jesus committed that he might need to repent of?How so? Why would Jesus do something that he did not need to do? Jesus was baptized by John was he not? Whay are you saying that he did not need to do it?
Of course, he needed to. Just like you need to. Are you better than Jesus?
And Jesus's baptism of John had nothing to do with me.
You said Jesus needed to repent. What did he need to repent from?
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1 Cor 9The Holy Spirit will never depart the believer.
Isaiah 59:21
“As for Me, this is My covenant with them,” says the LORD: “My Spirit which is upon you, and My words which I have put in your mouth shall not depart from your mouth, nor from the mouth of your offspring, nor from the mouth of your offspring’s offspring,” says the LORD, “from now and forever." (NASB, the underlined is mine)
1. New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (NIDNTT): the Servant of the Lord extends the blessings of his rule (already described in ch. 11) to include the Gentiles (42:1-4; 49:1-6), the covenant promise being fulfilled in God's irrevocable gift of his Spirit (59:21; cf. Joel 2:28 f.) (3:692, Spirit, J. D. G. Dunn, the underlined and bold face are mine).25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
Heb 6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
Heb 10
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
He is repenting for your sin...What did John say when he say Jesus coming?What sin do you believe Jesus committed that he might need to repent of?
John 1:29
The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 1:36
And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!
Do you have a Bible that you actually read sir?
Shilohsfoal
Well-known member
You believe Jesus took away the sin of the world by repenting of my sin?He is repenting for your sin...What did John say when he say Jesus coming?
John 1:29
The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 1:36
And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!
Do you have a Bible that you actually read sir?
That's the first I've heard of that.
And I thought it was because he offerd himself as a sacrifice for the sins of many. Not because he was baptised by John.
1 Cor 9
26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
Heb 6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
Heb 10
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
You ignored the passage I supplied. Typical.
I have more from the NT which I might go into some other time, but seeing that you already dodged this one from the Old Testament then forget it. You have a history of doing this. I'm not going to bother engaging in your tactics of stupidity.
Shilohsfoal
Well-known member
You know, it makes sense why I wouldn't need to be baptised in water after all. According to you, Jesus did it for me long ago.He is repenting for your sin...What did John say when he say Jesus coming?
John 1:29
The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
John 1:36
And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!
Do you have a Bible that you actually read sir?
Shilohsfoal
Well-known member
According to you, I don't need to be baptised in water because Jesus already did it for me.But you reject water baptism in the name of Jesus.
And since the holy spirit comes in Jesus name and I've been baptised in it, I've been baptised in Jesus name.
Amen.
There are 3 tenses to salvation that often get mixed up by works-salvationists. 1. We have been saved from the PENALTY of sin (justification) 2. We are being saved from the POWER of sin (ongoing sanctification) 3. We will be saved from the PRESENCE of sin (glorification)True, but justification is a now experience.
Romans 8:30 - Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. ALL of them. Notice how Paul uses the past tense for a future event to stress it's certainty.All those saved will endure until the end, otherwise they were never justified to begin with,
You seem to be saying that Rom 8:30 nullifies the first 15 verses of the chapter.Romans 8:30 - Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. ALL of them. Notice how Paul uses the past tense for a future event to stress it's certainty.