Cornelius and the Gentiles with him received the Holy Spirit (Acts 10:47)

[Fred]

Acts 10:47-48
(47) “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?”
(48) And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days. (NASB)

Since these Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (v. 47) before they were water baptized (v. 48) proves they were saved before they were water baptized.

It is important to notice that "at critical or problematic moments of the early mission thereafter what was looked for above all else was the reception or possession of the Spirit" (NIDNTT 3:699, Spirit, James Dunn); cf. Acts 11:15-17; 15:8; 19:2. This is because "reception of the Spirit determines absolutely whether a man is a Christian or not (Ac. 10:47 19:2)" (TDNT 4:7, lambanō, Delling). Thus, "the receiving of the Spirit is the decisive thing, not baptism" (TDNT 6:623, Jordan, Rengstorf).

From the beginning of the Church age in Acts 2:4[1] and onward anyone who has received the Holy Spirit is a Christian while the unsaved have not received the Holy Spirit (John 14:17; cf. Romans 8:9; 2 Corinthians 11:4; Jude 1:19).

John 7:37-39
(37) Now on the last day, the great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried out, saying, “If anyone is thirsty, let him come to Me and drink.
(38) “He who believes in Me, as the Scripture said, ‘From his innermost being will flow rivers of living water.’”
(39) But this He spoke of the Spirit, whom those who believed in Him were to receive.(NASB)
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit. (NASB)
John 7:37-39 teaches that drinking of the Spirit occurs when He is received. Since the Holy Spirit was received by the Gentiles (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48) proves they did "drink of one Spirit" (1 Corinthians 12:13) before their water baptism. Thus, the baptism mentioned in 1 Corinthians 12:13 refers to being baptized with the Holy Spirit.
BDAG (3rd Edition): All those who belong to God possess or receive this spirit and hence have a share in God's life. This spirit also serves to distinguish Christians fr. all unbelievers. (pneuma, page 834)

Romans 8:15
For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father (KJV).
1. BDAG (3rd Edition): The Spirit, whom the converts receive, works as pneuma huiothesias Ro 8:15. (huiothesia, page 1024)
2. Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament (EDNT): The Spirit received by the believers is pneuma huiothesias (and not douleias) and allows them to experience the new father-son relationship (Rom 8:15). (3:381, huiothesia, F. Hahn)

1 Corinthians 2:12
Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God (NASB)
New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (NIDNTT): noun Christou echomen, "we have the mind of Christ". This is in keeping with the thought in 1 Cor. 2:12, that Christians have received the Spirit from God, in order that they may know what God has given them. (3:129, Reason, G. Harder)

Galatians 3:2-3
(2) This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
(3) Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? (NASB)
When the Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48) is when they "began" their Christian life.
1. BDAG (3rd Edition): Abs. you who have made a beginning (in your Christian life). (pneuma, page 835)
2. Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words: used in Gal. 3:3 ("having begun in the Spirit"), to refer to the time of conversion. (Begin, page 103)

Galatians 3:14
in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith (NASB).
Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words: Several places in the NT identify what God has promised as the end-time gift of the Holy Spirit. In Lk. 24:49 Jesus tells the disciples that he is sending "the promise of the Father" to them, and then in Acts 1:4 this thought is resumed when the disciples are instructed to remain in Jerusalem and await "the promise of the Father." In Acts 2:33 it becomes explicit that in this case "the promise of the Father" is the Holy Spirit as Luke records Peter saying in his Pentecost sermon: "having received the promise of the Holy Spirit from the Father, he has poured out this that you see and hear." Paul connects the promise of the Holy Spirit to the blessing of Abraham in Gal. 3:14. Believers are sealed by the Holy Spirit of the promise (Eph. 1:13). (Promise, page 542)

[1] What took place in Acts 2:4 is the beginning of the New Testament Church.
a. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (TDNT): Concerning Acts 2:4, "This event is regarded by Luke as the birthday of the church" (6:50, pentēkostē, Lohse).
b. New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (NIDNTT): What until Pentecost, the decisive date for the universal church, was the privilege of only a few individuals, is from that day forward the most important characteristic of the Jewish and subsequently (cf. Acts 10) the Gentile church. According to Acts 2:4, all were "filled with the Holy Spirit" (1:739, Fullness, R. Schippers).
c. Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament: in the beginning, when the church was founded, Acts 11:15 (archē, page 76).
d. The Zondervan Encyclopedia of the Bible: The primary reference to Pentecost in the NT is in connection with the pouring of the Holy Spirit to dwell in the church (Acts 2:1). This event was in answer to the explicit promise of Christ (Jn. 16:7, 13; Acts 1:4, 14). It is almost universally agreed among theologians that Pentecost marks the beginning of the church as an institution (4:783, Pentecost, C. L. Feinberg).

 

[Our Lord's God]

Acts 10:47-48
(47) “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?”
(48) And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days. (NASB)

Since these Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (v. 47) before they were water baptized (v. 48) proves they were saved before they were water baptized.

So then anyone who has not received the Spirit is not saved even if they believed the Gospel and were baptized in the name of Jesus, RIGHT?

 

[Fred]

So then anyone who has not received the Spirit is not saved even if they believed the Gospel

If anyone today believes the Gospel they are saved - and would have the Holy Spirit.

 

[Our Lord's God]

If anyone today believes the Gospel they are saved - and would have the Holy Spirit.

Things have changed have they?

 

[Fred]

Things have changed have they?

There are two instances (both taking place in the Book of Acts) when the Holy Spirit was not yet received when the Gospel was believed (Acts 8:14-17; 19:1-7).

 

[BJ Bear]

Acts 10:47-48
(47) “Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we did, can he?”
(48) And he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days. (NASB)

Since these Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (v. 47) before they were water baptized (v. 48) proves they were saved before they were water baptized.

You know your assertion is just out of context false story telling, right? A person who can distinguish between what Scripture actually says and what a person reads into Scripture will realize that no where in that passage does it state or imply what you claim.

What happened wirh Cornelius and gang was in fulfillment of the vision given to Peter since by his own words it is apparent that he was slow to understand and act on the Lord's command to disciple all peoples by baptizing and teaching them all that He commanded them, Matthew 28:19-20. (The words translated as baptizing and teaching are participles which inform the listeners and readers of the verb translated as disciple.)

The out of context remainder of your post was intentionally passed over.

 

[Fred]

You know your assertion is just out of context false story telling, right? A person who can distinguish between what Scripture actually says and what a person reads into Scripture will realize that no where in that passage does it state or imply what you claim.

Galatians 3:2-3
(2) This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
(3) Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? (NASB)
When the Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48) is when they "began" their Christian life.
1. BDAG (3rd Edition): Abs. you who have made a beginning (in your Christian life). (pneuma, page 835)
2. Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words: used in Gal. 3:3 ("having begun in the Spirit"), to refer to the time of conversion. (Begin, page 103)

Thanks for making that easy for me.

 

[BJ Bear]

Galatians 3:2-3
(2) This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
(3) Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? (NASB)
When the Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48) is when they "began" their Christian life.
1. BDAG (3rd Edition): Abs. you who have made a beginning (in your Christian life). (pneuma, page 835)
2. Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words: used in Gal. 3:3 ("having begun in the Spirit"), to refer to the time of conversion. (Begin, page 103)

Thanks for making that easy for me.

I'm glad that Scripture according to it's God given perfect immediate context in which it was given made it easy for you to abandon the claim you were trying to make with regard to Acts 10. Let's see if it will do the same with regard to Galatians 3.

When Paul wrote what you quoted it didn't and still doesn't exclude baptism into Christ as a means of salvation. Everyone can know this by the two following plainly stated in Scripture truths. 1) Paul in Galatians was writing to the baptized. 2) Later in chapter three, when Paul starts drilling down by assigning cause he explicitly states that their faith rests on their baptism into Christ.

“24. Therefore the law has become our guardian, leading us to Christ, so that we might be justified by faith.25. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. 26. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:24-27, EMTV)

Why not come clean and post why you currently feel compelled to deny what Scripture says about Christ and baptism into Him?

 

[Fred]

1) Paul in Galatians was writing to the baptized.

Paul in Galatians was writing to those who partook of the Lord's Supper.

2) Later in chapter three, when Paul starts drilling down by assigning cause he explicitly states that their faith rests on their baptism into Christ.

“24. Therefore the law has become our guardian, leading us to Christ, so that we might be justified by faith.25. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. 26. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:24-27, EMTV)

Once again referring to the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-4#post-619743

You are making this real easy for me.

 

[BJ Bear]

The Savior saves.​

Paul in Galatians was writing to those who partook of the Lord's Supper.

Do you think your latest claim somehow excludes Paul from having written to the baptized Galatians? If not then what is the purpose of contextlessly posting your latest claim as a response to Paul writing to the baptized? If you were only posting information then why didn't you post or also post that they were meat eaters, drank water, assembled regularly, etc?

Once again referring to the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-4#post-619743

Once again your unstated assumptions have resulted in an imaginative misinterpretation which attempts to despise and deny what Scripture actually says about Christ and baptism into Him. As previously posted, in assigning cause to the Galatians, the Apostle Paul assigns baptism into Christ, the incarnate, crucified, as risen Lord, as the basis of their fairh.

"24. Therefore the law has become our guardian, leading us to Christ, so that we might be justified by faith.25. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. 26. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:24-27, EMTV)

Obviously, you have been taught a different gospel than what Paul and the others preached to the Galatians.

The Savior saves.​

So which wack-a-doodle idea or ideas is it that currently moves you to despise and deny what the word of God ractually says egarding Christ, baptism into Him, and the Holy Spirit?

You are making this real easy for me.

Posting one's misguided imagination might be easy, but trying to pass that off as the right interpretation, or a right interpretation, of what God actually says in Scripture is a gross error.

The Savior saves.​

 

[Fred]

The Savior saves.​

Do you think your latest claim somehow excludes Paul from having written to the baptized Galatians?

Nope.
They were also Christians who partook of the Lord's Supper.

Being water baptized did not make Cornelius and the Gentiles with him Christians and being water baptized did not make them Christians.

"24. Therefore the law has become our guardian, leading us to Christ, so that we might be justified by faith.25. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. 26. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:24-27, EMTV)

Obviously, you have been taught a different gospel than what Paul and the others preached to the Galatians.

It was because of the faith of Cornelius and the Gentiles with him that they were baptized with the Holy Spirit.

 

[BJ Bear]

The Savior saves.​

Nope.
They were also Christians who partook of the Lord's Supper.

Ok, so it was just some off topic information. Thanks for the explanation.

Being water baptized did not make Cornelius and the Gentiles with him Christians and being water baptized did not make them Christians.


It was because of the faith of Cornelius and the Gentiles with him that they were baptized with the Holy Spirit.

This is interesting . When it was previously demonstrated from the actual text of Acts 10 that your claim was false you then appealed to Galatians 3. Now that it has been demonstrated from the actual text of Galatians 3 that your claim is false regarding it you revert back to Acts 10 to apparently once again make the same demonstrably false claim about it. (Of course, that assumes that you aren't making an on topic substantive distinction between your previous use of the word "saved" and your current use of the word "Christian.")

Since there isn't any substantive Scriptural evidence to despise or deny what Scripture actually says about Christ, baptism into Him, and the Holy Spirit below are some constructive suggestions for understanding why the LORD and the Apostles and Evangelists plainly stated promises like:

“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.” (Mark 16:16, KJVA) The words translated as believeth and is baptized are aorist (usually translated into English as past tense, that is, believed and baptized) participles which tell us about the verb translated as shall be saved. Also, please note there is no relative pronoun in the passage. This means that those who understand it to mean something like, "He who believes [this other thing] and is baptized shall be saved..." are reading their imagination into the passage.

Why the command of the risen LORD to those whose minds He opened to understand the Scriptures (the Law and the Prophets) to preach repentance and the forgiveness in His name was then proclaimed as, “..."Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.” (Act 2:38-39, KJVA)

Understand why Paul proclaimed baptism into the incarnate, crucified, and risen LORD is the basis of the Christian faith. “25. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. 26. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:25-27, KJVA)

The suggestions are:

Read Genesis chapter one to reach a right understanding of the creation account and the role of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in it. This sets the stage for the new creation and the role of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in it.

If someone prefers to learn by listening rather than reading on one's own then listening to the first two episodes of Foty Minutes In The Old Testament will walk a person through some of the highlights of how Genesis one proclaims the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in it. It will put a person on the path to reaching the right understanding of Scripture, the Christian understanding of Scripture, including the role of God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) in the new creation.

To listen to the first two episodes one must click on the link below and then scroll all the way to the bottom.

40 Minutes in the Old Testament

www.1517.org

The Savior saves.​

 

[Fred]

The Savior saves.​

Ok, so it was just some off topic information. Thanks for the explanation.

It proves your assertion that they were water baptized has nothing to do with them being saved by being water baptized.

This is interesting . When it was previously demonstrated from the actual text of Acts 10 that your claim was false you then appealed to Galatians 3.

Nope.

I had Galatians 3 in my OP.

No need to read through the rest of your garbage when your two assertion above are so easy to deal with.

 

[BJ Bear]

The Savior saves.
​

It proves your assertion that they were water baptized has nothing to do with them being saved by being water baptized.

You missed the point being made.through the actual text of Galatians. The point is that when Paul wrote to the Galatians that they, "having begun in the Spirit," it necessarily did not exclude their being baptized as you inferred and continue to infer.

Nope.

I had Galatians 3 in my OP.

Your continued out of context citation from Galatians doesn't change the fact then when your interpretation of a particular text, Acts 10, was demonstrated to be false through it's immediate context you jumped to the other text, Gal 3. Then when your interpretation of that text,Gal 3, was proven to be false through it's immediate context you jumped back to Acts 10.

Now that you've been reminded that your interpretation of Acts 10 is false your claim is that you aren't continuing to jump between verses because you used them in an out of context manner in the OP. That is a sure demonstration on your part that you have no in context Scriptural evidence which supports your false interpretations .

No need to read through the rest of your garbage when your two assertion above are so easy to deal with.

The Savior saves.
​

Everyone reading through this thread will realize you preach a different gospel than that of Paul and the others to the Galatians and to all men. (If someone has started reading the thread at this post then click here to see the explanation from the text of Galatians why this is so.)

The concrete suggestions to reaching a right understanding of Scripture with regard to Christ, baptism into Him, and the Holy Spirit continue to be:

Read Genesis chapter one closely for comprehension to reach a right understanding of the creation account and the role of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in it. This sets the stage for the new creation and the role of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in it.

If someone prefers to learn by listening rather than reading on one's own then listening to the first two episodes of Foty Minutes In The Old Testament will walk a person through some of the highlights of how Genesis one proclaims the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit in it. It will put a person on the path to reaching the right understanding of Scripture, the Christian understanding of Scripture, including the role of God (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit) in the new creation.

To listen to the first two episodes one must click on the link below and then scroll all the way to the bottom.

40 Minutes in the Old Testament

www.1517.org

​

 

[Fred]

The Savior saves.
​

The point is that when Paul wrote to the Galatians that they, "having begun in the Spirit," it necessarily did not exclude their being baptized as you inferred and continue to infer.

Strawman.
It doesn't exclude their water baptism and their partaking of the Lord's Supper, but they were saved before both events.

Their beginning of their Christian life is when they received the Holy Spirit. Notice this took place with Cornelius and the Gentiles with him (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48).

Your continued out of context citation from Galatians doesn't change the fact then when your interpretation of a particular text, Acts 10, was demonstrated to be false through it's immediate context you jumped to the other text, Gal 3.

Both speak of the Holy Spirit being received. You want to dodge this fact because it refutes your heresy.

 

[BJ Bear]

The Savior saves.​

Strawman.
It doesn't exclude their water baptism and their partaking of the Lord's Supper, but they were saved before both events.

That is the same silly scripturally baseless assertion with which you started this thread despite being shown from the actual text that you are just making up stories which despise and sent Christ, baptism into Him, the Holy Spirit, and the Father. The one LORD GOD stakes His name on baptism into Christ. That's why the command to the already baptized disciples is to baptize all peoples in the name of the The Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

The Savior saves.​

It is apparent that the current method of interpretation displayed in your posts isn't any different than that of the confused, the cultists and the outright mockers because like them an error has been imagined and then repeatedlly read into Scripture.

Their beginning of their Christian life is when they received the Holy Spirit. Notice this took place with Cornelius and the Gentiles with him (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48).

That claim again mistakes your imagination for what Scripture actually says and means. This has been demonstrated to you from that section of Scripture previously in this thread.

Both speak of the Holy Spirit being received. You want to dodge this fact because it refutes your heresy.

I've never dodged then receiving the Spirit but that doesn't exclude that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ. And I will not deny the incarnate, crucified, and risen Lord"s promises throughout Scripture to His already baptized disciplines that he who believed and was baptized shall be saved, Mark 16:16.

Please note again that in Mark 16:16 there is no relative pronoun in search of an antecedent. That means believed is connected to baptized into Christ. This is the gospel which Paul and the others preached to the Galatians and the rest of the world. For example, again see Galatians 3:25-27.

This also means that those read the passage and think it means, "he who believes [this other thing] and [then] is baptized shall be saved,"are finding their meaning of the passage in their Imagination.

They are like the Scripturally uninformed teacher of Israel, Nicodemus, who came at night to speak to Jesus. Like Nicodemus they don't have a right understanding of Moses so they can't understand Jesus when He says unless a man be born from above or born again he cannot see the kingdom of God, etc., See John 3.

 

[Fred]

The Savior saves.​

That is the same silly scripturally baseless assertion with which you started this thread despite being shown from the actual text that you are just making up stories which despise and sent Christ, baptism into Him, the Holy Spirit, and the Father. The one LORD GOD stakes His name on baptism into Christ. That's why the command to the already baptized disciples is to baptize all peoples in the name of the The Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

The Savior saves.​

It is apparent that the current method of interpretation displayed in your posts isn't any different than that of the confused, the cultists and the outright mockers because like them an error has been imagined and then repeatedlly read into Scripture.

Zero proof given for your inane assertions.

That claim again mistakes your imagination for what Scripture actually says and means. This has been demonstrated to you from that section of Scripture previously in this thread.

No, it hasn't.

I've never dodged then receiving the Spirit

I quoted at least two lexicons that affirm if one has received the Spirit he/she is a Christian.
You have provided a grand total of zero that say otherwise.

Myths die hard.

but that doesn't exclude that baptism does now save you through the resurrection of Christ.

Peter said "us" and you have no record that Peter was water baptized for the forgiveness of sins.

And I will not deny the incarnate, crucified, and risen Lord"s promises throughout Scripture to His already baptized disciplines that he who believed and was baptized shall be saved, Mark 16:16.

https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-9#post-625175

For example, again see Galatians 3:25-27.

I did, and it refers to being baptized with the Holy Spirit.
https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-4#post-619743

Nicodemus, who came at night to speak to Jesus. Like Nicodemus they don't have a right understanding of Moses so they can't understand Jesus when He says unless a man be born from above or born again he cannot see the kingdom of God, etc., See John 3.

https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-20#post-630761

 

[BJ Bear]

The Savior saves.​

Zero proof given for your inane assertions.



No, it hasn't.



I quoted at least two lexicons that affirm if one has received the Spirit he/she is a Christian.
You have provided a grand total of zero that say otherwise.

Myths die hard.



Peter said "us" and you have no record that Peter was water baptized for the forgiveness of sins.



https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-9#post-625175



I did, and it refers to being baptized with the Holy Spirit.
https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-4#post-619743




https://forums.carm.org/threads/baptism-after-salvation.5614/page-20#post-630761

It is apparent that you are now recycling your imaginative and contrary to Scrioture easons for despising and denying Christ, baptism into Him, the Holy Spirit, and the Father. Since that is so and since you have been unable or unwilling to post which wack-a-doodle idea or ideas move you to despise and deny God's clear word in this regard here is some background and more on what the Mark and Galatians passages say and mean.

Many of the posts on this board are an argument about whose form of legalism is better. This is because both sides fail to distinguish between God's promises and His commands. And it also makes it harder for some people to understand the Gospel and what I am posting.

In the tradition of the Evangelical Church (also commonly called Lutheran in the U.S.) we usually refer to it as the LORD's distinction of law (In the narrow sense what God has commanded men to do and which has a consequence, good or bad associated with it.) and gospel (In the narrow sense what God has done and does for all men in the person and work of Christ.)

A succinct and clear demonstration of the Lord's distinction of law and Gospel can be found in Romans 6:23. In the following citation the law will be in green and the Gospel in red. “For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.” (Rom 6:23, KJVA)

With the LORS's distinction in mind the question in reading Mark 16:16 is whether the passage is law or Gospel or neither. Here it is:

“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.” (Mar 16:16, KJVA)

The passage is clearly Gospel since it is a promise from the LORD based on His person and work. No one should interpret it as law or a command since there is no imperative or command in the passage for men to do.

As a promise from the incarnate, crucified, and risen LORD based on His person and work for all men there is no right reason for men to fear and consequently try to avoid what that promise actually says and means.

As previously noted in other posts in this thread, the words translated as believed (believes in the KJV) and baptized are aorist participles that inform us of the verb translated as shall be saved. In other words, it is telling us of the set of people who the LORD promises will be saved.

It was also previously noted that there is no relative pronoun in the passage so the word believe is necessarily connected or associated with baptism into Christ. Also, because they are aorist participles the passage doesn't indicate a necessary temporal order of believed and then be baptized,.

All of this means that among those who don't believe according to the passage and are condemned already are those who imagine a relative pronoun into the passage such that deny the clear meaning of the passage. Ultimately, they are the ones dodhlging, despising and denying the Gospel, Christian faith

It is the same promise or Gospel message preached by Paul, and the others to the Galatians and the world as demonstrated previously through his assigning baptism into Christ as cause for faith in Galatians 3:25-27, Romans 6, etc.

“25. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. 26. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:27, KJVA) (Gal 3:25-27, KJVA)

“3. Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4. Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. “For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:” (Rom 6:3-5, KJVA)

Jesus said the unbelievers are condemned already and Paul wrote that if someone preaches another gospel let them be anathema.

The Savior saves.​

 

[Fred]

The Savior saves.​

It is apparent that you are now recycling your imaginative and contrary to Scrioture easons for despising and denying Christ, baptism into Him, the Holy Spirit, and the Father. Since that is so and since you have been unable or unwilling to post which wack-a-doodle idea or ideas move you to despise and deny God's clear word in this regard here is some background and more on what the Mark and Galatians passages say and mean.

Many of the posts on this board are an argument about whose form of legalism is better. This is because both sides fail to distinguish between God's promises and His commands. And it also makes it harder for some people to understand the Gospel and what I am posting.

In the tradition of the Evangelical Church (also commonly called Lutheran in the U.S.) we usually refer to it as the LORD's distinction of law (In the narrow sense what God has commanded men to do and which has a consequence, good or bad associated with it.) and gospel (In the narrow sense what God has done and does for all men in the person and work of Christ.)

A succinct and clear demonstration of the Lord's distinction of law and Gospel can be found in Romans 6:23. In the following citation the law will be in green and the Gospel in red. “For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.” (Rom 6:23, KJVA)

With the LORS's distinction in mind the question in reading Mark 16:16 is whether the passage is law or Gospel or neither. Here it is:

“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.” (Mar 16:16, KJVA)

The passage is clearly Gospel since it is a promise from the LORD based on His person and work. No one should interpret it as law or a command since there is no imperative or command in the passage for men to do.

As a promise from the incarnate, crucified, and risen LORD based on His person and work for all men there is no right reason for men to fear and consequently try to avoid what that promise actually says and means.

As previously noted in other posts in this thread, the words translated as believed (believes in the KJV) and baptized are aorist participles that inform us of the verb translated as shall be saved. In other words, it is telling us of the set of people who the LORD promises will be saved.

It was also previously noted that there is no relative pronoun in the passage so the word believe is necessarily connected or associated with baptism into Christ. Also, because they are aorist participles the passage doesn't indicate a necessary temporal order of believed and then be baptized,.

All of this means that among those who don't believe according to the passage and are condemned already are those who imagine a relative pronoun into the passage such that deny the clear meaning of the passage. Ultimately, they are the ones dodhlging, despising and denying the Gospel, Christian faith

It is the same promise or Gospel message preached by Paul, and the others to the Galatians and the world as demonstrated previously through his assigning baptism into Christ as cause for faith in Galatians 3:25-27, Romans 6, etc.

“25. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. 26. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:27, KJVA) (Gal 3:25-27, KJVA)

“3. Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? 4. Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. “For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:” (Rom 6:3-5, KJVA)

Jesus said the unbelievers are condemned already and Paul wrote that if someone preaches another gospel let them be anathema.

The Savior saves.​

What a rambling mess.

The Gentiles received the Holy Spirit (Acts 10:47) before their water baptism (Acts 10:48). This reception of the Spirit (Galatians 3:2) was the beginning of their Christian life (Galatians 3:3).

 

[Shilohsfoal]

The Savior saves.​

Do you think your latest claim somehow excludes Paul from having written to the baptized Galatians? If not then what is the purpose of contextlessly posting your latest claim as a response to Paul writing to the baptized? If you were only posting information then why didn't you post or also post that they were meat eaters, drank water, assembled regularly, etc?

Once again your unstated assumptions have resulted in an imaginative misinterpretation which attempts to despise and deny what Scripture actually says about Christ and baptism into Him. As previously posted, in assigning cause to the Galatians, the Apostle Paul assigns baptism into Christ, the incarnate, crucified, as risen Lord, as the basis of their fairh.

"24. Therefore the law has become our guardian, leading us to Christ, so that we might be justified by faith.25. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. 26. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.” (Gal 3:24-27, EMTV)

Obviously, you have been taught a different gospel than what Paul and the others preached to the Galatians.

The Savior saves.​

So which wack-a-doodle idea or ideas is it that currently moves you to despise and deny what the word of God ractually says egarding Christ, baptism into Him, and the Holy Spirit?


Posting one's misguided imagination might be easy, but trying to pass that off as the right interpretation, or a right interpretation, of what God actually says in Scripture is a gross error.

The Savior saves.​

You do realize that Paul admitted that he was not sent to baptise and repented himself of baptising people. He even thanked God he had not baptised more than he had after realizing his mistake.