brightfame52
Well-known member
Anyone who makes believing a condition to get saved does it.
zerinus
Well-known member
God makes it a condition:
Mark 16:
16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Your problem is with God.
brightfame52
Well-known member
No God does not. That is you making it a condition .
zerinus
Well-known member
I am merely repeating what he says. You are telling me that you know better than God what he says, or wants to say, and you can say it better than he does. Sorry, I don't buy that.
T
TomFL
Guest
brightfame52
Well-known member
He never said believing nor Faith is a condition to get saved. Thats your insinuation, nowhere in scripture.
zerinus
Well-known member
“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
That is logically and grammatically known as a a “conditional statement”. Being “saved” or “dammed” is made dependent on, or conditional on, believing or not believing. That is according to the rules of grammar as well as formal logic.
brightfame52
Well-known member
It says nothing about believing being a condition to get saved.
zerinus
Well-known member
That is exactly what it says, without using the word “condition”. If I say to someone, “I will give you a dollar if you do something for me,” that is a conditional statement. I am making his act of doing something for me a condition for giving him a dollar—without using the word “condition” in the statement.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Its not a condition, and grammar doesn't support that false notion , I have already dealt with this issue and grammar.
Baptism in water is not a condition for your salvation. To preach a doctrine like that will damn you, not save you. When I have a bit more time I will make a series of post on the subject of baptism that will absolutely prove the point to anyone who will believe the words of scripture and be willing to honor context. I will alert you ahead of time because baptism among Calvinists (sprinkling water on someone's head) is a hyper Calvinist doctrine and has to do with children in some kind of covenant they preach and I doubt most Calvinists who post here believe it, so I might post it on the apologetics or Baptism forum. My study will deal with Mark 16:15 and set the record straight.
zerinus
Well-known member
You are defying all the rules of logic, language, grammar, reason, sense vs. nonsense etc. to have it you way. There is no way of arguing against that. You can believe anything you want with that kind of mindset. It is not the way to arrive at the knowledge of the truth.
Would that be true during the first 4000 years of human history?
brightfame52
Well-known member
You the one, you have the slightest notion what you talking about. You are in grace error to make believing a condition to get saved.
zerinus
Well-known member
LOL! No comment.
TibiasDad
Well-known member
I'm sorry, bf52, but you have lost all credibility when you assert such nonsense. You are being stiff-necked and deliberately closing your eyes to deny the obvious! Calvinism doesn't deny the condition of believing, it merely places another condition prior to believing, and that is regeneration. Believing is conditioned on regeneration, and salvation is conditioned on believing, and both, in Calvinism, are irresistible.
Doug
brightfame52
Well-known member
I dont understand what you talking about with all these conditions. Believing is not a condition to get saved, period. Thats making Salvation conditioned on works, something a man does. Thats condemned in scripture.