And I will stick with my statement that the Word had his beginning at John 1 in the beginning and since he had his beginning in the beginning and it says the Word was God in the beginning, then the Word could have only have been God in the beginning. You have to prove the Word was before the beginning as the Word or Jesus or the Son of God clearly.
Did Jesus create the angels?
- Thread starter jamesh
- Start date
Well if you stick with that then you have the FATHER's beginning there in John 1:1 also, as God the WORD is listed with God or " God with God " as John 1:1 correctly states AS IS! Thus your Twisted view ( 2 Peter 3:16 ) has ALL of GOD having His beginning in John 1:1 and not before that! So you also agreed that God the Father EXISTED eternally before John 1:1! You can't have it BOTH ways! So since ALL of GOD existed eternally with no beginning, then my view is the Correct one and my view is that ALL ( Father, Word & Holy Spirit/Ghost - 1 John 5:7 - see also Matt.28:19 ) of GOD existed before John 1:1 transpired! Case Closed!
You have been told over and over the Fathers has no beginning because it does not say in the beginning was God and he created things at gen 1. Nowhere does it say in the beginning was God and it only says in the beginning "was" the Word and he was with God. Until you can provide the scripture where it says in the beginning "was" God anywhere the case is closed as it only says in the beginning "was" the Word and thus the Word had a beginning.
Your wrong on that, Jesus was before all creation. Apart from Christ nothing was created that was created. Jesus is eternal. Jesus is Creator.
The problem with these claims is that they fail to note that Jesus is the name given to a human being eight days after he was born, whereas the Word which became this human being has no beginning or conception.
As closely related as identification is to identity, identification is not identity. The man Jesus does not identify with himself, but claims the life that animates this person as his very identity.
He does not say that the life or the way or the truth are a personage, but discards the flesh as worthless. He IS the eternal life that animates and sustains the universe personified in Christ.
It is the very nature of Christ to illustrate self denial or self sacrifice. To cease to identify with a personage reveals the only true identity there is.
Attention Hacker 56. I'm well aware that Jesus is the creator (John 1:3) and He is God in flesh. I'm a Trinitarian. Those first two paragraphs are what the JW's teach. In other words, I'm quoting them, it's not what I believe.
In God the Son,
james
Jesus created nothing and that has been proven many times. Also Jesus has existed for only the last 2,000 or so years that there is documentation for.
Leatherneck0311
Well-known member
You are proof that no one can make another believe the truth. Praying you get out of your own way and rely on God not yourself.
State your point and we will see who has the best evidence?
Leatherneck0311
Well-known member
The point is you ignore every scripture that proves to any reasonable person that nothing created wasn’t created by Jesus including angeles. Your false teaching and bias has blinded you to truth.
The Prophet
Well-known member
If Jesus had no beginning, he was not created Hebrews 7:3
You mean NWT ( New World Translation ) of the holy scriptures that the JW's made & use!
The problem you have is that your "assuming" that Melechizedek is Jesus Christ. He is "likened to the Son of God whose perpetual priesthood is eternal by divine decree. The words in this verse, "but made like the Son of God means that a parallel exists between Melchizedek and Jesus. Of course this does not preclude Jesus Christ from being not created and eternal, which He is.
IN GOD THE SON,
james
Jesus had a beginning when the word entered into creation. John 1:14
No you ignore the evidence and the evidence says Jesus created nothing and I have proven that many times and then you all act as if it was not explained. The him at John 1:4 can not be Jesus because the life in the him was Jesus and that leaves only one left who can be the him "the creator" and that is the Father, then at col. 1: 12-14 the subject is the Father and at vs 15 it says he is an image of the invisible God or the Father. The subject stays the Father and he is an image of the Father or the subject. Also look up the word "of" in the dictionary and the subject is always to the right of the word "of".
Colossians 1:14 refers to Jesus.
No it does not.
The Watchtower: It is administered to us through Christ Jesus, "by means of whom we have our release by ransom, the forgiveness of our sins.” (Col. 1:14, NW) (Receiving Mercy by Showing Mercy, May 15, 1951, page 292)