Did Jesus teach he was GOD himself?

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
Spoke to His Father. So what.
Prayed to, bowed to, worshipped the Father. Never reciprocated.

One person is God, the Father, Exodus 20:3-6. No other God before me.

Luke 1:35
And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
Angels, Israel, David, etc., are called sons of God.

Notice the child above is called son of God after birth, not before.

Bye bye 👋
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
Jesus didn't father himself/create himself, so he isn't the Creator of all.


I explained this already. God spoke singularly. Nothing is said of 3 persons.

Bye bye
God created humans to pro-create. So yes God did NOT created all humans! He only created Adam & Eve to do the rest of the job! Your explanation is NULL & Void of the correct view of Isaiah 9:6! Jesus was the prophesized child/Son and He is called " Mighty God " ! Case closed on your Twisting those posted scriptures! So yes Bye bye Mr. Jewjitzu, as you remain 100 refuted!
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
It's interesting that you didn't reply on the verses provided.

I never said the festivals weren't important, so why bring it up?

BTW, did Jesus' blood make it on the altar in Jerusalem according to the law? Or is that not important?

Is human sacrifice in the law permissible, or is that not important?
FYI, animal blood was a temporary cover of Sin! Jesus' blood was the permanent sacrifice and it is on the alter in Heaven! Case closed!
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
Jesus didn't father himself.
And your human father ( not God ) fathered you! So once again Jewjitzu , God ( Trinity - Us & Our ) created Adam & Eve in His Triune image so they could PRO-Create the human race! All humans have a body, soul & spirit!
 
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rod.ney

Well-known member
Prayed to, bowed to, worshipped the Father. Never reciprocated.

One person is God, the Father, Exodus 20:3-6. No other God before me.


Angels, Israel, David, etc., are called sons of God.

Notice the child above is called son of God after birth, not before.

Bye bye 👋
FYI, Jesus Christ is the ONLY Begotten Son of God! All other sons are Adopted once they accept Jesus Christ as their Lord & Savior ( Born again )! No one gets to the Father EXCEPT THROUGH Jesus Christ as per His own say so in John 14:6! Case closed!
 

Anthony

Active member
Why are you mixing apples with oranges?
You always see scriptures through a small window without understanding the overall harmony of scriptures concerning creation, salvation, Redemption and the glory. That's why I said you are mixing Apples with Oranges - devoid of a fuller revelation.

But I'm not surprised because most of the people on this forum are in the same boat dispute disagreements.
 

Anthony

Active member
The beginning of time started with the creation of the universe.

Do you agree?

And you said “since” the beginning of time.
There was no Father or Son before creation. If this is understood lots of doctrinal errors can be solved.

It's pretty clear that we are living at a time exactly as Noah as Yeshua warned us. There is not going to be any revival. The way people are reluctant to come out of their traditions shows that revelations of scriptures are limited to only a few. My 2 cents.
 

Anthony

Active member
No as anything past from the present is time whether in the natural universe or outside it, whether natural or spiritual.
Spiritual world coexists with the natural. Heaven was a creation so also angelic beings. There is no time factor with God Time is a creation itself. The ages were framed by the word of God.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
God created humans to pro-create. So yes God did NOT created all humans! He only created Adam & Eve to do the rest of the job!
Genesis 6:7
So the LORD said, “I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them.”

God is the cause and effect of all. Even of Jesus.

Your explanation is NULL & Void of the correct view of Isaiah 9:6! Jesus was the prophesized child/Son and He is called " Mighty God " !
Rotfl... once again, the NT never references the names in this verse with Jesus. You're explanations are all made up. Hezekiah was the promised child. The zeal of the Lord references prove it, Isaiah 9:7, Isaiah 37:32, 2 Kings 19:31, and their associations with Hezekiah.

Deut 32:6
Is He not your Father and Creator? Has He not made you and established you?

Isaiah 44:2
This is what the LORD says— he who made you, who formed you in the womb, and who will help you: Do not be afraid, Jacob, my servant, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen.

Isaiah 44:24
This is what the LORD says— your Redeemer, who formed you in the womb: I am the LORD, the Maker of all things, who stretches out the heavens, who spreads out the earth by myself...

Jesus came from the womb with God the Father as his Creator. Enough said.
 
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Jewjitzu

Well-known member
FYI, animal blood was a temporary cover of Sin! Jesus' blood was the permanent sacrifice and it is on the alter in Heaven! Case closed!
The commandments required blood on the altar in Jerusalem. Jesus failed here.

The temple, priests, and sacrifices are coming back per Jeremiah 33:17-26.

So much for Jesus' blood.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
And your human father ( not God ) fathered you! So once again Jewjitzu , God ( Trinity - Us & Our ) created Adam & Eve in His Triune image so they could PRO-Create the human race! All humans have a body, soul & spirit!
Triune image? Humans aren't 3 persons individually so your explanation fails from the start.

God isn't a body, soul, spirit either. You failed.
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
FYI, Jesus Christ is the ONLY Begotten Son of God!
Begotten, from Psalm 2:7, comes from yulad, to be born. Today. So, Jesus was created from the womb as proven earlier.

All other sons are Adopted once they accept Jesus Christ as their Lord & Savior ( Born again )!
Jesus was adopted by Joseph, correct? Born again deals with commandments and was the reason Nicodemus was questioned.

No one gets to the Father EXCEPT THROUGH Jesus Christ as per His own say so in John 14:6! Case closed!
The law is the way, the truth, and light. The Tanakh says so. Even Jesus said it was the way to earn eternal life. Keep the commandments. ;)
 

Jewjitzu

Well-known member
Many times people don't get into things because it wouldn't be worth the hassle. You're wrong because Jesus' death paid the debt for those times too.
There is zero evidence of this. Speaking of debt, when did Jesus pay the monetary debt that remains with certain sins, like stealing? A sacrifice doesn't pay that.

So, it would be nice, honest, for you to acknowledge your mistake as it is very evident and open that you made one previously. You made a blanket statement which was false.

You guys had a tabernacle in Shilo for years before ever building a temple. Frankly, you just gave up following God's command to sacrifice. It's one thing when you physically can't because you're not allowed in exile. But, that wasn't the case since 70 AD.
Frankly, once the temple was built, all sacrifices were required to be at the altar in Jerusalem. I'm glad you acknowledged that and defeated your own argument. ;)

Spiritualize? Who's spiritualizing anything? We are Gentiles. We do not fall under your law. It simply doesn't apply to us. Your Law was created to separate you from the outer world while pointing to Christ.
You spiritualize it when it comes to Jesus fulfilling everything. Which he didn't. The laws point to God, not Messiah. A basic study and search proves this.

Frankly, I think open ended challenges like this are silly. Not only are you measuring the standard by the picture, your challenge is constructed in such a way that it could never be completed in any meaningful timescale. In short, you're saying I'm wrong because I haven't written a Talmudic sized rebuttal of all of Judaism.
No, you couldn't do it with a simple whitepaper. But, it's great that you acknowledge the difficulty, if not the impossibility of doing so.

Again, it cracks me up when people talk about Jesus fulfilling in himself the sacrifices without thinking of the specifics involved. Details matter.

That went right over your head. When the one, whom Joshua had to remove his shoes before, sheds his blood for the sins of his people, the picture pointing to that Sacrifice doesn't really manner.
There's zero evidence Joshua bowed to Jesus. Why make that up?

There's nothing to go over my head. Christianity makes up types again to spiritualize any requirements to fulfill the commandments. It cracks me up.

The sun was darkened, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split.
Zero evidence of this anywhere. Josephus doesn't mention it nor any Roman sources of the time. You need to do better.

And, you're worried about following a ritual. God commanded you to follow that ritual to point to Christ; when God offers the sacrifice, he chooses the ritual.
No, nothing points to Messiah, but to God. Christianity is man-centered. That's the problem.

God commanded even the rituals. They need to be obeyed.

Correct, a substitute was offered in Issac's place:
He said, “Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I shall tell you.”...Then Abraham reached out his hand and took the knife to slaughter his son. But the angel of the LORD called to him from heaven and said, “Abraham, Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.” He said, “Do not lay your hand on the boy or do anything to him, for now I know that you fear God, seeing you have not withheld your son, your only son, from me.” And Abraham lifted up his eyes and looked, and behold, behind him was a ram, caught in a thicket by his horns. And Abraham went and took the ram and offered it up as a burnt offering instead of his son. Genesis 22:2, 10-13
The ram was the plan all along. That's why Abraham said he'd return with Isaac.

What is a burnt offering?
If his offering is a burnt offering from the herd, he shall offer a male without blemish. He shall bring it to the entrance of the tent of meeting, that he may be accepted before the LORD. He shall lay his hand on the head of the burnt offering, and it shall be accepted for him to make atonement for him. Leviticus 1:3-5

Burnt offering were offered in atonement for sin.
Yes, which shows offerings, sacrifices, were efficacious for atonement. So, Jesus wasn't required. ;)

God Bless
Likewise
 
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DoctrinesofGraceBapt

Well-known member
Many times people don't get into things because it wouldn't be worth the hassle. You're wrong because Jesus' death paid the debt for those times too.
There is zero evidence of this.

Except for the NT, and the life death and resurrection of Jesus.

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
You guys had a tabernacle in Shilo for years before ever building a temple. Frankly, you just gave up following God's command to sacrifice. It's one thing when you physically can't because you're not allowed in exile. But, that wasn't the case since 70 AD.
Frankly, once the temple was built, all sacrifices were required to be at the altar in Jerusalem.

Really? Says who? Did I miss something in my reading of the OT?

I'm glad you acknowledged that and defeated your own argument. ;)

Don't know what you're talking about.

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
Spiritualize? Who's spiritualizing anything? We are Gentiles. We do not fall under your law. It simply doesn't apply to us. Your Law was created to separate you from the outer world while pointing to Christ.
You spiritualize it when it comes to Jesus fulfilling everything. Which he didn't. The laws point to God, not Messiah. A basic study and search proves this.

Jesus is God, and messiah. I don't know what you think we are spiritualizing, but whatever.

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
Frankly, I think open ended challenges like this are silly. Not only are you measuring the standard by the picture, your challenge is constructed in such a way that it could never be completed in any meaningful timescale. In short, you're saying I'm wrong because I haven't written a Talmudic sized rebuttal of all of Judaism.
No, you couldn't do it with a simple whitepaper. But, it's great that you acknowledge the difficulty, if not the impossibility of doing so.

If the difficulty rests in the hardheadedness of the reader, what can be done?

Again, it cracks me up when people talk about Jesus fulfilling in himself the sacrifices without thinking of the specifics involved. Details matter.

For since the law has but a shadow of the good things to come instead of the true form of these realities, it can never, by the same sacrifices that are continually offered every year, make perfect those who draw near. Otherwise, would they not have ceased to be offered, since the worshipers, having once been cleansed, would no longer have any consciousness of sins? But in these sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year. For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to takeaway sins. Consequently, when Christ came into the world, he said, “Sacrifices and offerings you have not desired, but a body have you prepared for me; in burnt offerings and sin offering you have taken no pleasure. Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come to do your will, O God, as it is written of me in the scroll of the book.’” When he said above, “You have neither desired nor taken pleasure in sacrifices and offerings and burnt offerings and sin offerings” (these are offered according to the law), then he added, “Behold, I have come to do your will.” He does away with the first inorder to establish the second. And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when Christ had offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet. For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified. Hebrews 10:1-12

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
That went right over your head. When the one, whom Joshua had to remove his shoes before, sheds his blood for the sins of his people, the picture pointing to that Sacrifice doesn't really manner.
There's zero evidence Joshua bowed to Jesus. Why make that up?

There's nothing to go over my head. Christianity makes up types again to spiritualize any requirements to fulfill the commandments. It cracks me up.

Do you have any idea which passage I'm referring to? I'm trying to show you how silly your critiques about following rituals are in light of the claims we are making.

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
The sun was darkened, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom. And the earth shook, and the rocks were split.
Zero evidence of this anywhere. Josephus doesn't mention it nor any Roman sources of the time. You need to do better.

I'm quoting Scripture.

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
And, you're worried about following a ritual. God commanded you to follow that ritual to point to Christ; when God offers the sacrifice, he chooses the ritual.
No, nothing points to Messiah, but to God. Christianity is man-centered. That's the problem.
God commanded even the rituals. They need to be obeyed.

Silly comments.

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
Correct, a substitute was offered in Issac's place:
He said, “Take your son, your only son Isaac, whom you love, and go to the land of Moriah, and offer him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains of which I shall tell you.”...Then Abraham reached out his hand and took the knife to slaughter his son. But the angel of the LORD called to him from heaven and said, “Abraham, Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.” He said, “Do not lay your hand on the boy or do anything to him, for now I know that you fear God, seeing you have not withheld your son, your only son, from me.” And Abraham lifted up his eyes and looked, and behold, behind him was a ram, caught in a thicket by his horns. And Abraham went and took the ram and offered it up as a burnt offering instead of his son. Genesis 22:2, 10-13
The ram was the plan all along. That's why Abraham said he'd return with Isaac.

Not. The requirement is human Sacrifice. The substitute is the ram, the main sacrifice was Christ:

DoctrinesofGraceBapt said:
What is a burnt offering?
If his offering is a burnt offering from the herd, he shall offer a male without blemish. He shall bring it to the entrance of the tent of meeting, that he may be accepted before the LORD. He shall lay his hand on the head of the burnt offering, and it shall be accepted for him to make atonement for him. Leviticus 1:3-5
Burnt offering were offered in atonement for sin.
Yes, which shows offerings, sacrifices, were efficacious for atonement. So, Jesus wasn't required.

Sacrifices that haven't been done in almost 2000 years. Think of it; 2000 years of Jews dying in the sin without any atonement.

God Bless
 

Tanachreader

Well-known member
Prayed to, bowed to, worshipped the Father. Never reciprocated.
Jesus was in the flesh born a man.

One person is God, the Father, Exodus 20:3-6. No other God before me.
John 10:30
I and [my] Father are one.
Angels, Israel, David, etc., are called sons of God.

Notice the child above is called son of God after birth, not before.

Bye bye 👋
4 Who has ascended to heaven and come down?
Who has gathered the wind in his fists?
Who has wrapped up the waters in a garment?
Who has established all the ends of the earth?
What is his name, and what is his son’s name?
Surely you know!

The“Son” is identified with the Creator also involved in Creation, thus making Him equal with the Creator. John 1:1-5; Colossians 1:13-17; Hebrews 1:3.
 

Tanachreader

Well-known member
Spiritual world coexists with the natural. Heaven was a creation so also angelic beings. There is no time factor with God Time is a creation itself. The ages were framed by the word of God.
Any point before creation God can measure as He was their doing something with His Son.
 
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Tanachreader

Well-known member
God is alone, exactly one, Neh 9:6. God doesn't bow to others. Jesus does. ;)
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
 
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