Doctrine of Unconditional Election

brightfame52 said:
And so do you. You believe in Salvation conditioned on your human faith and him on regenerate faith, both believe in conditional salvation by the person.
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Except scripture supports my claim and opposes your claim

Romans 4:16 (KJV)
16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

Romans 4:1-5 (KJV)
1 What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?
2 For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

You are just unbiblical as even at least one Calvinists notes
 
Election is unconditional because God has chosen His People by Grace before the foundation Eph 1:4, of course this means this means He could not have chosen them or their works. This also means it was not based upon any foreseen, works, decisions, or believing or anything they do or do not do. This is called Gods election of grace Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
 
brightfame52 said:
Election is unconditional because God has chosen His People by Grace before the foundation Eph 1:4, of course this means this means He could not have chosen them or their works. This also means it was not based upon any foreseen, works, decisions, or believing or anything they do or do not do. This is called Gods election of grace Rom 11:5-6

5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
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Election is in Christ

that is a condition

Men fulfill when they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (KJV)
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
 
ReverendRV said:
Civic and Theo aren't liked by most of the other side, but both are exactly right. They say 'Why won't other Calvinists say anything about Theo's attitude?'. I think it takes all kinds of people and all kinds of attitudes to win people. Some need a kick to the boot, others need to be led by the hand in life. I'll speak up to a Calvinist when they're wrong; especially about the Gospel...
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agreed :)
 
Christian said:
agreed :)
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It reminds me of a time whenever I attended my Reformers Unanimous addictions meeting. We would moan and groan and listen to the religious lessons, but when one of the guys said "Hey We're Men, let's man up"; I had more success in that class than I had ever by listening to the lesson. It was an example of me needing a swift kick in the butt...
 
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ReverendRV said:
It reminds me of a time whenever I attended my reformers unanimous addictions meeting. We would moan and groan and listen to the religious lessons, but when one of the guys said Hey We're Men let's man up; I had more success in that class than I had ever by listening to the lesson. It was an example of me needing a swift kick in the butt..
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yes I married a good woman who tells it like it is :)

and I have a few close friends where we do the same with each other- speaking the truth in love.
 
ReverendRV said:
Having Tom back would be like having Gadgeteer back ? You would probably like him now...
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I forgot about him you are right lol.

The thing is regardless of which side you fall on this forum(carm) for the most past has been used to sharpen iron whether its here, apologetic, theology, trinity or whatever subforum. As a calvinist it helped me defend my beliefs better, as a non calvinist the same and it helps you understand the other side of the argument if one is open to see things from the other side. For me personally I'm thankful and my journey is not over. The essentials will always remain in tact( non negoitable ) , the non essentials will more than likely have movement/change( liberty ) and in all things I will try and practice charity. That is my goal. I believe reforming should be a constant, not a one time event in the past. its what causes us to learn and grow. That is just my opinion FWIW.
 
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