Doctrine of Unconditional Election

Tercon

Well-known member
No, sorry, that's mystical nonsense and heresy. You're hoodwinked.

Nothing at all “mystical nonsense and heresy” about what I said.

How do you think Christ knows and experiences God the Father if not in and with his believing mind silly? Also, how do you think God the experiences Himself and His own reality if not in and with His own believing mind?

If the ONLY way and place that the truth, morality, logic, consciousness, existence and reality itself can be known and experienced is in and by a believing mind, then the truth, morality, logic, consciousness, existence and reality itself must be the product of God's believing mind.

And if YOU cannot know and experience the truth, morality, logic, consciousness, existence and reality itself outside of or without the benefit of a believing mind, then YOU too cannot know or experience the truth, morality, logic, consciousness, existence and reality itself without a believing mind as well.

Therefore, nothing can be known to exist without or outside of a believing mind, because it is only a believing mind that is capable of knowing and experiencing the truth and reality to begin with.
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love.” (Ephesians 1:4)

Mind the wording , “according as” in the verse. It refers back to verse three (3) of this chapter, and the words, “hath blessed”. This past tense phrase has implicit in it the blessing of being chosen in Christ before the world began. Clearly, Paul says: The salvation of the elect of God has for its base the eternal and merciful selection of the Sovereign Lord of heaven. The Greek word from which our English, “hath chosen” comes, literally means, “to mark off”, or “to select out” for one’s self. in view of and according with the Father’s good pleasure, wherein He has chosen an infinite number of humanity, their spiritual blessings flow.

This proclaims the Sovereign unconditional Election of God in Christ before the foundation of the World.
 

TomFL

Well-known member
According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love.” (Ephesians 1:4)

Mind the wording , “according as” in the verse. It refers back to verse three (3) of this chapter, and the words, “hath blessed”. This past tense phrase has implicit in it the blessing of being chosen in Christ before the world began. Clearly, Paul says: The salvation of the elect of God has for its base the eternal and merciful selection of the Sovereign Lord of heaven. The Greek word from which our English, “hath chosen” comes, literally means, “to mark off”, or “to select out” for one’s self. in view of and according with the Father’s good pleasure, wherein He has chosen an infinite number of humanity, their spiritual blessings flow.

This proclaims the Sovereign unconditional Election of God in Christ before the foundation of the World.
The church collectively/corporately

Individuals are not in Christ until they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (ESV)
13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
The church collectively/corporately

Individuals are not in Christ until they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (ESV)
13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
You can't receive it can you.
 

TomFL

Well-known member
You can't receive it can you.
Falsehoods ? No

The church collectively/corporately

Individuals are not in Christ until they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (ESV)
13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
Falsehoods ? No

The church collectively/corporately

Individuals are not in Christ until they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (ESV)
13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
No the truth!
 

TomFL

Well-known member
No the truth!


The church collectively/corporately

Individuals are not in Christ until they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (ESV)

13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

When were they sealed in Christ but when they heard and believed
 

brightfame52

Well-known member
The church collectively/corporately

Individuals are not in Christ until they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (ESV)

13 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,

When were they sealed in Christ but when they heard and believed
You do know the Church is a collection of Individuals dont you ? All the Church and its individual members were chosen in Christ before the foundation, so like ususal, you shoot yourself in the foot. Trying to deny scripture, you confirm what it says, God is amazing !
 

TomFL

Well-known member
You do know the Church is a collection of Individuals dont you ? All the Church and its individual members were chosen in Christ before the foundation, so like ususal, you shoot yourself in the foot. Trying to deny scripture, you confirm what it says, God is amazing !
Of course

A corporate body

Are you suggesting God could not know a corporate body would be united to Christ through faith

sorry but you just don't know what you are speaking about

This is not a view I invented but a well established view
 

Manfred

Well-known member
How does God know you if He doesn't believe you exist? And God doesn't ask us to do anything that He doesn't do Himself as well, He tells us to believe because He believes as well. And if Christ believed, then God believed as well. Or did you miss that in your religious fervor?

And if you can't even know the truth without a belief in reality, then how can you know anyone can know the truth or reality without a belief silly?
11 Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.

According to you God hopes you exist, and because He has not seen you he is convicted that you do exist.

Explain this gnostism?
 
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