No.
Faith Alone
- Thread starter Aaron32
- Start date
Falling away and sinning are two separate concepts. All have sinned and come short of the glory of God. Being in Christ is conditional.
If ye abide in Me.
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love.
If you remain in me and my words remain in you.
That’s why we are offered the avenue of repentance.
A text without a context is a pretext.
Janice Bower
Well-known member
Both mesenja and Aaron32 are Mormons. Here's the Mormon description of God from their scriptures in Doctrine and Covenants, section 130:
22 The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit.
In Mormonism, there are multiple extra-biblical works that are required in order to EARN eternal life. They call us Christians but don't accept us as such. The teachings are that theirs is the only church acceptable to Christ.
22 The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit.
In Mormonism, there are multiple extra-biblical works that are required in order to EARN eternal life. They call us Christians but don't accept us as such. The teachings are that theirs is the only church acceptable to Christ.
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Janice Bower
Well-known member
Mormons can't abide in Christ by following false prophets.
The King Follett Sermon, On April 7, 1844, Joseph Smith rose to speak in what would prove to be his last conference.:
In the sermon, Joseph taught about divine nature and eternal progression. He countered the long-standing theological tradition that treated God as wholly different than humanity. He explained that “if men do not comprehend the character of God they do not comprehend themselves.”3 He taught that God “was once as one of us” and that “all the spirits that God ever sent into the world” were “susceptible of enlargement,” having the capacity to become like God in the eternities.4 Joseph also taught that a core part of each person is coeternal with God, comparing this divine core to a ring, without beginning or end.
Mormons are taught to have godhood as their goal, but some Mormons aren't even worthy of knowing that.
The King Follett Sermon, On April 7, 1844, Joseph Smith rose to speak in what would prove to be his last conference.:
In the sermon, Joseph taught about divine nature and eternal progression. He countered the long-standing theological tradition that treated God as wholly different than humanity. He explained that “if men do not comprehend the character of God they do not comprehend themselves.”3 He taught that God “was once as one of us” and that “all the spirits that God ever sent into the world” were “susceptible of enlargement,” having the capacity to become like God in the eternities.4 Joseph also taught that a core part of each person is coeternal with God, comparing this divine core to a ring, without beginning or end.
Mormons are taught to have godhood as their goal, but some Mormons aren't even worthy of knowing that.
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Think what you want about us. I guess you’ve been successfully reprogrammed from the cult haven’t you? ?
Janice Bower
Well-known member
He made the covenant with Abraham!
I’ve been Latter-day Saint for over 30 years. Godhood had was never my goal. Even when we discussed the topic it was few and far between.
Janice Bower
Well-known member
Janice Bower
Well-known member
In your religion the elect are those who have EARNED godhood/eternal life.
Aaron32
Well-known member
How does one safely determine the spiritual blindness of another?
It’s obvious that have no idea what the quote means.
Janice Bower
Well-known member
The blind can't see, but not all are blind. The Holy Spirit convicts the ones God is saving. God wants us to distinguish the spiritual blindness in others. That's why there are so many warnings in the Bible and that is why He has given us the Comforter.
Some of us know enough of God's Word, the Bible, to recognize truth from error.
2 Timothy 3
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Isaiah 40
8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever.
Psalm 119
11Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.
The Holy Spirit teaches Christians. God enables Christians to believe truth.
Regeneration preceding faith is not truth. God has a lot of work yet to do.
I know what I believe. Answer the question.
and every branch that bears fruit He prunes,that it may bear more fruit.
prune
trim (a tree,shrub,or bush) by cutting away dead or overgrown branches or stems,especially to increase fruitfulness and growth.
reduce the extent of (something) by removing superfluous or unwanted parts.
prune
trim (a tree,shrub,or bush) by cutting away dead or overgrown branches or stems,especially to increase fruitfulness and growth.
reduce the extent of (something) by removing superfluous or unwanted parts.
every branch that bears fruit He prunes,that it may bear more fruit.
This is My comandment,that you love one another as I have loved you.
If you keep My commandments,you will abide in My love.
If you remain in me and my words remain in you.
If you remain in me and my words remain in you.
As the Father loved Me,I also have loved you;abide in My love.
If you keep My commandments,you will abide in My love,just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.
If you keep My commandments,you will abide in My love,just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.
The condition is to remain in Christ.
Every branch in Me
Abide in Me
Every branch in Me
Abide in Me
docphin5
Well-known member
The OP is about faith and works. Please don’t infect every OP with your judgment and cynicism of Mormonism by bringing up an unrelated topic. We get it, you don’t like Mormons, but do you have to get your jab in at every opportunity?
Your post is off-topic.
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docphin5
Well-known member
Agreed.
He sets his audience up for the error using sleight of hand…
What “commandments”? It seems the devil is in the details. This is how religious leaders sneak in their own works of the flesh (1), by generalizing ritual purity (of their own making) under the heading of “commandments“ of God.
According to Paul, there is only one commandment that fulfills the whole law, “Love your neighbor.” All other “commandments” are rejected by Paul, if for no other reason than to repudiate works of the flesh or ritual purity imposed by priestly leaders, in Paul’s day, Judaism, but in this case, the Mormon prophet.
”For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” (Gal 5:14)
1) “Now the Law crept in (slipped in, snuck in) so that the offense would increase.” (ISV, gal 5:20)
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docphin5
Well-known member
Good question, especially given that we ALL peer through a glass dimly or know in part. IOW, none us see perfectly.
”For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully,” (1 cor 13:12)
If we keep an open mind and are willing to change our position based on better information then we are safe from the spirit of judgment and condemnation. But those who judge harshly will be judged themselves by the same standard.
docphin5
Well-known member
What is the fruits of surrendering to Jesus (aka the Holy Spirit), according to Paul?
“But the fruit of the Spirit is
love,
joy,
peace,
patience,
kindness,
goodness,
faithfulness,
gentleness,
self-control;
against such things there is no law.
…
If we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit.” (Gal. 5:22)
Please note that there is not a single instance of ritual purity identified as “fruit”. Not a single “command“ to perform some ritual in a Temple, or anywhere else for that matter, in order to bear fruit for God. Not a single work of the flesh required to be in Jesus. These are ALL virtues that reside within the individual just as the Spirit resides in the individual.
Therefore, both Paul and the Gospel Jesus are in perfect harmony. They both abrogate the physical, ritualistic requirements, aka, “commandments”, of the Law, for the mystic meaning pertaining to spiritual life. Whosoever, then would declare another ritualistic requirement under the guise of a “commandment” for the purpose of glorification, sanctification, or absolution, has no need for the Holy Spirit, aka, the inner Christ Jesus. It is how Paul arrived at what appears to be an extreme position when he said, “Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision [as a necessity], Christ will be of no advantage to you.” (Ga 5:2)
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