Faith Alone

[Grace_Accepted]

Where does the scripture say that Jesus is bearing your eternal punishment?

We all, like sheep, have gone astray,

each of us has turned to our own way;

and the Lord has laid on him

the iniquity of us all. ~Is 53:6

God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God. 2 Cor 5:21

What manner of love is this?

Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— Gal 3:13

 

[Grace_Accepted]

But that is not what is written in the scripture, is it?

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— Eph 2:8 Amen!

it seems like you did not reach vs 26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

If you desire to willfully sin, you have never been saved. We are saved from sin, not in sin. People are saved from what they hate and what they fear, not from what they love. Those that love darkness more than light will receive what they love for eternity, but those of us that love the light will receive what we love, eternal light.

That is nonsense and not written in the scripture...If someone asks you to quote the chapter and verse where you took that from where would you point them? Do you see the problem?
1 Corinthians 1:10

It is Grace by faith that saved me.
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; Eph 2:8

It is a living faith
Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. James 2:17
If the faith produces no change in you then it is not a living faith, it is dead and has no power. The works of God is to believe in Jesus Christ.

 

[Newbirth]

We all, like sheep, have gone astray,

each of us has turned to our own way;

and the Lord has laid on him

the iniquity of us all. ~Is 53:6

God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God. 2 Cor 5:21

What manner of love is this?

Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— Gal 3:13

Nothing you posted says that Jesus is bearing your eternal punishment...

 

[Grace_Accepted]

Nothing you posted says that Jesus is bearing your eternal punishment...

I suppose you can look at it that way, But I am glad He bore my sins. I am glad that He was pierced for my transgressions, He was crushed for my iniquities; the punishment that brought me peace was upon Him, and by His stripes, I am healed.

However, if we believe in the Lord Jesus Christ with all of our hearts, it does not matter what one believes about this matter. Ouf faith in His Grace will secure us to Him and His salvation.

 

[Newbirth]

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— Eph 2:8 Amen!

so where does it say that Jesus is bearing your eternal punishment?

If you desire to willfully sin, you have never been saved.

So who was the author writing to? Was it saved, people or unsaved people? Why did the author include himself?
Hebrews 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

We are saved from sin, not in sin. People are saved from what they hate and what they fear, not from what they love. Those that love darkness more than light will receive what they love for eternity, but those of us that love the light will receive what we love, eternal light.

How does that support your position that they have never been saved?

It is Grace by faith that saved me.
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; Eph 2:8

We are saved by Grace through Faith...not grace by faith...

It is a living faith
Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. James 2:17
If the faith produces no change in you then it is not a living faith, it is dead and has no power. The works of God is to believe in Jesus Christ.

you are not understanding the scripture...James is not speaking about a literally dead faith, he is speaking about faith without action. So for you to claim a "living faith" shows your ignorance of the scripture.
Faith does not produce anything...If you have faith YOU will act if you have no faith YOU will not act, it is that simple.

 

[Newbirth]

I suppose you can look at it that way,

It is what it is, not how I look at it...

But I am glad He bore my sins. I am glad that He was pierced for my transgressions, He was crushed for my iniquities; the punishment that brought me peace was upon Him, and by His stripes, I am healed.

so where does it say that Jesus is bearing your eternal punishment? That is your claim, I am asking you where does the scripture say it?

However, if we believe in the Lord Jesus Christ with all of our hearts, it does not matter what one believes about this matter.

You are not making any sense, how can you believe when you don't know what you believe?

Ouf faith in His Grace will secure us to Him and His salvation.

It is our obedience to the faith that secures us...
Romans 16:26
But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

I am not sure where you are learning from but you are missing the mark

 

[Grace_Accepted]

It is what it is, not how I look at it...

so where does it say that Jesus is bearing your eternal punishment? That is your claim, I am asking you where does the scripture say it?

Look, I don't split hairs. I rejoice that He bore my punishment which was to be eternal for me. You may choose to believe differently and there is no way a human will change their opinions by argument. This is something between a person and God. I rejoice in His love and assurance that I no longer am under eternal punishment because He bore it for me.

You may believe differently on this matter but if you are trusting in Jesus for your salvation and I am also trusting in him for my salvation, we are on the right track. Now we can learn of Him who was meek and lowly of heart.

You are not making any sense, how can you believe when you don't know what you believe?

...I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that he is able to guard what I have entrusted to him until that day. 2 Tim 1:12

It is our obedience to the faith that secures us...
Romans 16:26

I just praise God for this verse. It ratifies for me that salvation comes through faith and obedience comes from salvation. (Eph 2:10) I think good works reflect the image of Christ in us in every aspect of our lives including how we conduct ourselves in public forums. Wouldn't you agree?

But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Have you ever thought about the difference between obedience and obedience of faith? Obedience of faith is a curious phrase. I think it is related to Abraham's faith in God which was counted to him as righteousness. I do know that I am made perfect forever by Christ's one sacrifice while being made Holy by His spirit.

I am not sure where you are learning from but you are missing the mark

Thank you for your concern.

 

[Grace_Accepted]

So who was the author writing to? Was it saved, people or unsaved people? Why did the author include himself?
Hebrews 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

To understand this properly I referred to Jesus' parable of the sower. This shows salvation from God's perspective. I believe God knows all from the beginning to the end so I feel He knows who has been saved and who has not for all eternity.

 

[Our Lord's God]

I already have the pass Praise God! It is something we can all rejoice in. “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. John 5:24

This is the wondrous love of God that he came and tabernacled with us. Immanuel!

So you thought salvation was the result of believing in your head that something is true?

 

[Grace_Accepted]

So you thought salvation was the result of believing in your head that something is true?

Absolutely not. It is the result of Jesus bearing my guilt and sin and giving me eternal life. Of course, I must have faith in God to receive it because you can't receive a gift you don't believe in.

 

[ziapueblo]

I already have the pass Praise God! It is something we can all rejoice in. “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. John 5:24

A less sophisticated translation of the text: "Truly truly I say to you the [one] the word of Me hearing (akouōn) and believing (pisteuōn) the [One] having sent Me he has life eternal and into judgement not comes but has passed out of death into life."

The Greek present participles for “hearing” (akouōn) and “believing” (pisteuōn) indicate an ongoing action.

What if we choose to stop hearing and believing?

Consider the Gospel according to St. Matthew, 6:14-15 (this is right after Christ gives us the Lords prayer), "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father also will forgive you; but if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses."

Salvation is much more than belief in Christ for who He is. Ultimately, Christ is our judge.

 

[Grace_Accepted]

A less sophisticated translation of the text: "Truly truly I say to you the [one] the word of Me hearing (akouōn) and believing (pisteuōn) the [One] having sent Me he has life eternal and into judgement not comes but has passed out of death into life."

The Greek present participles for “hearing” (akouōn) and “believing” (pisteuōn) indicate an ongoing action.

What if we choose to stop hearing and believing?

Consider the Gospel according to St. Matthew, 6:14-15 (this is right after Christ gives us the Lords prayer), "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father also will forgive you; but if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses."

Salvation is much more than belief in Christ for who He is. Ultimately, Christ is our judge.

Believe, adhere to trust in, and rely on is how I would put it. Heb 6, 4-8 describes what happens when one stops believing.

It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss, they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end, it will be burned.

But I would caution myself to never look upon another person and determine that they have done this. It is up to God alone to judge such things. I also remind myself that God already knows who will fall away and who will not. So from His viewpoint, all who do not resist him will be saved. I know that I have less than zero desire to ever leave. Jesus asked his mournful disciple, "will you leave also?" I echo their answer, "To whom shall we go? You have the words of life."

 

[ziapueblo]

It is up to God alone to judge such things.

Amen

I know that I have less than zero desire to ever leave.

Amen and I continually pray that I stay on the strait and narrow path.

 

[Grace_Accepted]

Amen


Amen and I continually pray that I stay on the strait and narrow path.

Amen, that is why Jesus says abide with me.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

How do you define "Faith Alone"?

Does faith alone mean "lawlessness" where we completely disregard the commandments?

Nope. WHat it MEANS is that being Born Again of the Holy Spirit Happens ONLY, and for no other reason, than by FAITH (Gifted by God) in the perfect SIN OFFERING of Jesus on the cross (Eph 2:8,9). Being Born Again results in being infilled with the Holy Spirit who joins himself to YOUR spirit, and begins to lead a person in the ways of righteous living according to God's will. The natural result of this union will be a changed life, and a growing tendency toward "good works" which are the RESULT of the holy SPirit's influence, but which contribute NOTHING to the actual cleansing of SIN, which comes only by FAITH in Jesus SIN OFFERING to cleanse (not just forgive) SIN.

 

[Janice Bower]

So then you believe in your head that this fact is true and that get's you a pass on Judgment Day?

If God gave you/me the faith, He didn't give a bogus or inferior faith.

“That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.”

Who gets a pass? The one God chooses!

John 5
23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

John 3:16-18, too.

Jesus raised himself from the dead!

Bye. I'm going back to deal with Mormonism.

 

[Revized]

If a circle has corners, is it still a circle, and if so, how?
Saved Christians don't "willfully reject a known commandment".

Salvation starts off by being regenerated by God, with God taking out our old heart of stone, and replacing it with a God-loving heart of flesh. Salvation is not simply "obeying commandments", nor is it nothing but a "decision" someone makes. It is God quickening us to a new life in Christ.

about 'Saved Christians don't "willfully reject a known commandment".
what would your thoughts be concerning beloved David and bathsheba? It surely was not a unwilling violation of the commandment, or merely a slip of some sort.
I would rather say
"Saved Christians should no longer "willfully reject a known commandment".

 

[1Thess521]

How do you define "Faith Alone"?

Does faith alone mean "lawlessness" where we completely disregard the commandments?

"faith alone" is an inaccurate translation of Sola Fide (Latin ablative, sōlā fidē, meaning "by faith alone")
Sola Fide addresses how we are justified (declared righteous by God)
"Faith" in Sola Fide does not mean the mere mental/intellectual acceptance of some facts; but rather the supernatural, God-given gift of trust.

We are justified by faith alone.

Faith alone does NOT mean "lawlessness" where we completely disregard the commandments

 

[Newbirth]

Look, I don't split hairs. I rejoice that He bore my punishment which was to be eternal for me. You may choose to believe differently and there is no way a human will change their opinions by argument. This is something between a person and God. I rejoice in His love and assurance that I no longer am under eternal punishment because He bore it for me.

I don's see how that helps your position according to...Matt 7
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

You may believe differently on this matter but if you are trusting in Jesus for your salvation and I am also trusting in him for my salvation, we are on the right track. Now we can learn of Him who was meek and lowly of heart.

What part of Matt 7
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: Do you not understand?

...I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that he is able to guard what I have entrusted to him until that day. 2 Tim 1:12

Paul is speaking for himself, not you.

I just praise God for this verse. It ratifies for me that salvation comes through faith and obedience comes from salvation. (Eph 2:10)

Eph 2:10 does not say that.

I think good works reflect the image of Christ in us in every aspect of our lives including how we conduct ourselves in public forums. Wouldn't you agree?

Yep , that is why when you are using the scripture you should quote it and not make up your own doctrine.

Have you ever thought about the difference between obedience and obedience of faith? Obedience of faith is a curious phrase. I think it is related to Abraham's faith in God which was counted to him as righteousness.

Yes because God has given ever man the measure of faith...
Romans 12:3
For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

I do know that I am made perfect forever by Christ's one sacrifice while being made Holy by His spirit.

That is a clear misunderstanding of scripture... If you are perfect, why can't you say, You have not sinned?
1 John 1:10
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Thank you for your concern.

You are welcome

 

[eternomade]

Can you expound on this?
If a person wilfully rejects a known commandment, are they still "saved", and if so...how?

Hello. Every sin is wilful. Grace alone does not entice sinners to sin. Sin entices sinners to sin. If one sees grace alone as a license to sin, it means they are unregenerate.