Foreknowledge: How Does God Know?

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
To quote the late Don Rickles on Dean Martin’s Celebrity Roast when they were roasting Bob Hope...


“There’s no booing! There’s no booing! If there’s another outburst we’re going to let Bob Hope get up and do his jokes!”

I’ll use that quote and edit it to my liking...


“There’s no booing! There’s no booing! If there’s another outburst I’m going to let @preacher4truth get up and post in here!”
 

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
Now we have dead ppl believing.

Next thing will be the eisegesis of John 11 and when Jesus called Lazarus from the dead He said, "Look, Lazarus was dead and he heard my voice and came out of his own volition. I will now reward him by making him alive!" :rolleyes:
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
Now we have dead ppl believing.

Next thing will be the eisegesis of John 11 and when Jesus called Lazarus from the dead He said, "Look, Lazarus was dead and he heard my voice and came out of his own volition. I will now reward him by making him alive!" :rolleyes:
Why didn't others in that burial ground raise up too? Old Lazarus must've been the only dead Pelagian there.
 
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TomFL

Guest
Now we have dead ppl believing.

Next thing will be the eisegesis of John 11 and when Jesus called Lazarus from the dead He said, "Look, Lazarus was dead and he heard my voice and came out of his own volition. I will now reward him by making him alive!" :rolleyes:
Spiritually dead

Just as you have the spiritually dead hating, rejecting suppressing truth

and its scripture which of course you will not address

John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

A dead man passed from death to life upon believing

John 5:25 ¶ “Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming, and is now here, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live.

The dead who hear live

John 5:40 yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.

Dead men come to Christ to live

John 20:31 but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Dead man believes that he might have life

Acts 11:18 —ESV
“When they heard these things they fell silent. And they glorified God, saying, “Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance that leads to life.””

dead man repents to have life

John 3:3–18 —ESV
“Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
Nicodemus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”
Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’
The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”
¶ Nicodemus said to him, “How can these things be?”
Jesus answered him,
“Are you the teacher of Israel and yet you do not understand these things?
Truly, truly, I say to you, we speak of what we know, and bear witness to what we have seen, but you do not receive our testimony.
If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how can you believe if I tell you heavenly things?
No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up,
that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.
¶ “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.”

dead man believes to be born again


John 3:36 —ESV
“Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.”

dead man believes to receive life that is eternal

John 6:40 —ESV
“For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.””

again dead man believes to receive life that is eternal

John 6:47 —ESV
“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.”
 
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TomFL

Guest
Why didn't others in that burial ground raise up too? Old Lazarus must've been the only dead Pelagian there.
Your first problem is the narrative of Lazarus in never used to illustrate soteriology - the spiritual resurrection of a spiritually dead but physically alive sinner
 

Sketo

Well-known member
But does Sketo not believe God cannot know what he has not determined ?

You have not proven that there is anything, outside of God’s determining, that needs to be known! Therefore...

Calvinism holds that God knows everything without the need for God’s knowledge to be “open” to any external determining sources... such as being subject to a creature!
 
T

TomFL

Guest
You have not proven that there is anything, outside of God’s determining, that needs to be known! Therefore...

Calvinism holds that God knows everything without the need for God’s knowledge to be “open” to any external determining sources... such as being subject to a creature!
Wrong all the sins of the world

James 1:13 ¶ Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

James 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
James 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
James 1:16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

1Cor. 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

1John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Jer. 19:5 —ESV

“and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, which I did not command or decree, nor did it come into my mind—”
 

Sketo

Well-known member
You have not proven that there is anything, outside of God’s determining, that needs to be known! Therefore...

Calvinism holds that God knows everything without the need for God’s knowledge to be “open” to any external determining sources... such as being subject to a creature!
Wrong all the sins of the world

What does TomFL feel about God determining the most heinous sin in existence?

Thread 'Did God Meticulously Determine The Crucifixion Of Christ?'
https://forums.carm.org/threads/did-god-meticulously-determine-the-crucifixion-of-christ.1937/




Act 2:22-23 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Him, being delivered by the determinate (G3724) counsel (G1012) and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

(G3724) Strong
ὁρίζω
horizō
hor-id'-zo
From G3725; to mark out or bound (“horizon”), that is, (figuratively) to appoint, decree, specify: - declare, determine, limit, ordain.

(G1012) Strong
βουλή
boulē
boo-lay'
From G1014; volition, that is, (objectively) advice, or (by implication) purpose: - + advise, counsel, will

Act 4:27-28 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand (G5495) and thy counsel determined before (G4309) to be done.

(G5495) Strong
χείρ
cheir
khire
Perhaps from the base of G5494 in the sense of its congener the base of G5490 (through the idea of hollowness for grasping); the hand (literally or figuratively [power]; especially [by Hebraism] a means or instrument): - hand

(G4309) Strong
προορίζω
proorizō
pro-or-id'-zo
From G4253 and G3724; to limit in advance, that is, (figuratively) predetermine: - determine before, ordain, predestinate.


How would TomFL feel if God determined
“ALL the sins of the world”
in the exact same way
God determined this one, most heinous, sin?
 
T

TomFL

Guest
What does TomFL feel about God determining the most heinous sin in existence?

Thread 'Did God Meticulously Determine The Crucifixion Of Christ?'
https://forums.carm.org/threads/did-god-meticulously-determine-the-crucifixion-of-christ.1937/




Act 2:22-23 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Him, being delivered by the determinate (G3724) counsel (G1012) and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

(G3724) Strong
ὁρίζω
horizō
hor-id'-zo
From G3725; to mark out or bound (“horizon”), that is, (figuratively) to appoint, decree, specify: - declare, determine, limit, ordain.

(G1012) Strong
βουλή
boulē
boo-lay'
From G1014; volition, that is, (objectively) advice, or (by implication) purpose: - + advise, counsel, will

Act 4:27-28 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand (G5495) and thy counsel determined before (G4309) to be done.

(G5495) Strong
χείρ
cheir
khire
Perhaps from the base of G5494 in the sense of its congener the base of G5490 (through the idea of hollowness for grasping); the hand (literally or figuratively [power]; especially [by Hebraism] a means or instrument): - hand

(G4309) Strong
προορίζω
proorizō
pro-or-id'-zo
From G4253 and G3724; to limit in advance, that is, (figuratively) predetermine: - determine before, ordain, predestinate.


How would TomFL feel if God determined
“ALL the sins of the world”
in the exact same way
God determined this one, most heinous, sin?
Where did you deal with these verses

James 1:13 ¶ Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
James 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
James 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
James 1:16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.
James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

1Cor. 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

1John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Jer. 19:5 —ESV

“and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, which I did not command or decree, nor did it come into my mind—

and where did you prove God determined the desire of the Jews to kill Christ

God used their desire for a
good purpose not to determine all the sins of the world

BTW I enlarged and bolded the word foreknowledge

Seems God's foreknowledge was at work and he knew of their desire to kill Christ

In any case your claim God has determined all the sin of the world is unbiblical
 

Septextura

Well-known member
What does TomFL feel about God determining the most heinous sin in existence?

Thread 'Did God Meticulously Determine The Crucifixion Of Christ?'
https://forums.carm.org/threads/did-god-meticulously-determine-the-crucifixion-of-christ.1937/




Act 2:22-23 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Him, being delivered by the determinate (G3724) counsel (G1012) and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

(G3724) Strong
ὁρίζω
horizō
hor-id'-zo
From G3725; to mark out or bound (“horizon”), that is, (figuratively) to appoint, decree, specify: - declare, determine, limit, ordain.

(G1012) Strong
βουλή
boulē
boo-lay'
From G1014; volition, that is, (objectively) advice, or (by implication) purpose: - + advise, counsel, will

Act 4:27-28 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand (G5495) and thy counsel determined before (G4309) to be done.

(G5495) Strong
χείρ
cheir
khire
Perhaps from the base of G5494 in the sense of its congener the base of G5490 (through the idea of hollowness for grasping); the hand (literally or figuratively [power]; especially [by Hebraism] a means or instrument): - hand

(G4309) Strong
προορίζω
proorizō
pro-or-id'-zo
From G4253 and G3724; to limit in advance, that is, (figuratively) predetermine: - determine before, ordain, predestinate.


How would TomFL feel if God determined
“ALL the sins of the world”
in the exact same way
God determined this one, most heinous, sin?

Tom would never believe in a God like that.
 

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
Why didn't others in that burial ground raise up too? Old Lazarus must've been the only dead Pelagian there.

He wasn’t as dead as the others. There was a faint heart beat that they couldn’t detect. Plus, when they wrapped his head, there was a small opening around his right ear that helped him hear.

#ThoughtYouKnewThis
#WhyDidntYouKnowThis?
#GetWithTheProgram
#Bruh
#AndStuff
 
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