Foreknowledge: How Does God Know?

SovereignGrace

Well-known member
I know, I know, you can't handle sound doctrine, reason, or thinking rationally or logically, so you call it the above.
It’s like eternity. I know it exists. I know God is eternal. When I try to think that there has never been no God, no time, even before time was created, that God was not, I can’t comprehend it. I know it’s there, but cannot comprehend it.
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
I just thought of something. After I became reformed, John 3:16, 2 Peter 3:9, 1 John 2:2, Titus 2:11, 1 Timothy 4:10, and 1 Timothy 2:4 just vanished. Went ***poof***. They were there prior to my switch, but went ***poof***!!! Any idea what happened?
All those verses lined up behind one another on separate pages and your cigar burned a hole through them while drinking Calvinus beer?
 

Septextura

Well-known member
Isaiah 45
5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.

Isaiah 46
9 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,
10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:
11 Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.
12 Hearken unto me, ye stouthearted, that are far from righteousness:

Ephesians 1
9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:
11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
12 That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.

1 Peter 1
1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
 

Septextura

Well-known member
I just thought of something. After I became reformed, John 3:16, 2 Peter 3:9, 1 John 2:2, Titus 2:11, 1 Timothy 4:10, and 1 Timothy 2:4 just vanished. Went ***poof***. They were there prior to my switch, but went ***poof***!!! Any idea what happened?

That Calvinist gnosticism is like sniffing glue under a bridge. It will make you forget things.
 

Sketo

Well-known member
Act 2:22-23 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Him, being delivered by the determinate (G3724) counsel (G1012) and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

(G3724) Strong
ὁρίζω
horizō
hor-id'-zo
From G3725; to mark out or bound (“horizon”), that is, (figuratively) to appoint, decree, specify: - declare, determine, limit, ordain.

(G1012) Strong
βουλή
boulē
boo-lay'
From G1014; volition, that is, (objectively) advice, or (by implication) purpose: - + advise, counsel, will
...
BTW I enlarged and bolded the word foreknowledge
...and...
Act 4:27-28 For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand (G5495) and thy counsel determined before (G4309) to be done.

(G5495) Strong
χείρ
cheir
khire
Perhaps from the base of G5494 in the sense of its congener the base of G5490 (through the idea of hollowness for grasping); the hand (literally or figuratively [power]; especially [by Hebraism] a means or instrument): - hand

(G4309) Strong
προορίζω
proorizō
pro-or-id'-zo
From G4253 and G3724; to limit in advance, that is, (figuratively) predetermine: - determine before, ordain, predestinate.

BTW I enlarged and bolded the words “thy hand” and “thy council” and “determined before to be done”!



Now I will post scripture that brings them into biblical harmony... for your convenience...

Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
- Act 15:18

BTW I enlarged and bolded the words “Known” and “his works”...

Notice that “his works” is not referring to an external source of knowing!
 
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TomFL

Guest
...

...and...


BTW I enlarged and bolded the words “thy hand” and “thy council” and “determined before to be done”!



Now I will post scripture that brings them into biblical harmony... for your convenience...

Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.
- Act 15:18

BTW I enlarged and bolded the words “Known” and “his works”...

Notice that “his works” is not referring to an external source of knowing!
So what's your point

He does not know what he has not determined ?

That is justification for open theism

Is that your position ?
 

Sketo

Well-known member
He does not know what he has not determined ?

Your question assumes a premise which has not been proven...


TomFL has not proven that there is anything, outside of God’s determining, that needs to be known! Therefore...

Calvinism holds that God knows everything without the need for God’s knowledge to be “open” to any external determining sources... such as being subject to a creature!
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Your question assumes a premise which has not been proven...


TomFL has not proven that there is anything, outside of God’s determining, that needs to be known! Therefore...

Calvinism holds that God knows everything without the need for God’s knowledge to be “open” to any external determining sources... such as being subject to a creature!


Wrong

James 1:13 Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God,” for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one.
James 1:14 But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire.
James 1:15 Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.
James 1:16 ¶ Do not be deceived, my beloved brothers.
James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

1Cor. 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it.

1John 2:16 For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world.

Jer. 19:5 —ESV

“and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, which I did not command or decree, nor did it come into my mind—”

You offer only denial of scripture
 

Sketo

Well-known member
James 1:13 Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God,” for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one.
James 1:14 But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire.
James 1:15 Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

Yep... The heart of man plans his way, but the LORD establishes his steps. - Proverbs 16:9

James 1:16 ¶ Do not be deceived, my beloved brothers.
James 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.

Amen!

1Cor. 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it.

Yep... God determines the level of temptation... and the way of escape!

1John 2:16 For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world.

Yep... and if God determines a different outcome God will change the source of the desire! In effect changing the desire!

Jer. 19:5 —ESV
“and have built the high places of Baal to burn their sons in the fire as burnt offerings to Baal, which I did not command or decree, nor did it come into my mind—”

Is TomFL suggesting God did not know this was going to happen?

Is TomFL suggesting God learned this information at some point?

Is TomFL suggesting God’s knowledge is “open to an external source at some point?
Or is TomFL ignorant of what this verse actually teaches?




Contrary to TomFL’s assumption... Jer. 19:5 simply teaches that “burning their sons in the fire as a burnt offering” never entered the mind of God as a way of worshiping him... and God never commanded or decreed that way of worshiping him!
 
T

TomFL

Guest
Yep... The heart of man plans his way, but the LORD establishes his steps. - Proverbs 16:9



Amen!



Yep... God determines the level of temptation... and the way of escape!



Yep... and if God determines a different outcome God will change the
source of the desire! In effect changing the desire!



Is TomFL suggesting God
did not know this was going to happen?


Is TomFL suggesting God learned this information at some point?

Is TomFL suggesting God’s knowledge is “open to an external source at some point?
Or is TomFL ignorant of what this verse actually teaches?




Contrary to TomFL’s assumption... Jer. 19:5 simply teaches that “burning their sons in the fire as a burnt offering” never entered the mind of God as a way of worshiping him... and God never commanded or decreed that way of worshiping him!
Either you are confused or being disengenuous

There was never any suggesting on my part that God did not know

and I believe you know that is you consider what has been posted previously

So to continue with such a suggestion would be dishonnest

In any case God is not the cause of all of man's sin

You are not really dealing with it


Your comments on Jer19:5

are absurd

They were not worshipping the one true God they were worshipping a Pagan god

Are you going to state God was the cause of it when it never entered his mind

and of course

your handling of

TomFL said:
1Cor. 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it.

Yep... God determines the level of temptation... and the way of escape!

Hello if they don't escape and you hold to the determination of all things then God would have had to determine it contrary to what he stated

It is simply not possible to escape God's determination

You are therefore in obvious error


TomFL said:
1John 2:16 For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world.

Have you ever had a lustful idea

It was not from God

so he could not have determined it

Your idea that God is the cause of all of men's sin is just unbiblical
 

Septextura

Well-known member
A new podcast in town, and it answers all your questions.


Flowerite Deists, Molinists and Open Theists destroyed with Logic and Scripture.
 
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