Free Will as taught in Scripture

God is libertarian though ...
"God is a libertarian" is nothing more than an opinion, an unsupported assumption.

If you ever get around to sitting down and reading scripture, you will never find God revealed as libertarian.

You need to repent, Kapioen.
 
"God is a libertarian" is nothing more than an opinion, an unsupported assumption.

If you ever get around to sitting down and reading scripture, you will never find God revealed as libertarian.

You need to repent, Kapioen.

Ok. You don't believe God is libertarian. Then you believe scripture presents God as predetermined.

Then you believe God has no other choice than to give us no other choice.

You should at least see God as libertarian.
 
If God merely foresaw human events, and did not also arrange and dispose of them at his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are so to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment.
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6)



…God is the only being who is ultimately self-determining, and is himself ultimately the disposer of all things, including all choices — however many or diverse other intervening causes are. On this definition, no human being has free will, at any time. Neither before or after the fall, or in heaven, are creatures ultimately self-determining. Beginners guide to free will John Piper website

Nothing that exists or occurs falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing, including no evil person or thing or event or deed. God’s foreordination is the ultimate reason why everything comes about, including the existence of all evil persons and things and the occurrence of any evil acts or events. And so it is not inappropriate to take God to be the creator, the sender, the permitter, and sometimes even the instigator of evil… Nothing — no evil thing or person or event or deed — falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing arises, exists, or endures independently of God’s will. So when even the worst of evils befall us, they do not ultimately come from anywhere other than God’s hand.

b Talbot, "All the Good That Is Ours in Christ", in Suffering and the Sovereignty of God, ed. John Piper and Justin Taylor,

Quote may be found

 
If God merely foresaw human events, and did not also arrange and dispose of them at his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are so to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment.
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6)



…God is the only being who is ultimately self-determining, and is himself ultimately the disposer of all things, including all choices — however many or diverse other intervening causes are. On this definition, no human being has free will, at any time. Neither before or after the fall, or in heaven, are creatures ultimately self-determining. Beginners guide to free will John Piper website

Nothing that exists or occurs falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing, including no evil person or thing or event or deed. God’s foreordination is the ultimate reason why everything comes about, including the existence of all evil persons and things and the occurrence of any evil acts or events. And so it is not inappropriate to take God to be the creator, the sender, the permitter, and sometimes even the instigator of evil… Nothing — no evil thing or person or event or deed — falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing arises, exists, or endures independently of God’s will. So when even the worst of evils befall us, they do not ultimately come from anywhere other than God’s hand.

b Talbot, "All the Good That Is Ours in Christ", in Suffering and the Sovereignty of God, ed. John Piper and Justin Taylor,

Quote may be found

Worthless. Not one of those says we should assume "exhaustive predetermination."
 
Basic elementary reading

do it

Read. No mention of assuming "exhaustive predetermination". Do you actually read the sources you lift from whatever site you get them from?
 
Read. No mention of assuming "exhaustive predetermination".
lolzzz...
Do you actually read the sources you lift from whatever site you get them from?
Um, that would be a negative. That's why I got done fooling around with responding. There would be posts given, quotes of others, I recall Barnes in particular, and all the bolding, italicizing, underlining didn't help because if one merely and actually READ the quote offered one would see the quote literally REFUTED HIM and reinforced our position.

It is a complete waste of time, and it is also refreshing ignoring his posts. "Gotta hurry and paste something, a quote, wall of verses, claim victory, use ad hom, tell them they don't believe, ignore, run, deny, bald denials!, can't answer, sorry, hello, and I don't have time to punctuate, gotta answer every post!"

Um...no thanks.
 
lolzzz...

Um, that would be a negative. That's why I got done fooling around with responding. There would be posts given, quotes of others, I recall Barnes in particular, and all the bolding, italicizing, underlining didn't help because if one merely and actually READ the quote offered one would see the quote literally REFUTED HIM and reinforced our position.

It is a complete waste of time, and it is also refreshing ignoring his posts. "Gotta hurry and paste something, a quote, wall of verses, claim victory, use ad hom, tell them they don't believe, ignore, run, deny, bald denials!, can't answer, sorry, hello, and I don't have time to punctuate, gotta answer every post!"

Um...no thanks.
He is a cherry picker. Always wise to read his citations from the orginal source to get context.
 
Read. No mention of assuming "exhaustive predetermination". Do you actually read the sources you lift from whatever site you get them from?
are you capable of reading a passage without bias

If God merely foresaw human events, and did not also arrange and dispose of them at his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are so to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment.
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6)

all events that is exhautive determination



…God is the only being who is ultimately self-determining, and is himself ultimately the disposer of all things, including all choices — however many or diverse other intervening causes are. On this definition, no human being has free will, at any time. Neither before or after the fall, or in heaven, are creatures ultimately self-determining. Beginners guide to free will John Piper website

all things - exhaustive determination

Nothing that exists or occurs falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing, including no evil person or thing or event or deed. God’s foreordination is the ultimate reason why everything comes about, including the existence of all evil persons and things and the occurrence of any evil acts or events. And so it is not inappropriate to take God to be the creator, the sender, the permitter, and sometimes even the instigator of evil… Nothing — no evil thing or person or event or deed — falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing arises, exists, or endures independently of God’s will. So when even the worst of evils befall us, they do not ultimately come from anywhere other than God’s hand.

b Talbot, "All the Good That Is Ours in Christ", in Suffering and the Sovereignty of God, ed. John Piper and Justin Taylor,

everything exhaustive determination

you are in denial
 
lolzzz...

Um, that would be a negative. That's why I got done fooling around with responding. There would be posts given, quotes of others, I recall Barnes in particular, and all the bolding, italicizing, underlining didn't help because if one merely and actually READ the quote offered one would see the quote literally REFUTED HIM and reinforced our position.

It is a complete waste of time, and it is also refreshing ignoring his posts. "Gotta hurry and paste something, a quote, wall of verses, claim victory, use ad hom, tell them they don't believe, ignore, run, deny, bald denials!, can't answer, sorry, hello, and I don't have time to punctuate, gotta answer every post!"

Um...no thanks.
You have no clue

post the quote if you can
 
are you capable of reading a passage without bias

If God merely foresaw human events, and did not also arrange and dispose of them at his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are so to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment.
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6)

all events that is exhautive determination



…God is the only being who is ultimately self-determining, and is himself ultimately the disposer of all things, including all choices — however many or diverse other intervening causes are. On this definition, no human being has free will, at any time. Neither before or after the fall, or in heaven, are creatures ultimately self-determining. Beginners guide to free will John Piper website

all things - exhaustive determination

Nothing that exists or occurs falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing, including no evil person or thing or event or deed. God’s foreordination is the ultimate reason why everything comes about, including the existence of all evil persons and things and the occurrence of any evil acts or events. And so it is not inappropriate to take God to be the creator, the sender, the permitter, and sometimes even the instigator of evil… Nothing — no evil thing or person or event or deed — falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing arises, exists, or endures independently of God’s will. So when even the worst of evils befall us, they do not ultimately come from anywhere other than God’s hand.

b Talbot, "All the Good That Is Ours in Christ", in Suffering and the Sovereignty of God, ed. John Piper and Justin Taylor,

everything exhaustive determination

you are in denial
That's not the question genius. The question was should we assume it. Nothing about assuming anything in your cherry picked sources. You cannot even cherry pick correctly.
 
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