Freemasonry and False Christian Cults with Dr. Shawn Waugh

[John t]

This post is twaddle. The 'information' biased and incorrect.

Until you Freemasons can produce FROM MASONIC SOURCES something that says words to the effect that, Jesus Christ is King of Kings, Lord of Lords and God incarnate, who came in the flesh then it is YOUR CULT which is the producer of twaddle.

What you men fail to understand is that your work-around of GATOU is simply a name of an ungodly idol, having no interest in the salvation of humanity. You may be clever with words in order to obfuscate the ungodly truth of Freemasonry, but it is those words, and your attempts to lessen both the full humanity of Jesus Christ and his 100% being co-equal with the Father that shall be your undoing.

 

[John t]

Duplicate deleted

 

[Leatherneck0311]

This post is twaddle. The 'information' biased and incorrect.

Reread the 9 points they are scripturally true , and the only twaddle is you ignoring scripture to stay in an evil cult.

 

[Mik]

Thank you John T and Leatherneck301 for putting the truth out there about masonism (my word). The defenders of masonism on this forum continue to prove me right when I wrote:
'It amazing to read such a defense of freemasonry at the expense of brothers in Christ. Makes one wonder if freemasonry isn't an idol to some.'

 

[John t]

Thank you John T and Leatherneck301 for putting the truth out there about masonism (my word). The defenders of masonism on this forum continue to prove me right when I wrote:
'It amazing to read such a defense of freemasonry at the expense of brothers in Christ. Makes one wonder if freemasonry isn't an idol to some.'

First of all, due to the "Twaddle" I see in their posts nothing that exalts Jesus Christ. By definition, since they either refuse to, or incapable of exalting Jesus Christ solely, I do not consider them to be "brothers in Christ" For sure, they are brothers in shared humanity, but the second "brotherhood" does not beget the first, and most important.

If as you correctly observed, their defense is indeed an idol, the fact that it is an idol, and the fact that they disparage Bible believing Christians, it is impossible by definition to uphold any sort of "brother-like relationship with them". They post meaningless words, and are by nature, empty seplechurs.

 

[Leatherneck0311]

OH! Now you claim the ability to know what GOD HAS TOLD ME!
Really, when and where did your holiness receive this magnificent ability to listen in on GOD's speaking to His followers?
Does it work all the time or only with regards to Freemasons?
Did you get shown all the kingdoms of the world at that time too?

Speaking seriously, do you realize how insanely arrogant and heretical that sounds?

Especially since you are claiming God told me to follow the words of bearers of false witness and teachers of false doctrine AGAINST what He teaches in His Word.

Nope, God told you not to follow false teachers which you ignored , and that is why you joined the Freemasons.

 

[John t]

kamaeq said:
OH! Now you claim the ability to know what GOD HAS TOLD ME!

Wrong, again!

God NEVER contradicts Himself, and what He placed in the Bible is universally true for all of humankind. not just a FEW FREEMASONS. That is why your post is nothing more than Twaddle. And please be aware of this that your denigrating what God established in His Bible, you are essentially calling Him a liar.

Really, when and where did your holiness receive this magnificent ability to listen in on GOD's speaking to His followers?

Pardon, but your sanctimonious and irrelevant arrogance is showing. Since where and when did you get the chutzpah to criticize what God has plainly written?

Quite frankly, hearing claims from one person, who either got his degrees in one or two days in a side group of Freemasonry that at best represents perhaps 5% of Masons as members doesn't make either of you anywhere near a subject matter expert to make such broad claims. Especially since the big claim of "XX DEGREE MASON!!!!" holds little water. A mere "3d degree Mason" can shut down the Scottish Rite if he is acting as a Grand Master in his Grand Jurisdiction with a word. So you got anything more than your unnamed neighbor who supposedly told you some things you haven't verified as true in any objective sense here to support your claim?

Yep! an ad hominum (or two) is the last refuge for someone who has nothing to make a positive statement, so he throws scrapings from the barn floor into the fan hoping that something will stick on the wall.

Thank you for revealing your true character, especially as it is used to "defend" Freemasonry. Just to be sure, here is the definition:

ad hominem

ADJECTIVE

1. (of an argument or reaction) directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining.
   
   Yeah, that sort of crap really makes me want to join your cult.
   
   
   

 

[John t]

kamaeq said:
OH! Now you claim the ability to know what GOD HAS TOLD ME!

Wrong, again!

God NEVER contradicts Himself, and what He placed in the Bible is universally true for all of humankind. not just a FEW FREEMASONS. That is why your post is nothing more than Twaddle. And please be aware of this that your denigrating what God established in His Bible, you are essentially calling Him a liar.

Really, when and where did your holiness receive this magnificent ability to listen in on GOD's speaking to His followers?

Pardon, but your sanctimonious and irrelevant arrogance is showing. Since where and when did you get the chutzpah to criticize what God has plainly written?

Quite frankly, hearing claims from one person, who either got his degrees in one or two days in a side group of Freemasonry that at best represents perhaps 5% of Masons as members doesn't make either of you anywhere near a subject matter expert to make such broad claims. Especially since the big claim of "XX DEGREE MASON!!!!" holds little water. A mere "3d degree Mason" can shut down the Scottish Rite if he is acting as a Grand Master in his Grand Jurisdiction with a word. So you got anything more than your unnamed neighbor who supposedly told you some things you haven't verified as true in any objective sense here to support your claim?

Yep! an ad hominum (or two) is the last refuge for someone who has nothing to make a positive statement, so he throws scrapings from the barn floor into the fan hoping that something will stick on the wall.

Thank you for revealing your true character, especially as it is used to "defend" Freemasonry. Just to be sure, here is the definition:

ad hominem

ADJECTIVE

1. (of an argument or reaction) directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining.
   Yeah, that sort of crap really makes me want to join your cult.
   
   
   
   
   
   
   

 

[kiwimacnz]

Until you Freemasons can produce FROM MASONIC SOURCES something that says words to the effect that, Jesus Christ is King of Kings, Lord of Lords and God incarnate, who came in the flesh then it is YOUR CULT which is the producer of twaddle.

What you men fail to understand is that your work-around of GATOU is simply a name of an ungodly idol, having no interest in the salvation of humanity. You may be clever with words in order to obfuscate the ungodly truth of Freemasonry, but it is those words, and your attempts to lessen both the full humanity of Jesus Christ and his 100% being co-equal with the Father that shall be your undoing.

I am not a mason. My father, however, was one and a person less likely to be in a cult would be hard to imagine,

 

[Mik]

I am not a mason. My father, however, was one and a person less likely to be in a cult would be hard to imagine,

They are always the last to know/acknowledge they are.

 

[John t]

I am not a mason. My father, however, was one and a person less likely to be in a cult would be hard to imagine,

Then why do you make a post that seemingly defends Freemasonry???

My father was a Shriner, and he regularly took the family to the Consistory. But I never really wanted to have anything to do with the Masonic organizations.

 

[John t]

Deleted by poster

 

[kiwimacnz]

Then why do you make a post that seemingly defends Freemasonry???

My father was a Shriner, and he regularly took the family to the Consistory. But I never really wanted to have anything to do with the Masonic organizations.

Because what you are posting is twaddle. It is the idea that a group exists for only one purpose and that the purpose is as dark as possible. Humans are far more complicated than that.

 

[Leatherneck0311]

Because what you are posting is twaddle. It is the idea that a group exists for only one purpose and that the purpose is as dark as possible. Humans are far more complicated than that.

Freemasons teach many things that are contrary to scripture. I guess it just depends on who or what your first love is.

 

[John t]

Because what you are posting is twaddle. It is the idea that a group exists for only one purpose and that the purpose is as dark as possible. Humans are far more complicated than that.

Let's be clear about several things.

1. What I post, especially about the errors of cult of Freemasonry has its roots in the Bible, therefore it is true.
2. But I doubt that you will bother to say/do anything about that claim because you have already denigrated the things that God wrote in the Bible.
3. Jesus said that it is impossible to serve two masters, and GATOU is simply another name for a Freemason demon.
4. The purpose of the church is to glorify Jesus Christ, bringing people into a saving knowledge of Him. alone
5. There is no other way to enter heaven except through the unmerited grace of Jesus Christ, God incarnate.
6. GATOU is in open hostility to glorifying and worshipping Jesus Christ.
7. It is a Rosicrucian conception of God, as expressed by Max Heindel, manifestly, NOT a Christian
8. By definition, if you do not worship Jesus Christ alone, you are worshiping demons.

Therefore, also by definition, it is you, not me who is posting twaddle.

I am recovering from Strokes so please forgive if my spelling is 'rough'; my hands are still not working well.

I am very sorry to see that in your sig line. I am dealing with a permanent, service-connected disability, and my wife is in a skilled nursing facility sue to 3 strokes, and more.

 

[John t]

DANG IT!!

Problems with posting

 

[John t]

@kiwimacnz

Therefore, also by definition, it is you, not me who is posting twaddle.

Yep! truth triumphs twaddle!

 

[kamaeq]

Wrong, again!

Since I was replying to: "Freemasonry is built on lies and deceit and at some point the Holy Spirit informed you of that and you ignored it."
I'm absolutely correct and you are confessing by projecting in your claim above. That is the poster claiming that he KNOWS what God has told me.

God NEVER contradicts Himself, and what He placed in the Bible is universally true for all of humankind. not just a FEW FREEMASONS. That is why your post is nothing more than Twaddle. And please be aware of this that your denigrating what God established in His Bible, you are essentially calling Him a liar.

I know He doesn't, which is why antimasons who claim to be Christian refuse to discuss their faux "Biblical" proofs on these threads, because I'm defending Christianity against the cult of antimasonry, not Freemasonry against the Bible. Because, you mixed in some Truth in your post amidst the other stuff, God doesn't not contradict Himself and the Bible is universally true for all of mankind. What that has to do with Freemasonry, I have no clue.
Care to show how I "denigrate what God established in His Bible"? With Scripture references of course. I've made antimasons who claim to be Christian flee before usinjg His Word and I'll be happy to conduct yet another Bible lesson.

Pardon, but your sanctimonious and irrelevant arrogance is showing. Since where and when did you get the chutzpah to criticize what God has plainly written?

Sorry, I've invited you to discuss what God has written and you have fled before. Do you care to try again?
Please, try (Yet Again!) yourself to show what God has plainly written.
I will note that antimasons who claim to be Christian sometimes correctly cite Scripture, but then bear false witness in their claims about Freemasonry, but quite often they either (mis)interpret Scripture in a personal way or make outright false claims about what the Bible teaches.
Please, go ahead, enlighten us.

Especially since you are defending someone making a claim that is heretical according to the Bible. Specifically that this poster KNOWS what GOD SAID TO ME.

Yep! an ad hominum (or two) is the last refuge for someone who has nothing to make a positive statement, so he throws scrapings from the barn floor into the fan hoping that something will stick on the wall.

What was the ad hominem in use?
You often claim this (and various other "fallacies") to avoid actually answering the questions or defend your position without every making the step to showing how the statement is an actual fallacy. Yes, I have multiple saved instances of this behavior in posts by you, just like this one will be saved.

Thank you for revealing your true character, especially as it is used to "defend" Freemasonry. Just to be sure, here is the definition:

ad hominem

ADJECTIVE

1. (of an argument or reaction) directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining.
   Yeah, that sort of crap really makes me want to join your cult.
   
   
   
   
   
   

Well, since you didn't show anything besides your mere assertion of a fallacy, this is all babbling and attempting guilt by (false) accusation.

"Contrary to popular belief, merely insulting someone is not a fallacious ad hominem. A character attack is only considered a fallacious ad hominem if it is used in exchange for a genuine argument."

You know, like constantly making false claims of logical fallacies without being able to actually show they are fallacies and being too ignorant to realize there are valid uses. Like when a person's character, words or actions show they are in error. You know, like claiming they know what God says to other people outside of what is recorded in the Bible.

Or when someone makes a statement like: "Yeah, that sort of crap really makes me want to join your cult."
When it has been repeatedly proven that the person making that statement holds beliefs in line with the CARM list of cult traits and what they are calling a "cult" does NOT fit that same list of cult traits. IF someone is such a thin-skinned snowflake to take "offense" at that and run away whining, then they are confessing by projecting.

Now to expand my archives of saved posts, because I know the weather will be coming.

 

[Leatherneck0311]

Since I was replying to: "Freemasonry is built on lies and deceit and at some point the Holy Spirit informed you of that and you ignored it."
I'm absolutely correct and you are confessing by projecting in your claim above. That is the poster claiming that he KNOWS what God has told me.


I know He doesn't, which is why antimasons who claim to be Christian refuse to discuss their faux "Biblical" proofs on these threads, because I'm defending Christianity against the cult of antimasonry, not Freemasonry against the Bible. Because, you mixed in some Truth in your post amidst the other stuff, God doesn't not contradict Himself and the Bible is universally true for all of mankind. What that has to do with Freemasonry, I have no clue.
Care to show how I "denigrate what God established in His Bible"? With Scripture references of course. I've made antimasons who claim to be Christian flee before usinjg His Word and I'll be happy to conduct yet another Bible lesson.

Sorry, I've invited you to discuss what God has written and you have fled before. Do you care to try again?
Please, try (Yet Again!) yourself to show what God has plainly written.
I will note that antimasons who claim to be Christian sometimes correctly cite Scripture, but then bear false witness in their claims about Freemasonry, but quite often they either (mis)interpret Scripture in a personal way or make outright false claims about what the Bible teaches.
Please, go ahead, enlighten us.

Especially since you are defending someone making a claim that is heretical according to the Bible. Specifically that this poster KNOWS what GOD SAID TO ME.



What was the ad hominem in use?
You often claim this (and various other "fallacies") to avoid actually answering the questions or defend your position without every making the step to showing how the statement is an actual fallacy. Yes, I have multiple saved instances of this behavior in posts by you, just like this one will be saved.

Well, since you didn't show anything besides your mere assertion of a fallacy, this is all babbling and attempting guilt by (false) accusation.

"Contrary to popular belief, merely insulting someone is not a fallacious ad hominem. A character attack is only considered a fallacious ad hominem if it is used in exchange for a genuine argument."

You know, like constantly making false claims of logical fallacies without being able to actually show they are fallacies and being too ignorant to realize there are valid uses. Like when a person's character, words or actions show they are in error. You know, like claiming they know what God says to other people outside of what is recorded in the Bible.

Or when someone makes a statement like: "Yeah, that sort of crap really makes me want to join your cult."
When it has been repeatedly proven that the person making that statement holds beliefs in line with the CARM list of cult traits and what they are calling a "cult" does NOT fit that same list of cult traits. IF someone is such a thin-skinned snowflake to take "offense" at that and run away whining, then they are confessing by projecting.

Now to expand my archives of saved posts, because I know the weather will be coming.

Surely you joke. Thin skinned ? It is not those that try to get you out of the purely evil cult of freemasonry that are thin skinned it is you that has tossed the word of God, taken out of context scriptures that expose your cult, and absolutely refuse to see the truth that you are in an evil cult based on scripture.

 

[kamaeq]

hen a Christian takes the oath of Freemasonry, he is swearing to the following doctrines that God has pronounced false and sinful:

1. That salvation can be gained by man’s good works.

False.

2. That Jesus is just one of many equally revered prophets.

False.

3. That they will remain silent in the Lodge and not talk of Christ.

Why yes, all discussion of religion (and politics) are not allowed during the business meeting of a Lodge. There are many secular and some business related religious venues where this is true.

4. That they are approaching the Lodge in spiritual darkness and ignorance, when the Bible says Christians are already in the light, children of the light, and are indwelt by the Light of the World—Jesus Christ.

False, the darkness is intellectual and philosophical, not religious. Freemasonry leaves everything past belief in a Creator to the individual Mason since Freemasonry is not a religion, nor is it a substitute for religion.

5. By demanding that Christians take the Masonic oath, Masonry leads Christians into blasphemy and taking the name of the Lord in vain.

How? Unless you are denying the taking of oaths by Christians, which is a false teaching. Christians are enjoined against making frivolous oaths, not all oaths, and are given the goal of being so trustworthy that their simple statements can be taken as if sworn under oath.

6. Masonry teaches that its G.A.O.T.U. [Great Architect of the Universe], whom Masonry believes is the true God of the universe, is representative of all gods in all religions.

Yes, Freemasonry teaches that the creation has a Creator. This is a Biblical position. See Psalms 19:1-6 and Romans 1:20.
As your line shows, it is a title, not a name of any deity. As for representative, which major religion do you know of that does not teach that their deity created? Christianity teaches that since it is a Biblical position.

7. Masonry makes Christians take a universalist approach in their prayers, demanding a “generic” name be used so as not to offend non-believers who are Masonic “brothers”.

Common among prayers given in secular settings. I've been prayed over by clergy of different religions, in secular settings and rarely in more private ones.

8. By swearing the Masonic oath and participating in the doctrines of the Lodge, Christians are perpetuating a false gospel to other Lodge members, who look only to Masonry’s plan of salvation to get to heaven. By their very membership in such a syncretistic type organization, they have severely compromised their witnessing as Christians.

Totally false. Also a duplicate point, probably trying to repeat the falsehoods in line with standard propaganda practices.

9. By taking the Masonic obligation, the Christian is agreeing to allow the pollution of his mind, spirit, and body by those who serve false gods and believe false doctrines.

Totally false. Especially since Freemasonry teaches that if you feel that membership in Freemasonry interferes with any of your duties or obligations towards the deity you worship, then you should leave Freemasonry.

As you can see, Masonry denies and contradicts the clear teaching of Scripture on numerous issues. Masonry also requires people to engage in activities which the Bible condemns. As a result, a Christian should not be a member of any secret society or organization that has any connection with Freemasonry.

Well, I see a lot of bearing of false witness in this little list of yours and a lot of argument by outrage (see 3, 5-7 where common practices are phrased to be "sinister"). Nothing actually quoted from Scripture as a proof. Heck, I even gave that much in my reply to point 6 because it was relevant.

Again, for more information, we strongly recommend Ex-Masons for Jesus. https://www.gotquestions.org/free-masonry.html

I thought that this was a bit polished from your previous posts. I'd have to see if I've actually shown if I've already covered the "gotquestions" stuff, but really... EMFJ? I've got at least half of their documents as of a few years ago debunked. They are not Christian and not Biblical in their teachings. EMFJ are one of the major reasons I ended up discovering the cult traits of antimasonry that claims to be Christian.
We used to have some of the EMFJ types on CARM, they ran away because they couldn't deal with the Bible. As in actually studying and defending Christianity with it. They required their own special (mis)interpretations of the Bible and speaking false witness against those they chose to attack.