God Hates Perfectly just as He Loves perfectly !

Theo1689

Well-known member
context is your friend, when it says not all have faith, it refers to saving faith, but all have been given faith to know God exists

<sigh>

For the 1,748,382nd time, knowing God exists is NOT a matter of "faith", it is a matter of KNOWLEDGE.

You are the SOLE person in 2000 years of Christianity to proclaim this ridiculous idea.
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
your post betrays a lack of knowledge of the stance of the church over the centuries.

Okay, how many university/seminary courses have you taken in "Church history"?
I've taken one online course, based on the two-volume "The Story of Christianity" by Justo Gonzalez. I've also read many of the ECF's independently.

So I'm curious as to what is the your background that gives us reason to trust your opinions?

Calvinism is a splinter group with its own particular slant on the Bible which the majority of Christianity have never embraced.

Well, let's see....
There are many significant themes in Augustine's writings (especially his later writings) which match modern Calvinism. That's one of the reasons why both Calvin and Luther (who were both Augustinians), came away from this teaching.

We see ideas similar to Calvinism in the Jansenist movement, as well as the writings of Thomas Aquinas.

We also see a number of ECF's teaching Limited Atonement in their writings.

And the "explosion" of Christianity, the time of the Reformation, coincided with the invention of Gutenberg's printing press, and once the Bible came readily available to the common people in their own language (English, German, French, etc.), and they were able to read the Bible for themselves, instead of having to trust what Rome told them, they ended up discovering that it taught what is nicknamed, "Calvinism" (which is precisely what happened to me 30 years ago, as well).

It does not mean that calvinism is wrong, but to puff yourself up thinking you are in the majority on these things is contray to the truth.

The poster gave no indication of being "puffed up", nor did he claim "the majority" (which is a logical fallacy).

You are supporting a minority view.

"Many are called, FEW are chosen".
"NARROW is the gate, and FEW there be who find it."

Frankly, I don't see the problem.... ;)

You may be right,

We are.

but you are not in the majority

Fortunately for others, Arminians will also be saved. You don't have to score 100% a theology exam in order to be saved.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
<sigh>

For the 1,748,382nd time, knowing God exists is NOT a matter of "faith", it is a matter of KNOWLEDGE.

You are the SOLE person in 2000 years of Christianity to proclaim this ridiculous idea.
Since hebrews claims that it is by faith we know God created the world, there is at least one other person Paul, who agrees that by faith we know these things
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
Since hebrews claims that it is by faith we know God created the world, there is at least one other person Paul, who agrees that by faith we know these things

No, that's not what Hebrews says.
And no Bible scholar in 2000 years has ever held the position you hold.
So what makes your knowledge of the Bible so superior to theirs?
 

civic

Well-known member
Since hebrews claims that it is by faith we know God created the world, there is at least one other person Paul, who agrees that by faith we know these things
Of course believers know that is true but not so with unbelievers. Hebrews 11 is about believers is WE. Read it for yourself and quit adding to scripture your ideas which are ABSENT from scripture.

Hebrews 11
Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. 2 This is what the ancients were commended for.

3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Of course believers know that is true but not so with unbelievers. Hebrews 11 is about believers is WE. Read it for yourself and quit adding to scripture your ideas which are ABSENT from scripture.

Hebrews 11
Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. 2 This is what the ancients were commended for.

3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.
yes, those verses prove it is by faith we know those things
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
No, that's not what Hebrews says.
And no Bible scholar in 2000 years has ever held the position you hold.
So what makes your knowledge of the Bible so superior to theirs?
I stand on the shoulders of great Bible scholars, who like all of us "know in part" If I learn from them, then God can lead me further. I have never considered that the Bible is all figured out and all we have to do is memorize other people's explanations for our great test in the sky
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
so unbeliever's have faith anymore OXYMORONS for us today ?
Here is where you fail in understanding the Bible. Words can have a variety of uses in various contexts. You post as if you do not understand this concept. For you a word has one meaning, one use and no matter of its context it means the same thing.
Hebrews 11 uses the word faith in one way, that is not about salvation. Other passages use faith in the saving sense.
If you refuse to listen to context, you limit your ability to understand the Bible.
 

civic

Well-known member
Here is where you fail in understanding the Bible. Words can have a variety of uses in various contexts. You post as if you do not understand this concept. For you a word has one meaning, one use and no matter of its context it means the same thing.
Hebrews 11 uses the word faith in one way, that is not about salvation. Other passages use faith in the saving sense.
If you refuse to listen to context, you limit your ability to understand the Bible.
Wow so no one was saved exercising their faith in God from Hebrews 11- the faith chapter . Yikes
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Wow so no one was saved exercising their faith in God from Hebrews 11- the faith chapter . Yikes
Exactly, you have no concept of context. Within Hebrews 11, there is more than one context of usage of the word faith/believe.
Until you begin to consider context you will be stuck with the kind of post you just made. Sarcastic and demeaning
 

civic

Well-known member
Exactly, you have no concept of context. Within Hebrews 11, there is more than one context of usage of the word faith/believe.
Until you begin to consider context you will be stuck with the kind of post you just made. Sarcastic and demeaning
Prove that faith is different in Hebrews 11 from one passage to another. The burden of proof is on you not me. It’s your assumption that needs substantiating not mine.

Everyone can tell you have never taken a class in debate regardless of what you might claim to the contrary.

hope this helps !!!
 

Theo1689

Well-known member
I stand on the shoulders of great Bible scholars,

Empty false claims.

Okay, please quote TEN "great Bible scholars" who assert that our knowledge of the EXISTENCE of God comes by "faith".

You may begin.

And when you cannot do it, I will accept your apology.

I have never considered that the Bible is all figured out and all we have to do is memorize other people's explanations for our great test in the sky

Yet you are SO sure that you are correct and that everyone who disagrees with you MUST be wrong, and "must not understand".

Yeah, got it.
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Empty false claims.

Okay, please quote TEN "great Bible scholars" who assert that our knowledge of the EXISTENCE of God comes by "faith".

You may begin.

And when you cannot do it, I will accept your apology.



Yet you are So unerstadO sure that you are correct and that everyone who disagrees with you MUST be wrong, and "must not understand".

Yeah, got it.
read my post for understanding, then respond according to what I actually said
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Prove that faith is different in Hebrews 11 from one passage to another. The burden of proof is on you not me. It’s your assumption that needs substantiating not mine.

Everyone can tell you have never taken a class in debate regardless of what you might claim to the contrary.

hope this helps !!!
I have shown you many times, how faith has different meanings, yet every time it comes up you pretend not to have read a word I said to you.
On the other hand, you bring up posts i wrote years ago.
 
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