Grace in Action

rhomphaeam

Super Member
"Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the grace that was to be yours searched and inquired carefully, inquiring what person or time the Spirit of Christ in them was indicating when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the subsequent glories. It was revealed to them that they were serving not themselves but you, in the things that have now been announced to you through those who preached the good news to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven, things into which angels long to look." 1 Peter 1:11-12

Utterly wonderful. Amen
 
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guest1

Guest
But it is, as the Scripture says so plainly.

Cool! Then they know and believe as I do that salvation has always been by grace, and always had faith in the protoevangelium. In other words, they knew God would save them through Messiah, but they didn't know it as clearly as we do today.

Here is some Scripture you don't believe. Sound familiar?

"Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the grace that was to be yours searched and inquired carefully, inquiring what person or time the Spirit of Christ in them was indicating when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the subsequent glories. It was revealed to them that they were serving not themselves but you, in the things that have now been announced to you through those who preached the good news to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven, things into which angels long to look." 1 Peter 1:11-12

Now, if you're asking me to explain this and tell you how they knew all this, then guess what? I can't and it doesn't matter that I cannot. However, I do believe it.

That isn't the beginning of the Gospel. It began before eternity. Note Revelation 14:6; Titus 1:2 &c.

You are attempting, like a hyper-dispy to make this Gospel brand new at a point in history, only in order to support your dispy error.


Too late, already did. Of course they didn't understand.

Just because they didn't understand doesn't make it any less true. These things are revealed by the Spirit of God to the regenerate; 1 Corinthians 2:14, and that is the teaching in Luke 24 where He opened their eyes, it is an illustration of this truth. You act as if everyone in the OT should have seen and known this, but God doesn't reveal His truth to everyone.

In fact, Jesus rebuked Nicodemus for not knowing this, John 3:10. In other words, he should have been able to deduce this from OT Scripture by Spirit illumination.

What mystery age? You're making things up. LOL!!! He spoke directly about the age we are in now. Obviously you don't know your Scripture very well at all.


Blather.


More smug slander. You know slander is against Scripture, correct?
You end up with piece meal theology like jds when you cherry pick verses removed from the overall context of both testaments. He is living proof of that.
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
You end up with piece meal theology like jds when you cherry pick verses removed from the overall context of both testaments. He is living proof of that.
It looks to me as if he is saying since we don't believe his take on Scripture then we're lost, which shows he rejects Solus Christus and has added an element to the gospel.

I have an old friend who is an IFB from back when I was among them. He told me a certain sect of SDA's must be saved too (even though they hold to EGW) because they're pre-trib. He was so excited for them, and I could not understand his excitement. He too diverted away from Solus Christus as well.

I answered it isn't our eschatology that saves us, but our Gospel, our Christology, Christ that saves us, and asked what their "gospel" teaches.
 

JDS

Well-known member
But it is, as the Scripture says so plainly.

Cool! Then they know and believe as I do that salvation has always been by grace, and always had faith in the protoevangelium. In other words, they knew God would save them through Messiah, but they didn't know it as clearly as we do today.

Here is some Scripture you don't believe. Sound familiar?

"Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the grace that was to be yours searched and inquired carefully, inquiring what person or time the Spirit of Christ in them was indicating when he predicted the sufferings of Christ and the subsequent glories. It was revealed to them that they were serving not themselves but you, in the things that have now been announced to you through those who preached the good news to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven, things into which angels long to look." 1 Peter 1:11-12

Now, if you're asking me to explain this and tell you how they knew all this, then guess what? I can't and it doesn't matter that I cannot. However, I do believe it.

That isn't the beginning of the Gospel. It began before eternity. Note Revelation 14:6; Titus 1:2 &c.

You are attempting, like a hyper-dispy to make this Gospel brand new at a point in history, only in order to support your dispy error.


Too late, already did. Of course they didn't understand.

Just because they didn't understand doesn't make it any less true. These things are revealed by the Spirit of God to the regenerate; 1 Corinthians 2:14, and that is the teaching in Luke 24 where He opened their eyes, it is an illustration of this truth. You act as if everyone in the OT should have seen and known this, but God doesn't reveal His truth to everyone.

In fact, Jesus rebuked Nicodemus for not knowing this, John 3:10. In other words, he should have been able to deduce this from OT Scripture by Spirit illumination.

What mystery age? You're making things up. LOL!!! He spoke directly about the age we are in now. Obviously you don't know your Scripture very well at all.


Blather.


More smug slander. You know slander is against Scripture, correct?
So far you have commented on everything except the scriptures that I have asked you about. You have already forgotten about them but I have not. They are the words of the writers of the 4 gospels of Jesus Christ. Do you believe them when they say none of them understood anything about the death of Jesus Christ after 3.5 years of preaching to Judah about the kingdom is at hand? They did not believe the good news that Jesus had risen from the dead. That is what the words of each of these writers say.

Now you are finally saying you do not believe what Mark wrote in Mk 1:1-3. Thank you being honest, at least here. Please stop trying to change the subject.
 
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guest1

Guest
So far you have commented on everything except the scriptures that I have asked you about. You have already forgotten about them but I have not. They are the words of the writers of the 4 gospels of Jesus Christ. Do you believe them when they say none of them understood anything about the death of Jesus Christ after 3.5 years of preaching to Judah about the kingdom is at hand? They did not believe the good news that Jesus had risen from the dead. That is what the words of each of these writers say.

Now you are finally saying you do not believe what Mark wrote in Mk 1:1-3. Thank you being honest, at least here. Please stop trying to change the subject.
I have a suggestion since your comments are off topic with this thread. Start a new thread on the topic you want to discuss . And I did answer it with the context of John the Baptist as the forerunner and that being the beginning in its context. It’s not the beginning of the gospel since scripture calls it the Eternal gospel.

next ..................
 

JDS

Well-known member
You end up with piece meal theology like jds when you cherry pick verses removed from the overall context of both testaments. He is living proof of that.
You have not proven a single time I have taken scripture out of context. You haven’t even tried, civic. Neither has anyone else. You have not even addressed the subject matter contextually. This is dishonest of you to sway the readers to believe something that is not true.

You are talking about me and not the scriptures.

I am delivering some tremendous blows against some false doctrine. This is an opportunity for you to reassess some things that I have shown are suspect. I am interested in helping Calvinists see the light. Believe the words.
 

JDS

Well-known member
I have a suggestion since your comments are off topic with this thread. Start a new thread on the topic you want to discuss . And I did answer it with the context of John the Baptist as the forerunner and that being the beginning in its context. It’s not the beginning of the gospel since scripture calls it the Eternal gospel.

next ..................
This is a fair request and I will do it later.
 

rhomphaeam

Super Member
You have not proven a single time I have taken scripture out of context. You haven’t even tried, civic. Neither has anyone else. You have not even addressed the subject matter contextually. This is dishonest of you to sway the readers to believe something that is not true.

Nonsense. Read and stop blocking to appease your sense of spiritual knowledge. Utter nonsense.
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
So far you have commented on everything except the scriptures that I have asked you about. You have already forgotten about them but I have not. They are the words of the writers of the 4 gospels of Jesus Christ. Do you believe them when they say none of them understood anything about the death of Jesus Christ after 3.5 years of preaching to Judah about the kingdom is at hand?
Already answered concisely, plainly. Why do you act like I've never answered? The above is bearing false witness.
They did not believe the good news that Jesus had risen from the dead. That is what the words of each of these writers say.
Already answered.
Now you are finally saying you do not believe what Mark wrote in Mk 1:1-3.
That is blatantly false.
Thank you being honest, at least here. Please stop trying to change the subject.
Putting words in my mouth that aren't true doesn't mean I was being honest, it means you are dishonest.
 

rhomphaeam

Super Member
Already answered concisely, plainly. Why do you act like I've never answered? The above is bearing false witness.

Already answered.

That is blatantly false.

Putting words in my mouth that aren't true doesn't mean I was being honest, it means you are dishonest.

It's the same for everyone who says they have come to teach Calvin a lesson. They don't have the 10th of his intelligence and less than a peck of his zeal for Christ. Those who make that their ambition say all Calvinists who engage with them are called liars by inference or else deceived by undoubted meaning and even in some instances their faith is called into question. And then these babblers post decontextualised Scriptures and make insensible claims if by any means they can say that they won an argument. They block some to avoid having to say I refuse your meanings when they are given with a clear context to inference of misused Scriptures and cry like babies when they are rebuked. Breathtaking.
 

preacher4truth

Well-known member
It's the same for everyone who says they have come to teach Calvin a lesson. They don't have the 10th of his intelligence and less than a peck of his zeal for Christ. Those who make that their ambition say all Calvinists who engage with them are called liars by inference or else deceived by undoubted meaning and even in some instances their faith is called into question. And then these babblers post decontextualised Scriptures and make insensible claims if by any means they can say that they won an argument. They block some to avoid having to say I refuse your meanings when they are given with a clear context to inference of misused Scriptures and cry like babies when they are rebuked. Breathtaking.
Yep.

It is remarkable that the post I responded to was nothing but a fabrication.

I answered him, he knows I answered him, yet he posts to make it appear I've not.
 
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guest1

Guest
It's the same for everyone who says they have come to teach Calvin a lesson. They don't have the 10th of his intelligence and less than a peck of his zeal for Christ. Those who make that their ambition say all Calvinists who engage with them are called liars by inference or else deceived by undoubted meaning and even in some instances their faith is called into question. And then these babblers post decontextualised Scriptures and make insensible claims if by any means they can say that they won an argument. They block some to avoid having to say I refuse your meanings when they are given with a clear context to inference of misused Scriptures and cry like babies when they are rebuked. Breathtaking.
Yes I'm even seeing this is the most basic of things like the gospel, spiritual, natural, dead, alive etc.......... Scriptures that discuss these topics they change the meaning of the words to suit their doctrines. I just started a new thread today on the gospel because it is spiritual and cannot be understood apart from the spirit which is why the natural man rejects it as foolishness. But these guys refuse to accept this most basic truth. So they are wrong at a foundational level, at is most basic form. Its pretty scary for in it they deny the gospel is the dynamite(power) of God unto salvation bringing us from faith to faith as per Romans 1:16-17.
 

rhomphaeam

Super Member
Yes I'm even seeing this is the most basic of things like the gospel, spiritual, natural, dead, alive etc.......... Scriptures that discuss these topics they change the meaning of the words to suit their doctrines. I just started a new thread today on the gospel because it is spiritual and cannot be understood apart from the spirit which is why the natural man rejects it as foolishness. But these guys refuse to accept this most basic truth. So they are wrong at a foundational level, at is most basic form. Its pretty scary for in it they deny the gospel is the dynamite(power) of God unto salvation bringing us from faith to faith as per Romans 1:16-17.

Yes I have read it and loved it brother. I have also responded with a comment. That new post was a leading of the Holy Spirit. Amen.
 
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guest1

Guest
So far you have commented on everything except the scriptures that I have asked you about. You have already forgotten about them but I have not. They are the words of the writers of the 4 gospels of Jesus Christ. Do you believe them when they say none of them understood anything about the death of Jesus Christ after 3.5 years of preaching to Judah about the kingdom is at hand? They did not believe the good news that Jesus had risen from the dead. That is what the words of each of these writers say.

Now you are finally saying you do not believe what Mark wrote in Mk 1:1-3. Thank you being honest, at least here. Please stop trying to change the subject.
Expand your mind to accept the truth below regarding the gospel- its called the Eternal Gospel for a good reason.

The Gospel is the "good news" literally. There was lots of good news in the OT including the flood , the warnings and the opportunity to repent and escape.

(1) Regeneration, or the new heart, the heart of flesh, the writing of God's law in the heart (Jeremiah 31:33; Deuteronomy 30:6; Ezekiel 36:25-27).

(2) Reconciliation and remission of sins (Isaiah 1:18; Jeremiah 31:34; Leviticus 5:6, 10).

(3) Everlasting life and salvation in heaven (Psalm 17:15; Psalm 73:24; Psalm 16:11).

2. They had these blessings upon the same account, and in the same way, as we have them now. We receive all from the mere mercy and free grace of God in Christ; and so did they (Psalm 51:1; Daniel 9:8, 9, 18, 19).

II. A second argument might be taken from an historical induction of all those former times, and the several gospel discoveries which the Lord vouchsafed to them all along from time to time.

III. Either the gospel was preached unto them of old, or else it will follow that they were all condemned, or else that they were saved without Christ; which to imagine were infinitely dishonourable to the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 4:12; Romans 3:20; Galatians 2:16; Hebrews 13:8)biblehub

Hebrews 3:16-4:2
Who were they who heard and rebelled? Were they not all those Moses led out of Egypt? 17 And with whom was he angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies perished in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.

For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it.

Galatians 3:8
And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

Galatians 3:16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

John 8:56
Your father Abraham rejoiced that he would see My day. He saw it and was glad."

hope this helps !!!
 

JDS

Well-known member
Expand your mind to accept the truth below regarding the gospel- its called the Eternal Gospel for a good reason.

The Gospel is the "good news" literally. There was lots of good news in the OT including the flood , the warnings and the opportunity to repent and escape.

(1) Regeneration, or the new heart, the heart of flesh, the writing of God's law in the heart (Jeremiah 31:33; Deuteronomy 30:6; Ezekiel 36:25-27).

(2) Reconciliation and remission of sins (Isaiah 1:18; Jeremiah 31:34; Leviticus 5:6, 10).

(3) Everlasting life and salvation in heaven (Psalm 17:15; Psalm 73:24; Psalm 16:11).

2. They had these blessings upon the same account, and in the same way, as we have them now. We receive all from the mere mercy and free grace of God in Christ; and so did they (Psalm 51:1; Daniel 9:8, 9, 18, 19).

II. A second argument might be taken from an historical induction of all those former times, and the several gospel discoveries which the Lord vouchsafed to them all along from time to time.

III. Either the gospel was preached unto them of old, or else it will follow that they were all condemned, or else that they were saved without Christ; which to imagine were infinitely dishonourable to the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 4:12; Romans 3:20; Galatians 2:16; Hebrews 13:8)biblehub

Hebrews 3:16-4:2
Who were they who heard and rebelled? Were they not all those Moses led out of Egypt? 17 And with whom was he angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies perished in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief.

For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it.

Galatians 3:8
And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

Galatians 3:16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

John 8:56
Your father Abraham rejoiced that he would see My day. He saw it and was glad."

hope this helps !!!
There has not been a time in the OT when God sent out men to preach to other men that he has made a way for all men to be saved, and you have not quoted any, and you cannot quote any. There is no salvation without the shedding of blood. God sent out his people to kill some people in the OT, but he has never done that in the NT. Men are as unrighteous in the NT as they were in the OT times, but God is long suffering and is governing men under the operative principle of grace in this age. God has made provision to save every sinner in the world. There is no sin or combination of sins that are too great for him to forgive. There is also no sin or combination of sins that he is going to judge until this age of grace is over. Why is that? Because Jesus Christ died for the sins of the whole world. What would God be like if he said Jesus had been punished for sins in our place and then God would punish us anyways? No, a pardon has been wrought for all those who will receive it. God says in Hebrews 9:27 that it is appointed unto men once to die and after this the judgement. As long as a man lives he can come to God in repentance and faith and be forgiven in the name of Jesus Christ. If he dies it is too late.

2 Cor 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

I am telling you that your Calvinism is against the gospel of God and confuses the truth on many points. The end for the preachers of this religion is not going to be good. I am telling you this as a friend.
 
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guest1

Guest
There has not been a time in the OT when God sent out men to preach to other men that he has made a way for all men to be saved, and you have not quoted any, and you cannot quote any. There is no salvation without the shedding of blood. God sent out his people to kill some people in the OT, but he has never done that in the NT. Men are as unrighteous in the NT as they were in the OT times, but God is long suffering and is governing men under the operative principle of grace in this age. God has made provision to save every sinner in the world. There is no sin or combination of sins that are too great for him to forgive. There is also no sin or combination of sins that he is going to judge until this age of grace is over. Why is that? Because Jesus Christ died for the sins of the whole world. What would God be like if he said Jesus had been punished for sins in our place and then God would punish us anyways? No, a pardon has been wrought for all those who will receive it. God says in Hebrews 9:27 that it is appointed unto men once to die and after this the judgement. As long as a man lives he can come to God in repentance and faith and be forgiven in the name of Jesus Christ. If he dies it is too late.

2 Cor 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

I am telling you that your Calvinism is against the gospel of God and confuses the truth on many points. The end for the preachers of this religion is not going to be good. I am telling you this as a friend.
It’s not Calvinism , it’s the truth from Scripture.

Your calvie strawman doesn’t work with me.

Grace in the OP with numerous scriptures comes from God. The same with understanding the gospel it comes from God via the Holy Spirit.

Bible 101 here not Calvinism .


hope this helps !!!
 

JDS

Well-known member
It’s not Calvinism , it’s the truth from Scripture.

Your calvie strawman doesn’t work with me.

Grace in the OP with numerous scriptures comes from God. The same with understanding the gospel it comes from God via the Holy Spirit.

Bible 101 here not Calvinism .


hope this helps !!!
You believe in a very limited atonement. It is not true and it is not grace.
 
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guest1

Guest
You believe in a very limited atonement. It is not true and it is not grace.
The fact is salvation is of by and through the Lord. There is a fixed number of those who will be saved who are written in the Lambs book of life before the foundation of the world .

Newsflash- I don’t limit anything Jesus does and He said that He lays down His life for His sheep. He died for His bride, the church. Those written in the book of life from the beginning .

And I really don’t care one way or the other if you believe that ir not.

hope this helps !!!
 

JDS

Well-known member
The fact is salvation is of by and through the Lord. There is a fixed number of those who will be saved who are written in the Lambs book of life before the foundation of the world .

Newsflash- I don’t limit anything Jesus does and He said that He lays down His life for His sheep. He died for His bride, the church. Those written in the book of life from the beginning .

And I really don’t care one way or the other if you believe that ir not.

hope this helps !!!
Well, your "L' stands for limited. There should be a "V" in front of it. There are no names added to the book of life but there are names blotted out.
You say you don't limit anything Jesus does but he said God was propitiated by his sacrifice for the sins of the whole world. You say no.
 
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