Holy Spirit and voting

Oldsaint24

Active member
The Holy Spirit within me forbids me to vote for any pro choice individual. And I don't think the Holy Spirit has a double standard on the issue.

How 'bout others? What do you say?
 
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The Pixie

Active member
I am curious what the Holy Spirit's position was in 1970. The Southern Bapist Convention in 1970 made a resolution to legalise abortion - in some situations - as can be seen here. Did they get it wrong? Or has the Holy Spirit changed its mind?
 

Whateverman

Well-known member
The Holy Spirit within me forbids me to vote for any pro choice individual. And I don't think the Holy Spirit has a double standard on the issue.
Does the Holy Spirit have a double standard on voting for liars and adulterers?

It would seem that not voting for someone who's not committed a biblical sin (aka. having a political position on a controversial topic) should necessitate not voting for someone who sins unrepentantly (aka. repeatedly lying and repeatedly having sex with someone else other than your wife).
 

Oldsaint24

Active member
I am curious what the Holy Spirit's position was in 1970. The Southern Bapist Convention in 1970 made a resolution to legalise abortion - in some situations - as can be seen here. Did they get it wrong? Or has the Holy Spirit changed its mind?
The Holy Spirit's position on abortion has never changed. I am sure the Holy Spirit was not involved in the Baptist Convention in 1970, if such a decision was made. Sad that they did not know the Holy Spirit was not present or if was present they were not listening.
Murdering the innocent unborn is evil......in most cases it is..........child sacrifice.
 

Oldsaint24

Active member
Does the Holy Spirit have a double standard on voting for liars and adulterers?

It would seem that not voting for someone who's not committed a biblical sin (aka. having a political position on a controversial topic) should necessitate not voting for someone who sins unrepentantly (aka. repeatedly lying and repeatedly having sex with someone else other than your wife).
The double standard is concerning what the Holy Spirit tells me verses telling other children of God. And there is no double standard about how the Living God feels about sacrificing the innocent unborn....often for personal gain. Really no different than the heathen nations of the OT who sacrificed their children.
 

Whateverman

Well-known member
The double standard is concerning what the Holy Spirit tells me verses telling other children of God.
I'm sorry Oldsaint, but with all due respect, that's not what "double standard" means. The Holy Spirit can tell two different people to do two different things, and while that may represent inconsistency, that's not a double standard.

When it comes to what the bible says about lying, for example, lying is portrayed as bad / sinful; not lying is the standard. However, if it's only bad for some people to lie but not others, then that's a double standard.

If it's bad to vote for someone who advocates or commits sin (ie. legalizing abortion), then it should be bad to vote for any politician who does the same, regardless of the sin (ie. lying).
 

Oldsaint24

Active member
I'm sorry Oldsaint, but with all due respect, that's not what "double standard" means. The Holy Spirit can tell two different people to do two different things, and while that may represent inconsistency, that's not a double standard.

When it comes to what the bible says about lying, for example, lying is portrayed as bad / sinful; not lying is the standard. However, if it's only bad for some people to lie but not others, then that's a double standard.

If it's bad to vote for someone who advocates or commits sin (ie. legalizing abortion), then it should be bad to vote for any politician who does the same, regardless of the sin (ie. lying).
In the heart of God the killing of the innocent unborn is evil. He told me this. He told me that people who think killing the innocent unborn have a dark/hardened heart/mind and should not be given power or authority over people. God is not telling other children of God something to the contrary. That would be a double standard.
See, the problem here is...some of the other children of God are not listening to God but doing their own thing, making their own decisions.
 

Whateverman

Well-known member
In the heart of God the killing of the innocent unborn is evil. He told me this. He told me that people who think killing the innocent unborn have a dark/hardened heart/mind and should not be given power or authority over people. God is not telling other children of God something to the contrary. That would be a double standard.
See, the problem here is...some of the other children of God are not listening to God but doing their own thing, making their own decisions.
So, do you think God's fine with voting for a politician who's a repeated adulterer?

I assume no - but that means you can't really vote for someone who's pro-choice or someone who sleeps with nude models while his wife gives birth to his son. Instead, what I've found is that Christian voters frequently wont give a politician a pass on the abortion issue, but think nothing of voting for a politician who lies and sleeps around.

That - right there - is a double standard. There's no biblical support for the idea that abortion is worse than lying or infidelity, and yet, most Christians seem to feel this way...
 

Torin

Active member
The Holy Spirit within me forbids me to vote for any pro choice individual. And I don't think the Holy Spirit has a double standard on the issue.

How 'bout others? What do you say?
How would you distinguish "the Holy Spirit" from your feelings?
 

J regia

Well-known member
In the heart of God the killing of the innocent unborn is evil. He told me this. He told me that people who think killing the innocent unborn have a dark/hardened heart/mind and should not be given power or authority over people. God is not telling other children of God something to the contrary. That would be a double standard.
See, the problem here is...some of the other children of God are not listening to God but doing their own thing, making their own decisions.
Even though your god may have personally told you that in a face to face conversation, but did your god also tell you why the bible commands the termination of pregnancies of adulteresses (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28)?

And did your god also personally tell you why the bible commands genocide including the butchering of little children and the unborn (Deut 7:1-2) and as described in Joshua 6:21 8:26 10:37)?

And how many abortions has the White House liar paid for?
 
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Temujin

Well-known member
In the heart of God the killing of the innocent unborn is evil. He told me this. He told me that people who think killing the innocent unborn have a dark/hardened heart/mind and should not be given power or authority over people. God is not telling other children of God something to the contrary. That would be a double standard.
See, the problem here is...some of the other children of God are not listening to God but doing their own thing, making their own decisions.
No, the problem here is that some people think that God is talking to them personally, and that consequently their opinions are endorsed by God. This leads to over-weaning arrogance and a refusal to even consider other people's point of view.
 

The Pixie

Active member
The Holy Spirit's position on abortion has never changed. I am sure the Holy Spirit was not involved in the Baptist Convention in 1970, if such a decision was made. Sad that they did not know the Holy Spirit was not present or if was present they were not listening.
Murdering the innocent unborn is evil......in most cases it is..........child sacrifice.
Actually the Biblical position is that life starts when you take a breath, and ends when you breath your last.

Also worth noting that around two thirds of fertilised embryos die before reaching term though natural causes, i.e., God choosing to "murder" them.
 

Oldsaint24

Active member
Actually the Biblical position is that life starts when you take a breath, and ends when you breath your last.

Also worth noting that around two thirds of fertilised embryos die before reaching term though natural causes, i.e., God choosing to "murder" them.
Not so, there's penalty for accidentally killing the unborn. Revealing the value of human life, even pre birth.

You can't equate natural biological processes whether good or bad to God's moral law.

Question: Is the killing the innocent unborn via abortion an evil in the eyes of the Living God?
 

J regia

Well-known member
Not so, there's penalty for accidentally killing the unborn. Revealing the value of human life, even pre birth.

You can't equate natural biological processes whether good or bad to God's moral law.

Question: Is the killing the innocent unborn via abortion an evil in the eyes of the Living God?
It certainly wasn't an evil in the eyes of the biblical writers, given the commandments to terminate the pregnancies of adulteresses (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28) and to butcher all the children and unborn in genocide (Deut 7:1-2).

And the penalty for accidentally causing a miscarriage was simply a fine for property loss.
 

Oldsaint24

Active member
It certainly wasn't an evil in the eyes of the biblical writers, given the commandments to terminate the pregnancies of adulteresses (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28) and to butcher all the children and unborn in genocide (Deut 7:1-2).

And the penalty for accidentally causing a miscarriage was simply a fine for property loss.
Don't equate God's justice with killing the innocent unborn. Those text don't.
Question for you.....Is purposefully terminating the life of an unborn child evil in the sight of the Living God?
 

Oldsaint24

Active member
No, the problem here is that some people think that God is talking to them personally, and that consequently their opinions are endorsed by God. This leads to over-weaning arrogance and a refusal to even consider other people's point of view.
Is your "no" regarding whether killing the innocent unborn is an evil in the eyes of God?
 

Temujin

Well-known member
Is your "no" regarding whether killing the innocent unborn is an evil in the eyes of God?
It was a rejection of your view that "the problem here is...some of the other children of God are not listening to God but doing their own thing, making their own decisions."

But since you ask, firstly it is incoherent to call the unborn "innocent", since they are neither physically capable of being guilty of anything, nor are they mentally capable of grasping the concept.

Secondly, abortion is not a good thing, but there are circumstances when it is the least bad option. Taking the least bad option is never evil.

Thirdly "evil" is a grossly over used word. Someone who has an abortion may be desperate, troubled, feckless, threatened, or just careless. They are never evil. Those who prey upon them, exploit them or seek to harm them may be evil. I would include some of the despicable pro-life tactics targeting vulnerable women.

Finally there is no evidence whatsoever that God exists, or if he does, that he cares a fig for what humanity does. He certainly doesn't bother to intervene, do I say that it is completely pointless bringing God into a controversy that is already complicated enough.

I hope that makes things clear for you.
 

J regia

Well-known member
Don't equate God's justice with killing the innocent unborn. Those text don't.
Question for you.....Is purposefully terminating the life of an unborn child evil in the sight of the Living God?
It still doesn't change the commandments to terminate the pregnancies of adulteresses (Lev 20:10 Numbers 5:20-28) because of the property rights of men, and to butcher all the children and unborn (Deut 7). Nor does it change the penalty for accidentally causing a miscarriage being simply a monetary compensation for property loss.

And since I'm not a god or have even seen one and had a conversation with one, then I wouldn't know what was evil or not in the sight of a god.
 
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Oldsaint24

Active member
But since you ask, firstly it is incoherent to call the unborn "innocent", since they are neither physically capable of being guilty of anything, nor are they mentally capable of grasping the concept.

So what charge to you bring against the unborn that they are deserving of being put to death? The unborn being as you say, "physically capable of being guilty of anything, nor are they mentally capable of grasping the concept" is irrelevant.

You have an unborn human being why does it deserved to be put to death?
 
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