How do non-Catholics account for the miracles at Fatima?

balshan

Well-known member
Betcha that's why they have Peter as their first pope. Two short epistles - one of which was questioned - as opposed to Paul's dozen or so, with explicit instructions. 🤔
Oh let us be honest the RCC leaders ignore Peter as well

1 Peter

13 Therefore, with minds that are alert and fully sober, set your hope on the grace to be brought to you when Jesus Christ is revealed at his coming. 14 As obedient children, do not conform to the evil desires you had when you lived in ignorance. 15 But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16 for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”

17 Since you call on a Father who judges each person’s work impartially, live out your time as foreigners here in reverent fear. 18
For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your ancestors,

I mean there leaders are confirmed to evil desires, also they love those perishable things.

25 but the word of the Lord endures forever.”
And this is the word that was preached to you


They reject most of the word of the Lord.

Chapter 2

4 As you come to him, the living Stone—rejected by humans but chosen by God and precious to him

Peter sees Jesus as the living stone/rock

Chapter 4
3 For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable idolatry.

Their leaders live in debauchery etc. Their present pope blesses idols.

You can go through every chapter of Peter's writings and see how the RCC ignores him.
 

mica

Well-known member
Oh let us be honest the RCC leaders ignore Peter as well

1 Peter

13 Therefore, with minds that are alert and fully sober, set your hope on the grace to be brought to you when Jesus Christ is revealed at his coming. 14 As obedient children, do not conform to the evil desires you had when you lived in ignorance. 15 But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16 for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”

17 Since you call on a Father who judges each person’s work impartially, live out your time as foreigners here in reverent fear. 18
For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your ancestors,

I mean there leaders are confirmed to evil desires, also they love those perishable things.

25 but the word of the Lord endures forever.”
And this is the word that was preached to you


They reject most of the word of the Lord.

Chapter 2

4 As you come to him, the living Stone—rejected by humans but chosen by God and precious to him

Peter sees Jesus as the living stone/rock

Chapter 4
3 For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable idolatry.

Their leaders live in debauchery etc. Their present pope blesses idols.

You can go through every chapter of Peter's writings and see how the RCC ignores him.
They sure ignore his message to read what Paul wrote!
 

balshan

Well-known member
They sure ignore his message to read what Paul wrote!
You are right Peter does stress the importance of Paul. Yep I mean the way they speak about us, making up we are not Christlike and just for repeating what Paul teaches. I mean let us be honest, their institution doesn't like Paul's message, their institution ignores Peter and they only like about one sentence in James.

James 1:15,16

Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.
Don’t be deceived, my dear brothers and sisters.


Their institution prefers to be deceived.
 

RayneBeau

Well-known member
In my opinion, the better questions would be what did the alleged Fatima apparitions actually teach and how did these teachings compare/contrast with the message first delivered to the saints?
Don't the Marian apparitions always stress the Roman Catholic Church's great importance of the Eucharist? In particular, the "Queen of Heaven" has supposedly repeatedly stated that the Eucharist, once it is consecrated by a Roman Catholic priest, becomes the literal body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus Christ, and is therefore worthy of worship and adoration. In fact, Mary focuses much attention on the 'true presence' of Jesus in the Eucharist, especially in the so-called Marian apparitions to a Roman Catholic woman named Catherine Laboure, from Paris, France in 1830, in which Mary emphatically encourages all believers to receive the so-called 'Blessed Sacrament' as often as possible in order to receive the needed graces for salvation - a teaching that was NEVER delivered to the saints! Mary also stressed the important role that the Eucharistic Jesus will have in the last days - another false teaching NEVER delivered to the saints!
 
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pilgrim

Well-known member
Don't the Marian apparitions always stress the Roman Catholic Church's great importance of the Eucharist? In particular, the "Queen of Heaven" has supposedly repeatedly stated that the Eucharist, once it is consecrated by a Roman Catholic priest, becomes the literal body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus Christ, and is therefore worthy of worship and adoration. In fact, Mary focuses much attention on the 'true presence' of Jesus in the Eucharist, especially in the so-called Marian apparitions to a Roman Catholic woman named Catherine Laboure, from Paris, France in 1830, in which Mary emphatically encourages all believers to receive the so-called 'Blessed Sacrament' as often as possible in order to receive the needed graces for salvation - a teaching that was NEVER delivered to the saints! Mary also stressed the important role that the Eucharistic Jesus will have in the last days - another false teaching NEVER delivered to the saints!
The teaching on the Eucharist was given to us by Jesus Himself in John 6.
 

pilgrim

Well-known member
Reread my post not talking about physical change and never was. You answers shows your complete misunderstanding of the nature of God. But keep it up, you get proving your do not know Jesus or the scriptures. It is sad.
Posts 262-4 were in reference to the Eucharist. What "change" were you referring to, then?
 

pilgrim

Well-known member
Don't the Marian apparitions always stress the Roman Catholic Church's great importance of the Eucharist? In particular, the "Queen of Heaven" has supposedly repeatedly stated that the Eucharist, once it is consecrated by a Roman Catholic priest, becomes the literal body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus Christ, and is therefore worthy of worship and adoration. In fact, Mary focuses much attention on the 'true presence' of Jesus in the Eucharist, especially in the so-called Marian apparitions to a Roman Catholic woman named Catherine Laboure, from Paris, France in 1830, in which Mary emphatically encourages all believers to receive the so-called 'Blessed Sacrament' as often as possible in order to receive the needed graces for salvation - a teaching that was NEVER delivered to the saints! Mary also stressed the important role that the Eucharistic Jesus will have in the last days - another false teaching NEVER delivered to the saints!
Well, if these things should come to pass soon, I guess we'll find out if she (Mary) was right.
 

mica

Well-known member
RayneBeau said:
Don't the Marian apparitions always stress the Roman Catholic Church's great importance of the Eucharist? In particular, the "Queen of Heaven" has supposedly repeatedly stated that the Eucharist, once it is consecrated by a Roman Catholic priest, becomes the literal body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus Christ, and is therefore worthy of worship and adoration. In fact, Mary focuses much attention on the 'true presence' of Jesus in the Eucharist, especially in the so-called Marian apparitions to a Roman Catholic woman named Catherine Laboure, from Paris, France in 1830, in which Mary emphatically encourages all believers to receive the so-called 'Blessed Sacrament' as often as possible in order to receive the needed graces for salvation - a teaching that was NEVER delivered to the saints! Mary also stressed the important role that the Eucharistic Jesus will have in the last days - another false teaching NEVER delivered to the saints!
Well, if these things should come to pass soon, I guess we'll find out if she (Mary) was right.
catholics will probably claim the antichrist is their faux eucharistic jesus come to life again on earth.

I wouldn't trust made up words of a faux mary with my salvation.
 

balshan

Well-known member
Posts 262-4 were in reference to the Eucharist. What "change" were you referring to, then?
My point being God has never changed, He is constant in what He says. He commands as not to eat human flesh and not to drink blood. Therefore it means there is not real body and blood of Jesus at communion. It is symbolic only. God is constant in His laws.
 

RayneBeau

Well-known member
They ignore Paul's writings all the time. They ignore him on not eating with sexual sinners, they have communion with them. They ignore him on requirements for leaders. They ignore a lot of Paul's writings, so why would they take any notice of what he says about satan.

2 Thess 2:9

The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with how Satan works. He will use all sorts of displays of power through signs and wonders that serve the lie,

Real miracles focus on Jesus not on others.
Amen Balshan!
When looking at the worldwide messages given by the "Mother of the Eucharist" they show that the apparitions that claim to be Mary consistently directs followers to consecrate not on the person and divinity of Jesus Christ the Son of God, but rather on the term created by the Roman Catholic Church which describes perhaps a remote being dubbed as the "Real Presence" which is sustained in the Eucharist through the power given to the ordained priests of the Roman Catholic Church.
 

Bob Carabbio

Well-known member
If you're not Catholic, what do you think really happened in Fatima, Portugal in the early 1900s, when 3 shepherd children claimed to have been visited by the Virgin Mary? I'm sure many claims of miracles within the Catholic church are easy to disregard, but this seems less so because tens of thousands of people showed up to see what was called the Miracle of the Sun, where the sun broke from it's orbit and spun and danced over the large crowd. Importantly, many in this crowd were non-believers, even reporters who came out to ridicule the anticipated miracle.

The only real reply I've seen to this is that it was the devil, but this seems like a pretty convenient opinion. It's perhaps the biggest miracle of the modern era, so I'm surprised more Christians aren't engaging this.
It was a Demonic Phantasm, of course. I trust you're aware that satan IS NOT without power, and whomping up a phony "Blessed Virgin", and an impessive "light show". no big deal.
 

Bonnie

Super Member
The teaching on the Eucharist was given to us by Jesus Himself in John 6.
But He never said the bread and wine stop being bread and wine. We can taste, touch, and smell that they are still bread and wine. In fact, Jesus referred to what was in His cup as the "fruit of the vine." That is wine.
 

pilgrim

Well-known member
But He never said the bread and wine stop being bread and wine. We can taste, touch, and smell that they are still bread and wine. In fact, Jesus referred to what was in His cup as the "fruit of the vine." That is wine.
Yes He did. When he said "Take and eat; this is My Body."(Matthew 26:26) That is what the substance became at those words: His Body.
 

RayneBeau

Well-known member
That is true. Satan can manipulate nature. Look what he did with the whirlwind he sent that killed Job's children.
There is a multitude of Roman Catholics and others who buy in to these Marian apparitions which have no natural explanation. Do they foolishly believe that Mary has the power to suddenly orchestrate millions of complex circumstances necessary in order to accomplish what would constitute as a miracle? If RC's just looked at it logically from that perspective they should be able to see what folly Satan has concocted to draw people and their vain pursuits in to his web of deceit and mind control.
 
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