Sketo
Well-known member
Before I became reformed, or knew anything about it, I was going to Faith Independent Baptist Church (FIBC), while listening to John Piper at the same time. I was in discipleship at FIBC once a week and after a while I started noticing small differences in their theology.
As time went on the differences started to grow and I became confused, so I asked my pastor, at the time, if he knew of John Piper. He said he did and also said Piper believed in this thing called Calvinism. By the Grace of God I had never heard of this term for the two years I had been listening Piper, and was never taught to stay away from it.
I asked him what it was and he sat me down and wrote on a piece of paper T.U.L.I.P. Then he proceeded to go through each point describing his Arminian understanding of each. After he described them, I said to him “If anyone believes this crap then they are a fool and I’m done with them”! Then he said “John Piper believes this” and I was devastated.
At the time I loved Piper’s preaching, but then I was told he believes this... Calvinism. I thought “In my two years of listening to him I have never heard him talk about these things, but if he does teach this then I am done with him”.
I went home so confused! I thought I have grown so much form Pipers preaching and now I have to let him go. Then I thought I would at least give him a chance before I let him go, so I went to the DesiringGod website and typed in the search box... TULIP... and there it was... “What We Believe About Calvinism the Five Points of Calvinism”. I downloaded and printed out the 26 page doc and read it three times.
Needless to say I realized that what John Piper believed and what my pastor told me “he believed” were two completely different things. I brought the document to my pastor and said “what you say he believes and what he says he believes are not the same”!
At that time my pastor removed me from the discipleship program and told me “you are not allowed to speak to anyone in the church about this except for my deacon and I until you get this figured out”!
I had no clue it was that big of a deal! A week later I asked if I could return to the discipleship program and he asked “First what do you believe about Calvinism now?” I said the document still makes sense to me. Then he said “Then I can not allow you back into discipleship or teach or speak to anyone in the congregation!”. I asked what can I do then and he replied “you are welcome to sit in the pew like everyone else but you can not speak to anyone about this subject!”. I was devastated to say the least!
We went to church two more weeks and both weeks he preached against “his form of Calvinism” and I realized then that we were not welcome there anymore! He did not kick us out but he did make it extremely uncomfortable for me to “sit in the pew”!
I decided it was time to find another church and told my wife the situation and she did not know anything about the debate! She was broken that we had to leave! I prayed and struggled with the decision to leave! Finally it was clear that truth mattered more than feelings so the next Sunday I went to the pastor and I told him we have to leave. He said he knew it was coming to that! I said please before we leave take down your Bible and let’s talk about these things! Then I said “I can not help what I see in the Bible now! Keep in mind we have not spoke about it since I showed him the pdf. His response broke me... he said “I have given you all the time I am going to give you”! I said “then this will be our last time here”!
The final kicker...
He then asked if he, and his wife, could speak to my wife privately before we left “to say goodby” and I thought nothing of it and agreed...
We went home and my wife did not know what to say or do! I looked for some churches. Went and interviewed pastors. I spent three Sundays trying to decide if I done the right thing flip-flopping back and forth should we go back or not!
Then my wife told me what that pastor and his wife said to her....
He said and I quote “The Bible says you should follow your husband... but your husband is going to lead you and your kids straight to hell”!!!
What was my wife supposed to do with this? A preacher agains me!
My wife did not want to go to any church with me for 2 years because of what he said! It took a long time to get her to trust me again! Finally she understands the doctrines and realizes that I made the correct choice we are now in a Reformed Church and happy to be there!
I thank God that I was not taught “Calvinism” was a bad word before I understood it!
If you are interested... the document that drastically changed my life can be found here...
www.desiringgod.org
As time went on the differences started to grow and I became confused, so I asked my pastor, at the time, if he knew of John Piper. He said he did and also said Piper believed in this thing called Calvinism. By the Grace of God I had never heard of this term for the two years I had been listening Piper, and was never taught to stay away from it.
I asked him what it was and he sat me down and wrote on a piece of paper T.U.L.I.P. Then he proceeded to go through each point describing his Arminian understanding of each. After he described them, I said to him “If anyone believes this crap then they are a fool and I’m done with them”! Then he said “John Piper believes this” and I was devastated.
At the time I loved Piper’s preaching, but then I was told he believes this... Calvinism. I thought “In my two years of listening to him I have never heard him talk about these things, but if he does teach this then I am done with him”.
I went home so confused! I thought I have grown so much form Pipers preaching and now I have to let him go. Then I thought I would at least give him a chance before I let him go, so I went to the DesiringGod website and typed in the search box... TULIP... and there it was... “What We Believe About Calvinism the Five Points of Calvinism”. I downloaded and printed out the 26 page doc and read it three times.
Needless to say I realized that what John Piper believed and what my pastor told me “he believed” were two completely different things. I brought the document to my pastor and said “what you say he believes and what he says he believes are not the same”!
At that time my pastor removed me from the discipleship program and told me “you are not allowed to speak to anyone in the church about this except for my deacon and I until you get this figured out”!
I had no clue it was that big of a deal! A week later I asked if I could return to the discipleship program and he asked “First what do you believe about Calvinism now?” I said the document still makes sense to me. Then he said “Then I can not allow you back into discipleship or teach or speak to anyone in the congregation!”. I asked what can I do then and he replied “you are welcome to sit in the pew like everyone else but you can not speak to anyone about this subject!”. I was devastated to say the least!
We went to church two more weeks and both weeks he preached against “his form of Calvinism” and I realized then that we were not welcome there anymore! He did not kick us out but he did make it extremely uncomfortable for me to “sit in the pew”!
I decided it was time to find another church and told my wife the situation and she did not know anything about the debate! She was broken that we had to leave! I prayed and struggled with the decision to leave! Finally it was clear that truth mattered more than feelings so the next Sunday I went to the pastor and I told him we have to leave. He said he knew it was coming to that! I said please before we leave take down your Bible and let’s talk about these things! Then I said “I can not help what I see in the Bible now! Keep in mind we have not spoke about it since I showed him the pdf. His response broke me... he said “I have given you all the time I am going to give you”! I said “then this will be our last time here”!
The final kicker...
He then asked if he, and his wife, could speak to my wife privately before we left “to say goodby” and I thought nothing of it and agreed...
We went home and my wife did not know what to say or do! I looked for some churches. Went and interviewed pastors. I spent three Sundays trying to decide if I done the right thing flip-flopping back and forth should we go back or not!
Then my wife told me what that pastor and his wife said to her....
He said and I quote “The Bible says you should follow your husband... but your husband is going to lead you and your kids straight to hell”!!!
What was my wife supposed to do with this? A preacher agains me!
My wife did not want to go to any church with me for 2 years because of what he said! It took a long time to get her to trust me again! Finally she understands the doctrines and realizes that I made the correct choice we are now in a Reformed Church and happy to be there!
I thank God that I was not taught “Calvinism” was a bad word before I understood it!
If you are interested... the document that drastically changed my life can be found here...

What We Believe About the Five Points of Calvinism
To know God in his sovereignty is to become like an oak tree in the wind of adversity and confusion.
