How not to defend the Bible.

[Gary Mac]

They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us;

Yes those who went out from His ways accuse His ways of gnosticism.

But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and all of you know the truth.

That is what I keep telling you I have the Holy One as my own disposition, mind, Spirit. But because to be is gnosticism for you, you dont have a clue what that anointing is.

Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. 1 John 2:19-22

The one who is the liar are the ones who accuse His ways a gnosticism by flat out denying that the ways of Jesus is the Christ to have in you the same anointing..

 

[Trinitarian]

We all should be aware that many people are very critical of the Bible and don't believe much of what it says. Of course, as Christians we are commanded to be ready to defend what we believe. We read in 1 Peter 3:14-16 (New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition):

So regarding scripture we are to defend it with gentleness and respect. Sadly, Peter's advice often goes ignored. Many Christians won't even bother to defend the Bible. If they do defend it, they often treat skeptics with scorn as if they are fools or idiots.

I propose that Christians honor those who have made a good faith effort to read the Bible whether they agree with us or not about what it says or how credible it may be. Concede that many Bible passages are difficult to understand, and nobody needs to be ashamed if they have problems understanding those passages. After all, we Christians encourage unbelievers to read scripture, and we betray their trust in us if we insult their intelligence over disagreements or what conclusions they come to. If unbelievers do cite difficult passages, share with them the difficulty we all have with such passages. Don't try to take easy way outs by trying to explain away those passages as metaphorical without good justification for that interpretation. If you do so, then the skeptic might see you as using a metaphorical interpretation as an ad hoc attempt to slip out of a sticky situation. If you cannot resolve an apparent Bible difficulty, then it is probably better to simply admit that you are unable to solve the problem.

Anyway, that's a good start or so I hope. Please share your views about how not to defend the Bible.

Thank you for sharing that passage with us it rings true with me. If we are not caring , compassionate and empathetic towards others we are nothing but a noisy gong

 

[JonHawk]

Thank you for sharing that passage with us it rings true with me. If we are not caring , compassionate and empathetic towards others we are nothing but a noisy gong

Your chess master friend seems to think that he can tell if one is converted because he claims that when he received the Holy Spirit he became sinless. Now what does that caring, compassionate empathetic gong sound like to you?

 

[Trinitarian]

Your chess master friend seems to think that he can tell if one is converted because he claims that when he received the Holy Spirit he became sinless. Now what does that caring, compassionate empathetic gong sound like to you?

I’m new and don’t know people here . I do not believe in becoming sinless . The sinless One died for my sins and I will not become sinless in this life .

 

[JonHawk]

JonHawk said:
Your chess master friend seems to think that he can tell if one is converted because he claims that when he received the Holy Spirit he became sinless. Now what does that caring, compassionate empathetic gong sound like to you?

I’m new and don’t know people here . I do not believe in becoming sinless . The sinless One died for my sins ...

That sounds a whole lot more brotherly in my book. God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement; to be received by faith. Rom 3:25
For this reason, accept one another, then, just as Christ Jesus accepted you, in order to bring praise to God; so that the promises are confirmed and, moreover, that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy.
“Rejoice, you Gentiles, with his people.” Rom 15:7-10

 

[Gary Mac]

Unknown Soldier said:
We all should be aware that many people are very critical of the Bible and don't believe much of what it says.


Of course, as Christians we are commanded to be ready to defend what we believe. We read in 1 Peter 3:14-16 (New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition):

So regarding scripture we are to defend it with gentleness and respect. Sadly, Peter's advice often goes ignored. Many Christians won't even bother to defend the Bible. If they do defend it, they often treat skeptics with scorn as if they are fools or idiots.

I propose that Christians honor those who have made a good faith effort to read the Bible whether they agree with us or not about what it says or how credible it may be. Concede that many Bible passages are difficult to understand, and nobody needs to be ashamed if they have problems understanding those passages. After all, we Christians encourage unbelievers to read scripture, and we betray their trust in us if we insult their intelligence over disagreements or what conclusions they come to. If unbelievers do cite difficult passages, share with them the difficulty we all have with such passages. Don't try to take easy way outs by trying to explain away those passages as metaphorical without good justification for that interpretation. If you do so, then the skeptic might see you as using a metaphorical interpretation as an ad hoc attempt to slip out of a sticky situation. If you cannot resolve an apparent Bible difficulty, then it is probably better to simply admit that you are unable to solve the problem.

Anyway, that's a good start or so I hope. Please share your views about how not to defend the Bible.

We all should be aware that many people are very critical of the Bible and don't believe much of what it says. Of course, as Christians we are commanded to be ready to defend what we believe. We read in 1 Peter 3:14-16 (New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition):

In my experiences with bible beliefs, people such as Jim Jones, or David Koresh are really no different from denominational laws who regulate their beliefs just as Jim Jones and David Koresh did, just different laws to govern their beliefs.

So regarding scripture we are to defend it with gentleness and respect.

As Jim Jones and David Koresh did? They treated it with respect didnt they? DO not the Catholic, or Mormons, or Baptists, Methodists, COCs, AOGs, etc. do?

Sadly, Peter's advice often goes ignored. Many Christians won't even bother to defend the Bible. If they do defend it, they often treat skeptics with scorn as if they are fools or idiots.

Yes there is one here who claims the ways of Jesus is gnosticism.

I propose that Christians honor those who have made a good faith effort to read the Bible whether they agree with us or not about what it says or how credible it may be. Concede that many Bible passages are difficult to understand, and nobody needs to be ashamed if they have problems understanding those passages. After all, we Christians encourage unbelievers to read scripture, and we betray their trust in us if we insult their intelligence over disagreements or what conclusions they come to. If unbelievers do cite difficult passages, share with them the difficulty we all have with such passages. Don't try to take easy way outs by trying to explain away those passages as metaphorical without good justification for that interpretation. If you do so, then the skeptic might see you as using a metaphorical interpretation as an ad hoc attempt to slip out of a sticky situation. If you cannot resolve an apparent Bible difficulty, then it is probably better to simply admit that you are unable to solve the problem.

Anyway, that's a good start or so I hope. Please share your views about how not to defend the Bible.

It isn't a matter of defending the Bible, it is a matter of being what the Bible says to be like the Father of it. If one has in himself that what Jesus receieved in Matt 3:16 and others who receieved the same Spirit of God as Jesus did are like Him where His word is not written on stone nor a page of paper, but His word is within and delivers His word Himself in all who has receieved.

Gods word came into Jesus in Matt 3:16 for Jesus didnt know God nor His heaven until God came to Him and opened up who He is and what that is.

He does the very same in all who will receieve Him the same as Jesus did, Adam did and became like Him, Gen 3:22, Abraham did, Moses did, Mary did, 120 did and so did I. And to those who has not receieved from God doesnt have a clue that the kingdom of God doesnt come with observation, but is within you see Jesus in Luke 17:20-21. This is what they cant comprehend because they call themselves Christian but refuse to be like Him as Jesus was like Him, refusing to be ye therefore perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect, nor do they walk as He walks in His same light with the same signs following. These really do not believe the written word at all, only bits and pieces where they can make their own rules to govern their beliefs for their gods, Some has three gods they worship.

Just as anyone if they are a sinner, ask them if thy are perfect even as God of heaven I perfect. These can read that God takes away the sins of this world but refuse to repent and let Him. 1 John 3.

These can read 1 John 3 where when you see Him as He is ye shall be like Him. Ask how many actually believe that are are like Him and perfect as He is perfect and see if they really do believe the Bible.

I think you will find that very few find His ways to be like Him by the same God be in you who was in Christ Jesus.

 

[Gary Mac]

I’m new and don’t know people here . I do not believe in becoming sinless . The sinless One died for my sins and I will not become sinless in this life .

The reason you dont believe in being sinless is because you dont follow the ways of the One who takes away your sin. See 1 John 3, for He takes away the sins of this world. And 1 John 3:9, we who are born of God it is impossible to be in sin for we are born of God, but you seem to be born of sin instead being born again to be ye therefore perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect as Jesus commands of you.

Paul never got to the point of being born of God, born again, for he always struggled with sin that he said he was of just as you are doing.

Sin is not a defect it is a fact just as the One who takes it away from you is a fact.

The real issue is man loves sin more then they love God

 

[JonHawk]

They have hated both Me and my Father.

The real issue is man loves sin more then they love God

Whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. John 3:18-19

 

[Gary Mac]

They have hated both Me and my Father.

Yes these has accused Him of gnosticism.

Whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.

Amen these see Him in His ways as gnosticism.

This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. John 3:18-19

Yes and they learned that darkness of sin from Paul to be like him as the sinner.

That is why I follow the ways of Jesus that you say his ways is gnostic instead of your truth for Paul as a sinner. And he was true, you are the sinner instead of the righteousness of God with Christ in you, you anointed of God that you so reject because of His gnostic ways for you. .
.

 

[JonHawk]

They have hated both Me and my Father.

Amen these see Him in His ways as gnosticism.

Not even in the same ballpark.

Everlasting Love Of Christ
What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?
Nothing shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Rom 8

 

[Baltic]

We all should be aware that many people are very critical of the Bible and don't believe much of what it says. Of course, as Christians we are commanded to be ready to defend what we believe. We read in 1 Peter 3:14-16 (New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition):

So regarding scripture we are to defend it with gentleness and respect. Sadly, Peter's advice often goes ignored. Many Christians won't even bother to defend the Bible. If they do defend it, they often treat skeptics with scorn as if they are fools or idiots.

I propose that Christians honor those who have made a good faith effort to read the Bible whether they agree with us or not about what it says or how credible it may be. Concede that many Bible passages are difficult to understand, and nobody needs to be ashamed if they have problems understanding those passages. After all, we Christians encourage unbelievers to read scripture, and we betray their trust in us if we insult their intelligence over disagreements or what conclusions they come to. If unbelievers do cite difficult passages, share with them the difficulty we all have with such passages. Don't try to take easy way outs by trying to explain away those passages as metaphorical without good justification for that interpretation. If you do so, then the skeptic might see you as using a metaphorical interpretation as an ad hoc attempt to slip out of a sticky situation. If you cannot resolve an apparent Bible difficulty, then it is probably better to simply admit that you are unable to solve the problem.

Anyway, that's a good start or so I hope. Please share your views about how not to defend the Bible.

Originally apologetics was to show that Christianity is logical and had its standing among other religions, especially Judaism. It all had much sense because 95% of people were theists, they had no problem having Supreme Beeng. Arguments were on "faith" level. No theism is dealing with no faith issue. All bets are off.

 

[Gary Mac]

Not even in the same ballpark.

Everlasting Love Of Christ
What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?
Nothing shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Rom 8

Your heaven has a little corner of sin in it LOL.

 

[JonHawk]

Not even in the same ballpark.
Everlasting Love Of Christ What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things? Who shall bring a charge against God’s elect? It is God who justifies. Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?
Nothing shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Rom 8

Your heaven has a little corner of sin in it LOL.

No doubt your gnostic father was cast down.

The kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, has been cast down.

 

[Gary Mac]

No doubt your gnostic father was cast down.

In your eye for sure.

The kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, has been cast down.

Yes these false accusations that the ways of God and Jesus is gnosticism is defiantly the accuser of your brethren, LOL

 

[JonHawk]

In your eye for sure.

Yes these false accusations that the ways of God and Jesus is gnosticism is defiantly the accuser of your brethren, LOL

Your "defiantly" gnostic ways has nothing in common with believers?
For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness? And what communion has light with darkness?
And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? 2 Cor 6:14-16

 

[Gary Mac]

Your "defiantly" gnostic ways has nothing in common with believers?

I agree, believer can believe anything about a god, ask Jim Jones or David Koresh, they were believers as well as you LOL.

For what fellowship has righteousness with lawlessness?

None at all that is why Paul had no place as a sinner in Gods heaven. You only try and put a little corner of sin in your heaven.

And what communion has light with darkness?

None at all only in that light shines through that darkness of sin. But most Arte not thorough enough in repentance to receive from God.

And what accord has Christ with Belial? Or what part has a believer with an unbeliever? 2 Cor 6:14-16

The part is the one who is of Christ and anointed of God as Jesus was and picked the sinners to be his disciples instead to the religious pew sitters of the laws that govern where you sit. For the sinner has noting to unlearn from the religious minds who's laws govern their gods for a belief instead of the reality Jesus faced from God Himself in Matt 3:16 that you flat out deny of it.

 

[JonHawk]

I agree, believer can believe anything about a god, ask Jim Jones or David Koresh, they were believers as well as you LOL.

Regrettably one drank the kool-aid and the other was consumed in fire.
But those who believe in Christ Jesus will never be put to shame.
See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone; 1 Peter 2

 

[Gary Mac]

Regrettably one drank the kool-aid and the other was consumed in fire.
But those who believe in Christ Jesus will never be put to shame.

Thats right for I am like Him but is shameful to some who accuse his ways as gnosticism.

See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone; 1 Peter 2

The one I am of m-- the one you are of holds up sin as his disposition and admired that it was oh retched man that he was and you follow.

 

[JonHawk]

But those who believe in Christ Jesus will never be put to shame.
See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone; 1 Peter 2

Thats right for I am like Him but is shameful to some who accuse his ways as gnosticism.
The one I am of m-- the one you are of holds up sin as his disposition and admired that it was oh retched man that he was and you follow.

This is not about your shameful disposition, it's about life in the Son.
Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. 1 John 5:11-12

 

[Gary Mac]

This is not about your shameful disposition, it's about life in the Son.

I am His son.

Whoever has the Son has life;

I do indeed as His son.

whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. 1 John 5:11-12

Amen, but to many His ways as a son is gnostic heresies.