zerinus
Well-known member
Thank you for your cordial and thoughtful response.
Romans 11:
3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I [Elijah] am left alone, and they seek my life.
4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men [of Israel], who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
5 Even so then at this present time [Paul's time] also there is a remnant [of Israel] according to the election of grace.
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works [of the Law of Moses]: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Firstly, the passage is entirely about the house of Israel, not the Gentiles. Secondly, Paul equates, or compares, those (of the house of Israel, the "remnant") who were chosen, or elected at that time (his time), with the seven thousand men who had been chosen because they had not bowed the knee to the image of Baal in the days of Elijah. Now those were chosen precisely because they had not bowed the knee to the image of Baal. That was their merit for being chosen. Their "election" was not unmerited. They had the merit of not bowing the knee to Baal. Not bowing the knee to Baal is not a work. When Paul talks about "works," that is not what he is talking about. He is talking about the kind of "works" that the scribes and Pharisees of his day were engaged in, which were nothing more than a self-righteous hypocritical act. They tithed "mint and rue," but neglected the "weightier matters of the Law". So the bottom line is that grace is not unmerited. But what qualifies as "merit" is not a work--at least not the kind that the scribes and Pharisees were engaged in. Being humble is not a work. Being faithful is not a work. Not disobeying God is not a work. Not bowing the knee to Baal is not a work. But they do qualify one for receiving the grace of God.
Grace is still grace. If want to define grace as "unmerited" by definition, then that definition must apply across the board, not being dependent on the circumstances to which it is applied.
Are you defining humility as a "work"?!
Let us examine Paul's words more carefully in context:
Romans 11:
3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I [Elijah] am left alone, and they seek my life.
4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men [of Israel], who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
5 Even so then at this present time [Paul's time] also there is a remnant [of Israel] according to the election of grace.
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works [of the Law of Moses]: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Firstly, the passage is entirely about the house of Israel, not the Gentiles. Secondly, Paul equates, or compares, those (of the house of Israel, the "remnant") who were chosen, or elected at that time (his time), with the seven thousand men who had been chosen because they had not bowed the knee to the image of Baal in the days of Elijah. Now those were chosen precisely because they had not bowed the knee to the image of Baal. That was their merit for being chosen. Their "election" was not unmerited. They had the merit of not bowing the knee to Baal. Not bowing the knee to Baal is not a work. When Paul talks about "works," that is not what he is talking about. He is talking about the kind of "works" that the scribes and Pharisees of his day were engaged in, which were nothing more than a self-righteous hypocritical act. They tithed "mint and rue," but neglected the "weightier matters of the Law". So the bottom line is that grace is not unmerited. But what qualifies as "merit" is not a work--at least not the kind that the scribes and Pharisees were engaged in. Being humble is not a work. Being faithful is not a work. Not disobeying God is not a work. Not bowing the knee to Baal is not a work. But they do qualify one for receiving the grace of God.
