I'm decreed to be born a slave of sin, oh boy, I have an excuse!

ReverendRV

Well-known member
rev, when do your games stop? I offered to discuss the words of the verse the other poster thought I was misinterpreting. You jumped in with your own verse when nobody was talking to you, yet i still offered to tell you what i offered to tell him. But you don't really want me to, so you play games. Why is this such a big game to you guys?
I'm beginning to wonder if something is wrong with you; you're a Senior, right? Are you okay?
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Maybe you can finally exegete that simple verse since you were incapable of doing it with 1 Timothy 6:15-16
Not true. I did it it for the Timothy passage. I did it specifically for Johnny according to what he asked. You come in uppity and rude demanding I do it your way. When will you ever learn to either mind your own business or be humble when you interject yourself bewteen two posters?
 

civic

Well-known member
I'm beginning to wonder if something is wrong with you; you're a Senior, right? Are you okay?
I have worked professionally with dementia and Alzheimer’s residents since 2015 and the similarities are uncanny to say the least . I work with families dealing with this on a daily basis. I’ve been thinking what you said for some time now and your observations are spot on.Short term memory loss is a strong indication of early onset dementia.

hope this helps !!!
 

ReverendRV

Well-known member
I have worked professionally with dementia and Alzheimer’s residents since 2015 and the similarities are uncanny to say the least . I work with families dealing with this on a daily basis. I’ve been thinking what you said for sin time now. Short term memory loss is a strong indication of early onset dementia.

hope this helps !!!
Yes, I'm convicted about it now. God bless you Seth...
 

civic

Well-known member
Yes, I'm convicted about it now. God bless you Seth...
Yes I believe professional help or intervention would be helpful if there is family around. I’m very familiar with Senior communities that specialize in that area where the person lives and I know geriatric doctors who are specialists with brain disorders at UC Merced. I could recommend some for him if he was interested . I’m involved with Alzheimers fundraisers in our area snd we have a big walk this month in our area.
 
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TomFL

Guest
You are right about the lack of continuity. The Bible does not claim there is continuity, in the verse he had quoted. It just says the first is dissolved and the second comes from heaven.
Do you want to manufacture continuity where it is not stated?
Why do you claim there is no verse stating the first is destroyed. And I repeat, another posted actually typed the verse in saying the first is dissolved and the second is reserved in Heaven. There may be some continuity, but it is not stated there

Actually it does

1 Corinthians 15:42-44 (KJV)
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

The pronoun "It" refers to the body

The body that is sown is the body that arises

There is an obvious continuity

and Paul repeats sown raised imagery three times

2Cor 5:1

is a rather odd verse for you to appeal to

2 Corinthians 5:1 (KJV)
1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

to argue for an immaterial body

building, house do not exactly propagate the idea of the immaterial

and again we were told by Paul three times the body that was sown rises

further from other verses comes the imagery of dead bodies arising

John 5:28-29 (KJV)
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Daniel 12:2 (KJV)
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Ezekiel 37:12-14 (KJV)
12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

Matthew 27:52-53 (KJV)
52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Seeing as the uniform picture of resurrection is of bodies arising up out of their graves

I do not see how 1 verse by an author who showed obvious continuity could contradict himself

I would therefore consider the passage is simply speaking of God's design for the body

Finally How can Christ be victorious over the grave if bodies do not rise

1 Corinthians 15:54-55 (KJV)
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

BTW

Once again Jesus on the resurrection

John 2:19 (KJV)
19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.


Jesus lied or erred if it was not his physical body which was raised
 
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TomFL

Guest
Yet YOU want to manufacture "angelic bodies" where it is not stated.
So why the double standard, Seth?
Continuity is shown here

1 Corinthians 15:42-44 (KJV)
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

The body that is sown is the body that is raised (albeit with changes)
 
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TomFL

Guest
Yes it’s just one of many things he has to make up so that he can promote his false christ who is not a real man. Everything in scripture must be twisted and denied regarding Jesus humanity. These include the following:

The Resurrection
The Incarnation
The gospel
Body
Man
Mediator
Son of man
The Ascension
His 2nd Coming
The new earth
The New Jerusalem
The Millennium

And numerous other doctrines as well. It has a trickle down effect into everything.
The veracity of Jesus

John 2:19-21 (KJV)
19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

Jesus was either mistaken or lied if his physical body was not raised
 

civic

Well-known member
The veracity of Jesus

John 2:19-21 (KJV)
19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

Jesus was either mistaken or lied if his physical body was not raised
Agreed but watch how he wiggles out of it and rationalizes away Jesus words to become meaningless @Sethproton
 
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TomFL

Guest
Agreed but watch how he wiggles out of it and rationalizes away Jesus words to become meaningless @Sethproton
That is a difficult one

John 2:19-21 (KJV)
19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

Jesus was either mistaken or lied if his physical body was not raised
 

Sethproton

Well-known member
Actually it does

1 Corinthians 15:42-44 (KJV)
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

The pronoun "It" refers to the body

The body that is sown is the body that arises

There is an obvious continuity

and Paul repeats sown raised imagery three times

2Cor 5:1

is a rather odd verse for you to appeal to

2 Corinthians 5:1 (KJV)
1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

to argue for an immaterial body

building, house do not exactly propagate the idea of the immaterial

and again we were told by Paul three times the body that was sown rises

further from other verses comes the imagery of dead bodies arising

John 5:28-29 (KJV)
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Daniel 12:2 (KJV)
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Ezekiel 37:12-14 (KJV)
12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.

Matthew 27:52-53 (KJV)
52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Seeing as the uniform picture of resurrection is of bodies arising up out of their graves

I do not see how 1 verse by an author who showed obvious continuity could contradict himself

I would therefore consider the passage is simply speaking of God's design for the body

Finally How can Christ be victorious over the grave if bodies do not rise

1 Corinthians 15:54-55 (KJV)
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?

BTW

Once again Jesus on the resurrection

John 2:19 (KJV)
19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.


Jesus lied or erred if it was not his physical body which was raised
I think I have told you before, that I do recognize that there are verses on both sides of this. We all know the ones you are citing and have leaned on them for our whole Christian life, but there are also verses which tell a different story. Why would we want to twist those and run away from them? I want to look at it all and then have doctrine that embraces everything I can find in the Word.

As a side, when you fill your posts with more stuff than people want to look at, it just gets ignored. You have been told this. I think this forum works better if people limit their posts to fewer ideas at a shot, so a person can grasp and respond to it all.

Concerning John 2:9 - Jesus said he would raise the temple of His body. Obviously what everyone saw was not the body He died in. We have already discussed that not a single person recognized Him on sight or at hearing His voice. So that makes us have to look again by what He meant that He would raise the temple of His body. Something in that is the understanding of why He was appeared in a different body than He died in.
 
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