In Revelation 13:14, who does it say makes the image of the beast?

Yahweh will increase

Well-known member
Revelation 13:11-18

11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spoke as a dragon. 12 He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence. And he makes the earth and those who live on it worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. 13 He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of the sky to the earth in the presence of people. 14 And he deceives those who live on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who live on the earth to make an image to the beast who *had the wound of the sword and has come to life. 15 And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause all who do not worship the image of the beast to be killed. 16 And he causes all, the small and the great, the rich and the poor, and the free and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 and he decrees that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name. 18 Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six.




Notice first that this all involves the doctrine from the false prophet and that he deceives the inhabitants of the earth through false signs and wonders that he performs.

Notice also, it isn't actually the second beast or false prophet that makes this image of the beast but it is the inhabitants of the earth (all who are willing) that makes the image, and then it says that the false prophet causes this image to receive breath so that it both speaks and causes as many as will not worship the beast or his image to be killed.


So what is the image then?


Well let me ask you this, when in the OT someone would make an image to worship in rock or stone or wood, where did the image begin to be made or formed?

It would first begin right behind the forehead within the human mind and in the imaginations and then only after this would it be also formed and made of rock or stone or wood.


Are you getting the picture here yet.

For the image that is being spoken of here is made within the minds of the people and who by their own will adhere to the teachings of the false prophet and by this build the image within their minds.

I believe what is being revealed here, is that this image is a counterfeit and false image of God and Jesus Christ and which arose from what became the Holy Roman Empire (a merger of Christianity and pagan Rome) that became a seducer and deceiver of the church and in place of the old Roman Empire that persecuted the church in the past.

For this is the head of the beast (Political oppressive Rome) that was wounded by the sword of Constantine and then was revived to become The Holy Roman Empire.

This is where the pagan and political Rome was merged into the church to form an apostasy of the truth and a false version of God and Christ not originally taught by Jesus or his inspired writers of scripture.

Then it says that the false prophet gives breath to this image that is built within the heart of the people by their own will to receive his teachings and which will therefore eventually speak out (blasphemy) and cause as many as will not worship the beast and his image (who wont be part of the false religious clique and cult) to be put to death (murder of God's true people).


This is how I see it and so how do you see it?
 
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Timtofly

Member
If you stick with symbolism, the FP is still the first beast that implants a false image of Christ in the minds of humanity with the help of Satan the beast out of the pit, the second beast. All who take the mark are considered, the beast, and cast into the lake of fire 1000 years before the rest of the dead in sheol are.
 
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Yahweh will increase

Well-known member
If you stick with symbolism, the FP is still the first beast that implants a false image of Christ in the minds of humanity with the help of Satan the beast out of the pit, the second beast. All who take the mark are considered, the beast, and cast into the lake of fire 1000 years before the rest of the dead in sheol are.
That isn't what it says, but rather that the false prophet tells the people to manufacture the image of the beast.

However, it is the false prophet who supplies the false doctrine by which the people of their own will build the image within their heart.

The head of the first beast and the head that was wounded by the sword of Constantine and was revived, was political anti church Rome and it was raised up from the dead as the Holy Roman Empire, and the image to the beast therefore is the falser version of the Christian religion that came about through the merger of Rome and the church.


What most do not see here, is that the image of the beast parallels conformity to the true image of God and Christ (see Romans 8:29) with that which is a counterfeit from the spirit of antichrist.

The mark of the beast is apostasy from the true faith that once and for all was originally delivered to the saints and for the counterfeit substitute that the mainstream churches are even now receiving and worshiping, it is no more literal than the 144,000 and the name of God written in their foreheads is literal.

There are three called the beast in Revelation 13, 17 and 11, and one is referring to the body of people from the nations and which rises up from the sea and the second is the body of false clergy that rises up from the earth and looks like a lamb but speaks the words of the dragon and the third is the beast that rises up from the abyss the spirit of antichrist.


The beast from the seas and the beast from the earth are two branches of the kingdom of antichrist but make up one body and kingdom and the spirit of antichrist rules them, for he is the head and they are his body and kingdom.

Most do no see this in those passages but it is definitely revealed within them.

Many would also argue that the church cannot fall into apostasy because Jesus said the gates of hell would not prevail against it, but this is because they have a false interpretation of what Jesus meant by those words.


For all that Jesus meant by those words, was that death and hell (the grave) would not prevail against those who truly were his elect church, for gates are inanimate objects and they do not fight and so all that Jesus is saying is that his true church would not be over come by death and hell because he gives them eternal life and they shall never perish.


If you read the warnings to the seven churches of Revelation chapters 2-3, it is obvious that the churches were already headed towards apostasy even then and Jesus very clearly warned many of them that if they did not repent, he would remove their candle stick and they would no longer belong to him or his church.
 
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Timtofly

Member
I thought you were claiming the image was in the minds of the "rest of the people".

The FP represents all religious political thought. The two horned beast is Satan. Those with the mark are the beast.


It is these three, Satan, the FP, and the beast who show up in Chapter 16, and at the battle of Armageddon. There is not a fourth group or beast.
 

Kade Rystalmane

Well-known member
Revelation 13:11-18

11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spoke as a dragon. 12 He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence. And he makes the earth and those who live on it worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. 13 He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of the sky to the earth in the presence of people. 14 And he deceives those who live on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who live on the earth to make an image to the beast who *had the wound of the sword and has come to life. 15 And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause all who do not worship the image of the beast to be killed. 16 And he causes all, the small and the great, the rich and the poor, and the free and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, 17 and he decrees that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name. 18 Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six.




Notice first that this all involves the doctrine from the false prophet and that he deceives the inhabitants of the earth through false signs and wonders that he performs.

Notice also, it isn't actually the second beast or false prophet that makes this image of the beast but it is the inhabitants of the earth (all who are willing) that makes the image, and then it says that the false prophet causes this image to receive breath so that it both speaks and causes as many as will not worship the beast or his image to be killed.


So what is the image then?


Well let me ask you this, when in the OT someone would make an image to worship in rock or stone or wood, where did the image begin to be made or formed?

It would first begin right behind the forehead within the human mind and in the imaginations and then only after this would it be also formed and made of rock or stone or wood.


Are you getting the picture here yet.

For the image that is being spoken of here is made within the minds of the people and who by their own will adhere to the teachings of the false prophet and by this build the image within their minds.

I believe what is being revealed here, is that this image is a counterfeit and false image of God and Jesus Christ and which arose from what became the Holy Roman Empire (a merger of Christianity and pagan Rome) that became a seducer and deceiver of the church and in place of the old Roman Empire that persecuted the church in the past.

For this is the head of the beast (Political oppressive Rome) that was wounded by the sword of Constantine and then was revived to become The Holy Roman Empire.

This is where the pagan and political Rome was merged into the church to form an apostasy of the truth and a false version of God and Christ not originally taught by Jesus or his inspired writers of scripture.

Then it says that the false prophet gives breath to this image that is built within the heart of the people by their own will to receive his teachings and which will therefore eventually speak out (blasphemy) and cause as many as will not worship the beast and his image (who wont be part of the false religious clique and cult) to be put to death (murder of God's true people).


This is how I see it and so how do you see it?
Something along these lines, though where you see "Holy Roman Empire" (that is, Rome coupled with Catholicism), I believe it refers to an earlier iteration of Rome under the Caesars and specifically the cult of Caesar worship. In this time period that must shortly come to pass because the time is at hand when John wrote the book, this would be a direct reference to Caligula and later Nero and the cult of Caesars that worshipped them. My understanding is that Caligula was the first Caesar that demanded worship of himself before he died, and wanted statues of himself in every temple of worship throughout the empire. (Cladius was ambivalent towards the Caesar worship idea.)

Thus, the false prophet is an agent of Rome that convinced the Jews (those favorable to Rome, not the Zealots who later rose up and took over and rebelled) to erect a statue of Claduis. This false prophet could potentially refer to the high priest at the time because he was selected by Rome. The Herod's (related by marriage to the Caesars), the Sanhedrin, and the High Priest were all in cahoots with the Roman government. Ultimately, this is a huge reason for the rise of the Zealots and the rebellion during the first century AD.
 

Yahweh will increase

Well-known member
I thought you were claiming the image was in the minds of the "rest of the people".

The FP represents all religious political thought. The two horned beast is Satan. Those with the mark are the beast.


It is these three, Satan, the FP, and the beast who show up in Chapter 16, and at the battle of Armageddon. There is not a fourth group or beast.
The beast is three parts and it consists of two physical bodies of human adherents and also its head and which is the spirit of antichrist from the Bottomless pit.

So it is the body of human adherents from the sea of the nations as per Revelation 13:1-10 and also the body of false human clergy as per Revelation 13:11-16 but its head from Revelation 11:7 and 9:11 and also 17:8, is the beast from the bottomless pit who is the spirit of antichrist and the real culprit over all the others.


The image indeed is what the people of the earth willingly build upon with and within their minds and through the false teachings and doctrines of the second beast or false prophet or false clergy under the control of its head the spirit of antichrist.

You should also notice that all of these teach out of their mouths the trinity and as per Revelation 16 below.

Revelation 16:13 Then I saw three impure spirits that looked like frogs; they came out of the mouth of the dragon, out of the mouth of the beast and out of the mouth of the false prophet. 14 They are demonic spirits that perform signs, and they go out to the kings of the whole world, to gather them for the battle on the great day of God Almighty.

15 “Look, I come like a thief! Blessed is the one who stays awake and remains clothed, so as not to go naked and be shamefully exposed.”
16 Then they gathered the kings together to the place that in Hebrew is called Armageddon.




It should be quite obvious that this is false mainstream Christianity, for the deceiving false miracles and the trinity of spirits mentioned that are deceiving the world and getting them prepared for the great day of God Almighty in the battle of Armageddon.
 

Yahweh will increase

Well-known member
Something along these lines, though where you see "Holy Roman Empire" (that is, Rome coupled with Catholicism), I believe it refers to an earlier iteration of Rome under the Caesars and specifically the cult of Caesar worship. In this time period that must shortly come to pass because the time is at hand when John wrote the book, this would be a direct reference to Caligula and later Nero and the cult of Caesars that worshipped them. My understanding is that Caligula was the first Caesar that demanded worship of himself before he died, and wanted statues of himself in every temple of worship throughout the empire. (Cladius was ambivalent towards the Caesar worship idea.)

Thus, the false prophet is an agent of Rome that convinced the Jews (those favorable to Rome, not the Zealots who later rose up and took over and rebelled) to erect a statue of Claduis. This false prophet could potentially refer to the high priest at the time because he was selected by Rome. The Herod's (related by marriage to the Caesars), the Sanhedrin, and the High Priest were all in cahoots with the Roman government. Ultimately, this is a huge reason for the rise of the Zealots and the rebellion during the first century AD.
I believe it refers to the merge between Pagan Rome and Christianity and I believe the fact that it was called "The Holy Roman Empire" reveals this also.

For after Constantine defeated the three other would be Emperors and became the sole Emperor of Rome, Rome became a friendly foe of deception and seduction to the church and the apostate churches set their doctrines into church law against the truth that they had already fallen from.


For this is why Constantine called for the first council of the churches, to ask of them to establish their doctrines once and for all as church law and the problem was, they had already drifted into false teachings before this but they had not yet set them into church law until the council was held.
 

Kade Rystalmane

Well-known member
I believe it refers to the merge between Pagan Rome and Christianity and I believe the fact that it was called "The Holy Roman Empire" reveals this also.

For after Constantine defeated the three other would be Emperors and became the sole Emperor of Rome, Rome became a friendly foe of deception and seduction to the church and the apostate churches set their doctrines into church law against the truth that they had already fallen from.


For this is why Constantine called for the first council of the churches, to ask of them to establish their doctrines once and for all as church law and the problem was, they had already drifted into false teachings before this but they had not yet set them into church law until the council was held.
Gotcha.
 
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