In the Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve were unable to bear children. (not true)

[dberrie2020]

There was no need for them to fall so that their progeny could fill an earth that was created VERY GOOD.

Could you explain why God would create a tree, knowing it would cause the Fall of man,--and cost Him the Life of His Only Begotten Son--if there was not a greater cause? God counts His costs--why would He wager that kind of expense for something worth far less? I believe you sell God short in that kind of conclusion.

God knew Adam and Eve were going to partake of that tree. If you take your view--it implicates God, as He created the tree, and then placed it before Adam and Eve--knowing they would partake of it. Why?

The LDS take a different path--they believe it was a well devised plan which offered man an opportunity to become as God is. That takes the implication away--and replaces it with gratitude. Your position leaves God implicated.

Genesis 3:22---King James Version
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

On top of that--God sent His Son into the world to redeem us from the Fall--absolving all of mankind from the condemnation of the Fall. That says a lot to me.

Romans 5:18---King James Version
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

 

[Aaron32]

When you said the pre-incarnate Jesus was a product of a relationship between the Father and Mother in heaven....that's when Jesus came into being. That's when you said it.

Well that didn't come from me. I don't know what you're referring to.

Then according to you the God of the Old Test had a beginning.

Now your postulating your your ungrounded premise.

The eating of the fruit was an act of disobedience.

Yes. That man could know the sweet from the bitter.

LOL....because of the fall, trangression Adams eyes were open...and this allowed joy?

Yes. It's all in 2 Nephi 2. How can one have joy in righteousness if one doesn't know what misery is in wickedness.

This allowed Adam to see God in the flesh when Adam already had a body of flesh? As I said....wishy washy.

True, but when Adam saw God in the flesh, he didn't know good from evil.
If I was born and raised in Disneyland, would I appreciate Disneyland as other kids do?

 

[CrowCross]

Would you make the same observation about God's testimony here?

Genesis 3:22---King James Version
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

IOW--to become like God, to know good and evil--they had to disobey God?

As I said....any religion that has me disobey God...to get something is Satanic.

This research into the garden with Adam and Eve is really an eye opener. It confirms my belief about the deceptions of the LDS Church.

 

[CrowCross]

Could you explain why God would create a tree, knowing it would cause the Fall of man,-

Where does the bible say the tree of life caused the fall? The sin was disobedience. Eating from the tree was the disobedient act....Didn't your mormon priest ever teach you that?

 

[dberrie2020]

Where does the bible say the tree of life caused the fall?

LOL!!! Crow--it was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil which caused the Fall---not the tree of life:

Genesis 2:16-17---King James Version
16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Where do you find any mention of the tree of life in my post #61 to you? Anyone who was familiar with the Bible would know better.

The sin was disobedience. Eating from the tree was the disobedient act....Didn't your mormon priest ever teach you that?

Again--are you claiming that sin brought about this proclamation?

Genesis 3:22---King James Version
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

 

[dberrie2020]

As I said....any religion that has me disobey God...to get something is Satanic.

And I said--is this the evidence of that?

Genesis 3:22---King James Version
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

That did come as a result of the disobedience?

 

[CrowCross]

LOL!!! Crow--it was the tree of the knowledge of good and evil which caused the Fall---not the tree of life:

Genesis 2:16-17---King James Version
16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Where do you find any mention of the tree of life in my post #61 to you? Anyone who was familiar with the Bible would know better.



Again--are you claiming that sin brought about this proclamation?

Genesis 3:22---King James Version
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Tree of life was a typo......

Disobedience caused the fall....not the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

 

[CrowCross]

And I said--is this the evidence of that?

Genesis 3:22---King James Version
22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

That did come as a result of the disobedience?

Dude, I'm not going to continue to argue the point with you.

Your SATANIC religion tells us that A&E were instructed to disobey God if they wanted to have children.

Hey guys..you wanna have kids? Then eat from the tree I told you not to eat from.

 

[Richard7]

Crow--the LDS believe that is one reason Adam and Eve chose to eat of the fruit--because they could fulfill that commandment--and the Biblical record does not have any fulfillment of that command until after they were cast out of the Garden, as I pointed out. And there was a quick fulfillment of that commandments after they were cast out of the Garden:

"But if the last verse in Genesis 3 has Adam and Eve expelled from the Garden, and the very next verse has Eve conceiving, outside of the Garden--then that certainly leads to the question of why there is no record of Eve bearing children in the Garden--but readily conceived following the expulsion from the Garden?

Genesis 3:24---King James Version
24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

Genesis 4:1---King James Version
4 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

Those are consecutive verses. Could you explain why that does not lean toward LDS theology?"

Another thing we don't know, how long were they in the Garden before being cast out into the world.... plenty of time I imagine to be fruitful and multiply...

 

[Richard7]

It doesn't matter....they were in an un-fallen, created very good state of being.

They were not told...to disobey God then after you had fallen you were to go fill the earth. No,No,No..

You present Adam and Eve as being trapped in the garden...could not leave the garden. That is, if they had children in the garden they too would have also been trapped in the garden. Where does the bible teach this? The answer is, it doesn't.

Adam and Eve were told to populate the planet..."fill the earth"....and here's where you need to pay attention...while in an un-fallen state of being.

There was no need for them to fall so that their progeny could fill an earth that was created VERY GOOD.

Why is there a God given command to set cherubim and a flaming sword so that they could not come back at will...

“placed cherubim at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.”
Yes it was also to guard the tree of life... but while in the Garden they did not eat of the tree of life since they were already immortal.

 

[Richard7]

What a Satanic belief....the mormons teach that for Adam and Eve to fulfill a command of God, they must first disobey a command of God.

....as to a quick fulfillment to have children.....you don't know the time period between the banishment and having a child.
Once again its another speculation presented by the satanic mormon lie as truth.

Elder Oaks makes it clear that he is not minimizing the seriousness of disobedience, but insisting that Eve's action does not condemn her and all women afterward:

"For reasons that have not been revealed, this transition, or “fall,” could not happen without a transgression—an exercise of moral agency amounting to a willful breaking of a law (see Moses 6:59). This would be a planned offense, a formality to serve an eternal purpose. The Prophet Lehi explained that “if Adam had not transgressed he would not have fallen” (2 Nephi 2:22), but would have remained in the same state in which he was created....
Some Christians condemn Eve for her act, concluding that she and her daughters are somehow flawed by it. Not the Latter-day Saints! Informed by revelation, we celebrate Eve’s act and honor her wisdom and courage in the great episode called the Fall..."

 

[Richard7]

Dude, I'm not going to continue to argue the point with you.

Your SATANIC religion tells us that A&E were instructed to disobey God if they wanted to have children.

Hey guys..you wanna have kids? Then eat from the tree I told you not to eat from.

Of course you don't want to continue or argue, the replies you are gettin and common sense have set you back and now your puzzled and don't know how to reply... LOL. Your only recourse as we note, it your attempt at humor to replace your failure and lack of light and knowledge.

 

[CrowCross]

Why is there a God given command to set cherubim and a flaming sword so that they could not come back at will...

“placed cherubim at the east of the garden of Eden, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to guard the way to the tree of life.”
Yes it was also to guard the tree of life... but while in the Garden they did not eat of the tree of life since they were already immortal.

Few things come to mind....perhaps eating from the tree of life kept them alive...that is it was something done often. You don't have that answer.
Secondly, if the tree of life had to have been eaten only once...you don't know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden. It could have been several day or it could have been several years.

The mormon problem is that they draw conclusion based squarely on speculation...then teach it as some sort of inspired doctrine.


I already blew apart the doctrine where the mormons teach in order for A&E to have children (be fruitful and multiply) they first had to willfully disobey God. As I said anything that even comes remotely close to disobeying God to achieve a desire is Satanic.

 

[CrowCross]

Elder Oaks makes it clear that he is not minimizing the seriousness of disobedience, but insisting that Eve's action does not condemn her and all women afterward:

There is NO WAY you can get around disobeying God just so you mormons can celebrate Eve’s act and honor her wisdom and courage....for disobeying God during an event called a deception that resulted in the fall of mankind.

 

[CrowCross]

Of course you don't want to continue or argue, the replies you are gettin and common sense have set you back and now your puzzled and don't know how to reply... LOL. Your only recourse as we note, it your attempt at humor to replace your failure and lack of light and knowledge.

To be honest you have no argument to support your Satanic view. God would never tell you to disobey Him...let alone tell Adam and Eve to disobey Him.

I don't need to argue the point anymore...as you have lost.

 

[Richard7]

To be honest you have no argument to support your Satanic view. God would never tell you to disobey Him...let alone tell Adam and Eve to disobey Him.

I don't need to argue the point anymore...as you have lost.

I not here to persuade you, that is not my calling, check with the Holy Ghost for all truth...

 

[Richard7]

There is NO WAY you can get around disobeying God just so you mormons can celebrate Eve’s act and honor her wisdom and courage....for disobeying God during an event called a deception that resulted in the fall of mankind.

Well seems you have condemned Eve... not my problem, at least I have not judged her as a sinner as you have... I thought that was the place for God to judge all, for their good or bad works, that is Scripture in case you never learned it... hmm

 

[Richard7]

Few things come to mind....perhaps eating from the tree of life kept them alive...that is it was something done often. You don't have that answer.
Secondly, if the tree of life had to have been eaten only once...you don't know how long Adam and Eve were in the garden. It could have been several day or it could have been several years.

So you do not know if Adam was immortal, and you seem to know even less about the fall and how death entered into the world... hmmm
Might try studying the scriptures before you ever come back here, you ignorance is noted.

The mormon problem is that they draw conclusion based squarely on speculation...then teach it as some sort of inspired doctrine.

No, from study and prayer first and second we have a prophet of God that reveals revelation and not some pastor who went to Theological school and hangs his certificate in his office proclaiming his ready to go... chuckle.

I already blew apart the doctrine where the mormons teach in order for A&E to have children (be fruitful and multiply) they first had to willfully disobey God. As I said anything that even comes remotely close to disobeying God to achieve a desire is Satanic.

Whatever good buddy, keep researching and reading and praying... good luck..

 

[CrowCross]

I not here to persuade you, that is not my calling, check with the Holy Ghost for all truth...

I did check....The Holy Spirit said GOD WOULD NEVER HAVE YOU DISOBEY HIM...NEVER.

But, your Satanic "church" as well as you and the other mormons who post here tell us in order to have children A&E had to disobey God and eat from the tree....so they could fall and then be able to have children.

You need to REPENT.

 

[CrowCross]

Well seems you have condemned Eve... not my problem, at least I have not judged her as a sinner as you have... I thought that was the place for God to judge all, for their good or bad works, that is Scripture in case you never learned it... hmm

FACE PALM.....the Bible tells us she sinned.

You really need to REPENT Richard7.