Interesting article on religious doubts

SteveB

Well-known member
Saw this article and thought it interesting.
This does not appear to be behind a pay wall.
I've only included the abstract. You'll have to read the whole article yourself.




The Doubting Process: A Longitudinal Study of the Precipitants and Consequences of Religious Doubt​

Neal Krause and Christopher G. Ellison
Additional article information

Abstract

Religious doubt arises from a process in which there is a precipitant, the experience of doubt, a coping response, and a health-related outcome. We explore this process by assessing whether social factors precipitate doubt and the coping responses that are invoked to deal with it. Moreover, we evaluate whether these coping responses are, in turn, associated with health. The data reveal that, over time, people who encounter more negative interaction with fellow congregants have more doubts about religion, whereas more spiritual support and greater involvement in prayer groups are associated with less religious doubt. The findings further indicate that people who encounter more negative interaction are more likely to suppress religious doubts, but people who attend Bible study groups are more likely to seek spiritual growth when faced with doubt. Finally, the results suggest that suppressing religious doubt is associated with less favorable health, whereas seeking spiritual growth does not have a significant effect.


Another article on this topic is


 

The Pixie

Well-known member
...

Another article on this topic is
Do you have any personal connect to the article? I ask because when I looked, it says it is 2 hours old, and it is over an hour since you posted about it, so (assuming the blog timing is right) you managed to start a thread on this topic within an hour of Wallace blogging on it. Kind of looks like you are pimping it.
 

SteveB

Well-known member
Do you have any personal connect to the article? I ask because when I looked, it says it is 2 hours old, and it is over an hour since you posted about it, so (assuming the blog timing is right) you managed to start a thread on this topic within an hour of Wallace blogging on it. Kind of looks like you are pimping it.
In other words, you just wanted to whine?

Yes. I have a "personal" connection.

I have the app for his materials. So when it was a few minutes old, I read the article, checked the nih source, and then afterwards I posted here because you and your fellow atheists are so anal about your unbelief.

Strike it up to actually thinking that truth matters to you because you keep claiming that truth matters to you.
 

bigthinker

Well-known member
Saw this article and thought it interesting.
This does not appear to be behind a pay wall.
I've only included the abstract. You'll have to read the whole article yourself.





The Doubting Process: A Longitudinal Study of the Precipitants and Consequences of Religious Doubt​

Neal Krause and Christopher G. Ellison
Additional article information

Abstract

Religious doubt arises from a process in which there is a precipitant, the experience of doubt, a coping response, and a health-related outcome. We explore this process by assessing whether social factors precipitate doubt and the coping responses that are invoked to deal with it. Moreover, we evaluate whether these coping responses are, in turn, associated with health. The data reveal that, over time, people who encounter more negative interaction with fellow congregants have more doubts about religion, whereas more spiritual support and greater involvement in prayer groups are associated with less religious doubt. The findings further indicate that people who encounter more negative interaction are more likely to suppress religious doubts, but people who attend Bible study groups are more likely to seek spiritual growth when faced with doubt. Finally, the results suggest that suppressing religious doubt is associated with less favorable health, whereas seeking spiritual growth does not have a significant effect.


Another article on this topic is
Do any atheists here have any religious doubt?
I have zero.
 

Algor

Well-known member
Saw this article and thought it interesting.
This does not appear to be behind a pay wall.
I've only included the abstract. You'll have to read the whole article yourself.





The Doubting Process: A Longitudinal Study of the Precipitants and Consequences of Religious Doubt​

Neal Krause and Christopher G. Ellison
Additional article information

Abstract

Religious doubt arises from a process in which there is a precipitant, the experience of doubt, a coping response, and a health-related outcome. We explore this process by assessing whether social factors precipitate doubt and the coping responses that are invoked to deal with it. Moreover, we evaluate whether these coping responses are, in turn, associated with health. The data reveal that, over time, people who encounter more negative interaction with fellow congregants have more doubts about religion, whereas more spiritual support and greater involvement in prayer groups are associated with less religious doubt. The findings further indicate that people who encounter more negative interaction are more likely to suppress religious doubts, but people who attend Bible study groups are more likely to seek spiritual growth when faced with doubt. Finally, the results suggest that suppressing religious doubt is associated with less favorable health, whereas seeking spiritual growth does not have a significant effect.


Another article on this topic is
This IS interesting. It's a bit pat, which always makes me wary, but it does fit in with a lot of other stuff.

I have some concerns about the effect of non-random attrition, which the authors acknowledege, but I'm not sure they explore it enough. I'll give it a more careful read and think. Thank you!
 

bigthinker

Well-known member
Saw this article and thought it interesting.
This does not appear to be behind a pay wall.
I've only included the abstract. You'll have to read the whole article yourself.





The Doubting Process: A Longitudinal Study of the Precipitants and Consequences of Religious Doubt​

Neal Krause and Christopher G. Ellison
Additional article information

Abstract

Religious doubt arises from a process in which there is a precipitant, the experience of doubt, a coping response, and a health-related outcome. We explore this process by assessing whether social factors precipitate doubt and the coping responses that are invoked to deal with it. Moreover, we evaluate whether these coping responses are, in turn, associated with health. The data reveal that, over time, people who encounter more negative interaction with fellow congregants have more doubts about religion, whereas more spiritual support and greater involvement in prayer groups are associated with less religious doubt. The findings further indicate that people who encounter more negative interaction are more likely to suppress religious doubts, but people who attend Bible study groups are more likely to seek spiritual growth when faced with doubt. Finally, the results suggest that suppressing religious doubt is associated with less favorable health, whereas seeking spiritual growth does not have a significant effect.


Another article on this topic is
Doubt is the beginning of path to knowledge.
 

bigthinker

Well-known member
I posted here because you and your fellow atheists are so anal about your unbelief.
Atheists don't have doubt regarding religion; rather we lack belief and reject the claims of religion. This is different than have doubts with regard to one's faith.
We don't have faith and we don't have unbelief.
 

The Pixie

Well-known member
In other words, you just wanted to whine?

Yes. I have a "personal" connection.

I have the app for his materials. So when it was a few minutes old, I read the article, checked the nih source, and then afterwards I posted here because you and your fellow atheists are so anal about your unbelief.
See, you could have been pen about that from the start. You said in the OP "Saw this article and thought it interesting." Was that true? Apparently not. Apparently you saw Wallace's blog post, and it was seeing that that prompted you to post.

And now I am wondering how much of the rest of your post is true.

I have the app for his materials. So when it was a few minutes old, I read the article, checked the nih source, and then afterwards I posted here because you and your fellow atheists are so anal about your unbelief.

Strike it up to actually thinking that truth matters to you because you keep claiming that truth matters to you.
Did you not read the article? I guess not.

There is nothing in it about whether Christianity is true or not. It is about the psychology of how Christians deal with doubt. At best the article would help atheists understand the coping mechanisms Christians use when they have doubt - like you on the Paul changing his name thread.

The Wallace blog post is the the same.

Look at myth 2:

Myth #2: “Doubt shouldn’t be admitted or discussed since it is basically a character flaw.”

No atheist thinks doubt is a character flaw - quite the reverse, we think blind faith is a character flaw.

So you say you read Wallace's blog post, but is that really true? You say you checked the NLM source, but is that really true?

It all sounds a bit, well, doubtful.
 

Vladimir

Member
Do any atheists here have any religious doubt?
I have zero.
I'm working through my doubts now. I think they are having to do with my lack of assertiveness in general (as an aside, I'm talking about my real life, I may come across differently through my online persona).

I grew up in a very authoritarian home, without having good relationship with my dad. Even my friends were afraid of him and he came across as all business, no bull (crap) kind of a guy. Now that I'm in my 40s, I think he was overwhelmed, perhaps a bit depressed. But to a kid like myself, he came across as a figure to be feared. In a strange way, I was proud of him being my dad, but I dreaded most times he'd call me for a talk, as that would mean a beating for something that felt outside my control.

I grew up in the USSR, in a Christian home. Which meant I had to be a good example. But my family dynamic resulted in me being afraid of my father, and also being afraid of God. I was worried that God too would treat me the same way, a worry that would be reinforced by some passages in the Bible that warn against doubt, fear, etc.. As I was trying to process these things (or ruminate, probably more correct term), I'd miss some important lesson in school which would result in a beating at home.

Long story short, I'm at a point now where I'm 99% an agnostic atheist. However, that 1% causes me much doubt and suffering as I can imagine a being who hides from people and will then judge everyone by purely arbitrary rules (similar to how it felt being a kid in my father's house).

Anyways, this is my experience for why I doubt. I envy those of you (atheists) who don't have doubts and live peaceful lives, free from superstitions.
 

Torin

Well-known member
I'm working through my doubts now. I think they are having to do with my lack of assertiveness in general (as an aside, I'm talking about my real life, I may come across differently through my online persona).

I grew up in a very authoritarian home, without having good relationship with my dad. Even my friends were afraid of him and he came across as all business, no bull (crap) kind of a guy. Now that I'm in my 40s, I think he was overwhelmed, perhaps a bit depressed. But to a kid like myself, he came across as a figure to be feared. In a strange way, I was proud of him being my dad, but I dreaded most times he'd call me for a talk, as that would mean a beating for something that felt outside my control.

I grew up in the USSR, in a Christian home. Which meant I had to be a good example. But my family dynamic resulted in me being afraid of my father, and also being afraid of God. I was worried that God too would treat me the same way, a worry that would be reinforced by some passages in the Bible that warn against doubt, fear, etc.. As I was trying to process these things (or ruminate, probably more correct term), I'd miss some important lesson in school which would result in a beating at home.

Long story short, I'm at a point now where I'm 99% an agnostic atheist. However, that 1% causes me much doubt and suffering as I can imagine a being who hides from people and will then judge everyone by purely arbitrary rules (similar to how it felt being a kid in my father's house).

Anyways, this is my experience for why I doubt. I envy those of you (atheists) who don't have doubts and live peaceful lives, free from superstitions.
Thanks for your story, Vladimir. I'm sorry you had some difficult experiences growing up.

I don't know how familiar you are with Ayn Rand or her philosophy of Objectivism, but she had a really, really useful epistemological concept: "the arbitrary." A claim is "arbitrary" if you do not have any reason at all to agree with it and you do not have any reason at all to deny it.

According to Objectivism, the only rational thing to do with an arbitrary claim is to toss it out, without consideration, as if nothing had been said. Objectivism holds that if you don't shun the arbitrary like this, it paralyzes your ability to reason any further on the issue. After all, there's no basis for taking one step rather than another if the arbitrary is admissible.

I'm not necessarily saying you should toss out the concept of God like this. I don't know your situation. For all I know, you may have some slight reason to think God may exist that keeps you up in the air for now (1%).

What I am saying is that you should work to identify something specific that is the basis for your indecision. That could be a specific argument or a specific piece of evidence or anything you honestly think is probative. But it should be specific. It's not healthy or reasonable to stay undecided forever for no reason in particular.

Good luck with your doubts.
 

TeabagSalad

Active member
In other words, you just wanted to whine?

Yes. I have a "personal" connection.

I have the app for his materials. So when it was a few minutes old, I read the article, checked the nih source, and then afterwards I posted here because you and your fellow atheists are so anal about your unbelief.

Strike it up to actually thinking that truth matters to you because you keep claiming that truth matters to you.
Do you think that you are going to win any converts to Christianity with your insulting attitude?
 

Algor

Well-known member
I'm working through my doubts now. I think they are having to do with my lack of assertiveness in general (as an aside, I'm talking about my real life, I may come across differently through my online persona).

I grew up in a very authoritarian home, without having good relationship with my dad. Even my friends were afraid of him and he came across as all business, no bull (crap) kind of a guy. Now that I'm in my 40s, I think he was overwhelmed, perhaps a bit depressed. But to a kid like myself, he came across as a figure to be feared. In a strange way, I was proud of him being my dad, but I dreaded most times he'd call me for a talk, as that would mean a beating for something that felt outside my control.

I grew up in the USSR, in a Christian home. Which meant I had to be a good example. But my family dynamic resulted in me being afraid of my father, and also being afraid of God. I was worried that God too would treat me the same way, a worry that would be reinforced by some passages in the Bible that warn against doubt, fear, etc.. As I was trying to process these things (or ruminate, probably more correct term), I'd miss some important lesson in school which would result in a beating at home.

Long story short, I'm at a point now where I'm 99% an agnostic atheist. However, that 1% causes me much doubt and suffering as I can imagine a being who hides from people and will then judge everyone by purely arbitrary rules (similar to how it felt being a kid in my father's house).

Anyways, this is my experience for why I doubt. I envy those of you (atheists) who don't have doubts and live peaceful lives, free from superstitions.
I very much doubt you are alone in this. It says a lot for you that you can actually talk about it so plainly and clearly, so thank you, and I hope it gets easier.
 
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