Is Jehovah His Name?

shnarkle

Well-known member
That's the English language for ya!
After I clicked on your post, I just sat there and waited for those eyes to bug out. That is hysterical!

It isn't just English language. It's the whole culture. When I discovered how Jews reckon time, I was instantly struck by how much more efficient it is. We talk of it being 11:45 Saturday night, and 12:14 Sunday morning, but they're really the same night by Hebrew reckoning. 11:45 Sunday night is a completely different night by western reckoning. It's unnecessarily confusing.

Having the day begin and end at sunset is much more efficient.
 

rossh

Well-known member
My question is were there any periods of time that existed that were long enough for practicing Jews to forget the feast days. I know there is talk of finding the book of the law, and reading it, but I don't recall how long they had gone without it, or of any other examples in the bible or any other historical sources.

The reason I ask this is because God's name is supposed to be pronounced during some of these feast days, and I don't think they would forget how to pronounce God's name within a year.

The other thing I find particularly disturbing is the fact that the usage of the hard "J" is used in scripture to denote derision, e.g. "Jezebel", "Jezreel" etc. Given this fact, it seems sad that so many of these biblical names are now so commonly used with this same hard J, e.g. Jesus, Jehovah, Jerusalem etc.

I can't help but think Satan takes pleasure in this.
the best laugh ever to be had are those who claim that " Jehovah " alone is God and that they follow Him only.. There is NO " Jj " in the Hebrew/Jewish language,,, can you explain why they insist on their " ehovah " ??
It’s true. There is no letterJ” in the 22 letters of the Hebrew alphabet. So, Muslims argue that Jesus’ name must be a fabrication. J is only common to "modern " English and not even in early Roman/Latin..
 
the best laugh ever to be had are those who claim that " Jehovah " alone is God and that they follow Him only.. There is NO " Jj " in the Hebrew/Jewish language,,, can you explain why they insist on their " ehovah " ??
It’s true. There is no letterJ” in the 22 letters of the Hebrew alphabet. So, Muslims argue that Jesus’ name must be a fabrication. J is only common to "modern " English and not even in early Roman/Latin..
You must not believe in "J"esus, then...
 

rossh

Well-known member
You must not believe in "J"esus, then...
your supposition, soooo go deal with it yourself!!!
Try a REAL name Yeshua
Matt 1:
20 But while he was thinking about this, an angel of ADONAI appeared to him in a dream and said, "Yosef, son of David, do not be afraid to take Miryam home with you as your wife; for what has been conceived in her is from the Ruach HaKodesh.

21 She will give birth to a son, and you are to name him Yeshua, [which means `ADONAI saves,'] because he will save his people from their sins."

22 All this happened in order to fulfill what ADONAI had said through the prophet,

23 "The virgin will conceive and bear a son, and they will call him `Immanu El."a (The name means, "God is with us.")

Amen!
 

TrevorL

Active member
Greetings JustTheFacts,
I am not sure if you are endorsing the article or quoting theMadJW's post. Part of the article states (with my highligting):
In late 2016, Gordon found never-translated traditional Jewish sources that explicitly identified the vowels of God’s name in Hebrew as “Yehovah.” This is similar to the English Jehovah, but with a “Y” and the emphasis on the final syllable.
God’s name, known as the Tetragrammaton, is written in most Hebrew Bible manuscripts with one of its vowels missing, making it unreadable in accordance with an ancient Jewish ban on speaking the name. Despite this, Gordon had previously discovered five Bible manuscripts with a full set of Hebrew vowels proving the pronunciation of the Tetragrammaton was known to Jewish scribes as “Yehovah.”

I repeat the question that I asked theMadJW:
How do you explain the two different versions of the YHWH Name with different vowel points S#3068,3069?
Are you theMadJW with a new avatar and a new set of eyes?

Kind regards
Trevor
 
your supposition, soooo go deal with it yourself!!!
Try a REAL name Yeshua
Matt 1:
20 But while he was thinking about this, an angel of ADONAI appeared to him in a dream and said, "Yosef, son of David, do not be afraid to take Miryam home with you as your wife; for what has been conceived in her is from the Ruach HaKodesh.

21 She will give birth to a son, and you are to name him Yeshua, [which means `ADONAI saves,'] because he will save his people from their sins."

22 All this happened in order to fulfill what ADONAI had said through the prophet,

23 "The virgin will conceive and bear a son, and they will call him `Immanu El."a (The name means, "God is with us.")

Amen!
So the 'Triune God' was with mankind?
 

TrevorL

Active member
Greetings again the MadJW and / or Just the Facts,
All excuses have been revealed:

I was interested in reading the extensive article “Jehovah” pages 882-895 in the JW Book Aid to Bible Understanding. The following are a few excerpts that I found to be relevant to the subject of this thread and relevant to some of the things that have been discussed.

Page 882: “Jehovah” is the best known English pronunciation of the divine name, but “Yahweh” is preferred by most scholars.

Page 884: The time did come, however, when in reading the Hebrew Scriptures in the original language, the Jewish reader substituted either ‘Adho-nay’ (Lord) or ‘Elo-him’ (God) rather than pronounce the divine name represented by the Tetragrammaton. This is seen from the fact that when vowel pointing came into use in the second half of the first millennium C.E. the Jewish copyists inserted the vowel points for either ‘Adho-nay’ or ‘Elo-him’ into the Tetragrammaton, evidently to warn the reader to say those words in place of pronouncing the divine name.

Pages 884-885: The pronunciations “Jehovah” and “Yahweh”: By combining the vowel signs of ‘Adho-nay’ and ‘Elo-him’ with the four consonants of the Tetragrammaton the pronunciations ‘Yeho-wah’ and ‘Yeho-wih’ were formed. The first of these provided the basis for the Latinised form “Jehova(h)”. The first recorded use of this form dates from the thirteenth century C.E. Raymundus Martini, a Spanish monk of the Dominican Order, used it in his book Pugco Fidei of the year 1270. Hebrew scholars generally favour “Yahweh” as the most likely pronunciation.

Page 888: Moses raised the question: “Suppose I am now come to the sons of Israel and I do say to them, ‘The God of your forefathers has sent me to you,’ and they do say to me ‘What is his name?’ What shall I say to them?” … Moses’ question was a meaningful one. God’s reply in Hebrew was “’Eh-yeh’ asher eh-yeh’.” While some translations render this as “I AM THAT I AM,” the Hebrew verb (ha-yah’) from which the word ‘eh-yeh’ is drawn does not mean simply to exist. Rather, it means to come into existence, to happen, occur, become, take on (an attribute), enter upon (a state), or constitute. Thus, the footnote of the Revised Standard Version gives as one reading “I Will Be What I Will Be”.

I do not endorse all that is stated in this JW article, but I consider that the above is correct. Despite the above clear exposition, there are some JWs who still insist that Jehovah is the correct translation. Another useful reference is Rotherham's introduction in his Bible Translation where he dismisses the translation "Jehovah" and explains why he uses "Yahweh" in his translation of YHWH in the OT.

Kind regards
Trevor
 

Steven Avery

Well-known member
Page 882: “Jehovah” is the best known English pronunciation of the divine name, but “Yahweh” is preferred by most scholars.

This is why the JW's are a mediocre source. Much better today is the scholarship around Dr. Nehemia Gordon and many people who have assisted and have written as well.
 

shnarkle

Well-known member
Page 882: “Jehovah” is the best known English pronunciation of the divine name, but “Yahweh” is preferred by most scholars.
Hebrew scholars generally favour “Yahweh” as the most likely pronunciation.

Despite the above clear exposition, there are some JWs who still insist that Jehovah is the correct translation
I don't know any Jewish scholars, rabbi, etc. who isn't aware that using the hard "J" sound is intentionally derisive. Given their own admission that this isn't even an accurate pronunciation of the name, I don't understand why they insist on using the hard "J" sound.
the Hebrew verb (ha-yah’) from which the word ‘eh-yeh’ is drawn does not mean simply to exist. Rather, it means to come into existence, to happen, occur, become, take on (an attribute), enter upon (a state), or constitute. Thus, the footnote of the Revised Standard Version gives as one reading “I Will Be What I Will Be”.

I do not endorse all that is stated in this JW article, but I consider that the above is correct.
As many times as I've pointed this out, it never seems to get any traction, i.e. "I will be" rather than "I am". One could also point out that potential or potentiality is somewhat of an all encompassing characteristic of God, e.g. "omnipotent" or all potent. In the Old Testament we see God's will, but in the New Testament we see it embodied or manifest in, with, and through Christ.

I find John's gospel particularly enlightening in showing Christ as God manifest rather than potential. Christ only does what he sees given to him potentially from the Father.
 

TrevorL

Active member
Greetings Steven Avery,
This is why the JW's are a mediocre source. Much better today is the scholarship around Dr. Nehemia Gordon and many people who have assisted and have written as well.
I listened to Dr. Nehemia Gordon's Hebrew Voices #87 Yehovah Research Update which is a discussion with T-Bone about the number of occurrences in various manuscripts of YHWH with the vowel pointing of Adonai, thus incorrectly pronounced Yehovah by Dr. Nehemia Gordon and T-Bone and he also mentioned a video called The Great I AM, which is a wrong translation of Ehyeh. The vowel points of Adonai were added to YHWH so that the reader would say Adonai instead of the Sacred Name, and Ehyeh should be translated I will be as per Tyndale and the RV and RSV margins and AB Davidson.

Kind regards
Trevor
 

Steven Avery

Well-known member
I listened to Dr. Nehemia Gordon's Hebrew Voices #87 Yehovah Research Update which is a discussion with T-Bone about the number of occurrences in various manuscripts of YHWH with the vowel pointing of Adonai, thus incorrectly pronounced Yehovah by Dr. Nehemia Gordon and T-Bone and he also mentioned a video called The Great I AM, which is a wrong translation of Ehyeh. The vowel points of Adonai were added to YHWH so that the reader would say Adonai instead of the Sacred Name, and Ehyeh should be translated I will be as per Tyndale and the RV and RSV margins and AB Davidson.
Kind regards
Trevor

Hi Trevor,

How do you explain the 20 or so Theophoric names that start with the same consonants and vowels as Jehovah?

Thanks!

Steven
 
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