Is the Rapture in the Bible?

Pipiripi

Active member
It is true & I believe the rapture is when God will judge His House first as the Bridegroom, gathering saints that ae abiding in Him & are willing to go to the Marriage Supper above. leaving behind saved believers that loved this life more than Him to not to leave ( Luke 21:34-36 & Luke 14:15-24 ) as well as leaving behind workers of iniquity for why He would deny them ( Titus 1:15-16 & Luke 7:21-23 ) for not being ready ( Luke 12:40-49 ).

That is your way of not wanting to have a discussion with me by applying verses to the topic at hand, but to avoid the discussion altogether.
I will have a discussion with you. But I will also read what you are saying in the Bible.
 

Pipiripi

Active member
It is true & I believe the rapture is when God will judge His House first as the Bridegroom, gathering saints that ae abiding in Him & are willing to go to the Marriage Supper above. leaving behind saved believers that loved this life more than Him to not to leave ( Luke 21:34-36 & Luke 14:15-24 ) as well as leaving behind workers of iniquity for why He would deny them ( Titus 1:15-16 & Luke 7:21-23 ) for not being ready ( Luke 12:40-49 ).

That is your way of not wanting to have a discussion with me by applying verses to the topic at hand, but to avoid the discussion altogether.

Show me exactly when the rapture occur! And at what time?
I don't mean days and hour.

I know that Jesus Christ must come back in two phases now.
So the first time Jesus has come as a baby.
I want to know the second and the third time. Please don't give me many chapters and verses. One chapter and verse is enough and your application! Thanks.
 

Pipiripi

Active member
Your application of John 17:15 is not nulling and voiding the rapture event when God will judge His House first. Since scripture cannot go against scripture... then how do you apply this warning for believers to be ready or else?

Luke 21:34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares. 35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. 36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Verse 34 & 35 is a warning to believers that they will be ensnared by the cares of this life that they will be caught unaware. How can what Jesus described apply to the end of the great tribulation? No believer would be tempted to stay at that time, right?

How can Jesus ask believers to pray to escape what is coming on the earth to stand before Him still align with how you are applying John 17:15 to mean? You can't.

Therefore John 17:15 is addressing believers in the world that we are living in now to help us through regular tribulation in the world, but STILL to pray to escape the coming fire on the earth & the eventual great tribulation as a result by not being snared by the world with His help so they are willing to leave when the Bridegroom comes.

Oh, and the rapture will not be quiet. After the rapture, the first angel will spread the gospel everywhere so all will have heard the gospel per Revelation 14:6-7. The second angel will announce the fall of Babylon, USA, which will include the western hemisphere as one third of the earth will burn up with fire per Revelation 14:8 with Revelation 8:9 & Revelation 18th chapter for more detail about the fall of Babylon with left behind saints dying in it. Then the third angel warns every one the consequence for taking the mark of the beast which is the lake of fire in Revelation 14:9-11.

By those 3 angels after the rapture, everyone will know the gospel, then the destruction that will bring about the new world order & the mark of the beast system to survive in the great tribulation that shall follow. This is the hour of temptation that shall try all upon the earth.

So Luke 21:34-36 is for believers in the times we are living in now, to be praying that they are willing to go when the Bridegroom comes and to be found abiding in Him and not be getting drunk or engaging in a regular practice of living in sin thus not be ready to go when He comes.

Luke 17:15 applies to how we live now...for God to help us through our tribulations now, otherwise when do you apply Luke 21:34-36?
If you have read in my thread, the rapture theory 2. Then you will see in John 10:10. Take a look and read Jesus coming as a thief!!
 

Hark

Well-known member
Show me exactly when the rapture occur! And at what time?
I don't mean days and hour.

I know that Jesus Christ must come back in two phases now.
So the first time Jesus has come as a baby.
I want to know the second and the third time. Please don't give me many chapters and verses. One chapter and verse is enough and your application! Thanks.
Matthew 13:33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.

There is the firstfruits of the resurrection at the pre great tribulation rapture when the Bridegroom gathers those who follow His voice & ready as well as willing to go to the Marriage Supper in Heaven.

Then they that be Christ's at His coming at the end of the great tribulation after the world's armies is defeated and Satan is in the pit for a thousand years for when they are finally resurrected.

And then at the end of the 1000 year reign after a small season when Satan is released from the pit to lead another rebellion, but those remaining loyal to Christ will be of that third & last harvest that makes up the whole of the kingdom of heaven when Satan, death, and hell is in the lake of fire forever before Jesus gives up the kingdom back to the Father.

Those 3 harvests makes the whole of the kingdom of Heaven before Jesus gives it back to the Father.

One chapter with one verse and application.
 

Hark

Well-known member
If you have read in my thread, the rapture theory 2. Then you will see in John 10:10. Take a look and read Jesus coming as a thief!!
Okay; consider your application of Jesus coming as a thief. Can He come as a thief when the world's armies are marching against Jerusalem? Hardly as a thief in the night for that moment when He comes back as the King of kings.

Plus you are applying John 10:10 wrong and out of context when it is not about Jesus coming as a thief.

John 10:7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep. 8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them. 9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. 10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. 11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

So the thief here in verse 8 & 10 is not Jesus but false prophets that comes in between us & Jesus to lead us away from Him. That is the thief that seeks to steal, to kill, and to destroy whereas Jesus defer from that thief as He is the One that comes so that the believers might have life and abundantly too as He is the One that gives His life for the sheep.
 

Pipiripi

Active member
Okay, what about if we let Jesus Himself give us the clear nifikashon of this parable?

Matthew 13:34-43!
So what are you calling tribulation? And when it has begin?
 

Hark

Well-known member
Okay, what about if we let Jesus Himself give us the clear nifikashon of this parable?

Matthew 13:34-43!
So what are you calling tribulation? And when it has begin?
There is tribulation and then there is the great tribulation. The great tribulation will begin after that fire burns up one third of the earth which has to be the western hemisphere for why Babylon USA will fall & not be around for the great tribulation afterwards.

Matthew 13:34-43 has false prophets sowing weeds into the churches for when He will judge the church when He comes as the Bridegroom, gathering up those that are abiding in Him, while leaving behind all those that offend when that fire comes to burn up one third of the earth.

Luke 12:40-49 confirms the same application about that fire coming on the earth for those saved believers that were not ready that gets cut off.

John 15:1-8 testify of how Jesus will prune fruitful believers to bear more fruit, but He also warned that any believer that stops abiding in His words, will be cut off if found still not abiding in His words when He comes, facing that fire.

We are called to lay aside every weight & sin daily by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us do this ( Hebrews 12:1-2 ) in abiding in Him and walking in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son ( 1 John 1:3-9 )

So if saved believers do not look to Him for help to keep offenses off of that foundation for when He comes, He will finish His work in those left behind in burning off of that foundation all that offends as they will incur a physical death while their spirit is still saved.; 1 Corinthians 3:10-17.

So after the fire burns up one third of the earth, setting the stage for the mark of the beast system, that shall be the hour of temptation that shall try all upon the earth because every one will know the gospel and everyone will know the consequence for taking the mark of the beast which is the lake of fire, no matter what. As the war wages on the left behind saints & new believers in the rest of the world, it is halfway through the great tribulation when that son of perdition is revealed as he will wage war on the unbelieving Jews that will refuse him & flee from him to survive.

Any questions for clarity?
 

Pipiripi

Active member
There is tribulation and then there is the great tribulation. The great tribulation will begin after that fire burns up one third of the earth which has to be the western hemisphere for why Babylon USA will fall & not be around for the great tribulation afterwards.

Matthew 13:34-43 has false prophets sowing weeds into the churches for when He will judge the church when He comes as the Bridegroom, gathering up those that are abiding in Him, while leaving behind all those that offend when that fire comes to burn up one third of the earth.

Luke 12:40-49 confirms the same application about that fire coming on the earth for those saved believers that were not ready that gets cut off.

John 15:1-8 testify of how Jesus will prune fruitful believers to bear more fruit, but He also warned that any believer that stops abiding in His words, will be cut off if found still not abiding in His words when He comes, facing that fire.

We are called to lay aside every weight & sin daily by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us do this ( Hebrews 12:1-2 ) in abiding in Him and walking in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son ( 1 John 1:3-9 )

So if saved believers do not look to Him for help to keep offenses off of that foundation for when He comes, He will finish His work in those left behind in burning off of that foundation all that offends as they will incur a physical death while their spirit is still saved.; 1 Corinthians 3:10-17.

So after the fire burns up one third of the earth, setting the stage for the mark of the beast system, that shall be the hour of temptation that shall try all upon the earth because every one will know the gospel and everyone will know the consequence for taking the mark of the beast which is the lake of fire, no matter what. As the war wages on the left behind saints & new believers in the rest of the world, it is halfway through the great tribulation when that son of perdition is revealed as he will wage war on the unbelieving Jews that will refuse him & flee from him to survive.

Any questions for clarity?
Where in the Bible I can read that the earth burned a third part?
I will read it chapter and verse. Read Isaiah 66:22
 

Hark

Well-known member
Where in the Bible I can read that the earth burned a third part?
I will read it chapter and verse. Read Isaiah 66:22
Revelation 8:9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.

That is the fire Jesus was warning believers to be ready to avoid from being left behind. Luke 12:40-49

This is the fire Peter warned believers about in enduring to the end to be saved from what is coming on the earth; that fire. 2 Peter 3:3-18

Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

That will happen after Jesus defeated the world's armies marching against Jerusalem & Satan is placed in the pit for a thousand years. After the great tribulation, will be a new heaven and a hew earth.
 

Pipiripi

Active member
Revelation 8:9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.Revelation 8:9 is taking about sea. The sea cannot burn third part, and third part creatures! Not BIBLICAL.
That is the fire Jesus was warning believers to be ready to avoid from being left behind. Luke 12:40-49My friend, Jesus is giving a parable of His coming in the end of the world. The fire of verse 49 is the Word Jesus Christ was preaching to the world. Not a literal fire. Is it so difficult to just read the words of God the way it is written in the Bible?? Don't you know that you must go in the time to understand what is saying there? Again your teaching is not BIBLICAL.
This is the fire Peter warned believers about in enduring to the end to be saved from what is coming on the earth; that fire. 2 Peter 3:3-18 Don't you see that this event is by the end of the world? Not a third part, but the whole world. Read verse 7. Again your teaching is not BIBLICAL.
Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain.

That will happen after Jesus defeated the world's armies marching against Jerusalem & Satan is placed in the pit for a thousand years. After the great tribulation, will be a new heaven and a hew earth.

Again this is the end of the world. Jesus are not put a feet on the ground when He comes back.
 

Hark

Well-known member
@Pipiripi

I believe you had posted this in # 50. "Again this is the end of the world. Jesus are not put a feet on the ground when He comes back."

I need you to clarify your statement, please. Or explain it a little more.
 

Pipiripi

Active member
@Pipiripi

I believe you had posted this in # 50. "Again this is the end of the world. Jesus are not put a feet on the ground when He comes back."

I need you to clarify your statement, please. Or explain it a little more.
Take a look at Matthew 24:30-31. Jesus are sending His angels to come down and raise us up to meet Him in the AIR.
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
So the reason why the restrainer be taken out of the way is when saved believers err by believing the lie that they can receive the Holy Spirit again apart from salvation. It is for that reason God will permit that strong delusion to occur because they open themselves up to receive another Jesus, another spirit, hence another gospel.

Paul reminded them when we had received the sanctification of the Spirit & the belief of the truth at the calling of the gospel as the tradition taught of us so that those who hype another drink of the One Spirit to get tongues for private use or for those that hype receiving the Holy Spirit again for other reasons like "slain in the spirit" and "holy laughter" can know that it is not the Holy Spirit when He has been in us since salvation.

2 Thessalonians 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Paul goes on to the 3rd chapter addressing those that have fallen away from the faith as still brothers for why we are commanded to withdraw from them to admonish them as brothers and not as enemies. 2 Thessalonians 3:1-7,14-15

So this damnation spoken of in 2 Thessalonians 2:12 are saved believers left behind to be resurrected after the great tribulation as "vessels unto dishonor" in His House, unless they repent before the Bridegroom comes.

So if believers suffer a thief to break thru believing they can receive what they assume is the Holy Spirit again apart from salvation, that strong delusion will occur. They are following a stranger's voice, tongues for private use, when His real gift of tongues can never be; 1 Corinthians 12:4-21 As much as they like to defend it, yet they cannot answer why the Holy Spirit would come again for slain in the spirit & holy laughter.

No good tree will produce an evil fruit & no bad tree can produce a good fruit. For those that use tongues for private use that condemn slain in the spirit and holy laughter as not of God, they just condemned that extra phenomena apart from salvation by how they got that tongue by.

Only the Lord can open the eyes of those that have gone astray, but this is why He is judging His House first at the rapture event, separating the vessels unto honor that are resurrected & received from the vessels unto dishonor left behind to be resurrected after the great tribulation.
FYI, NO saved believers get left behind when 1 Thess.4:14-17 transpires in conjunction with 2 Thess.2:7! But some of the left behind ( who are NOT saved when that happens ) BECOME believers ( saved ) and are called Trib. saints and NOT Bride members! Some of those Trib. saints get captured & beheaded! When Christ returns at the END of the Trib., the surviving Trib. saints get to inherit the kingdom to repopulate the earth for 1000 years! The beheaded Trib. saints get resurrected to REIGN with Christ ( and His Bride at His side - the ones that get Caught Up in 1 Thess.4:14 / TAKEN in 2 Thess.2:7 to be in Heaven for the wedding of the Lamb in Rev.19:7-8 before they Follow Him back to earth in Rev.19:14 ) for those 1000 years as per Rev.20:4-6, before the New earth & Heaven get created in Rev.21:1! Case closed on your above say so ( man's word ) that contradicts that Truth ( God's say so ) in those posted scriptures!
 

Hark

Well-known member
Take a look at Matthew 24:30-31. Jesus are sending His angels to come down and raise us up to meet Him in the AIR.
Right. That is the pre great tribulation rapture event, because in Zechariah 14:1-5, Jesus is coming back with the saints touching down on the Mount Olives to do battle with the world's armies marching against Jerusalem. After the world's armies are defeated by Him and Satan is in the pit for a thousand years is when the King of kings on earth, will resurrect those that have died during the great tribulation. Revelation 20:1-6

That means those resurrected after the great tribulation are not meeting Jesus in the air.
 

Hark

Well-known member
FYI, NO saved believers get left behind when 1 Thess.4:14-17 transpires in conjunction with 2 Thess.2:7! But some of the left behind ( who are NOT saved when that happens ) BECOME believers ( saved ) and are called Trib. saints and NOT Bride members! Some of those Trib. saints get captured & beheaded! When Christ returns at the END of the Trib., the surviving Trib. saints get to inherit the kingdom to repopulate the earth for 1000 years! The beheaded Trib. saints get resurrected to REIGN with Christ ( and His Bride at His side - the ones that get Caught Up in 1 Thess.4:14 / TAKEN in 2 Thess.2:7 to be in Heaven for the wedding of the Lamb in Rev.19:7-8 before they Follow Him back to earth in Rev.19:14 ) for those 1000 years as per Rev.20:4-6, before the New earth & Heaven get created in Rev.21:1! Case closed on your above say so ( man's word ) that contradicts that Truth ( God's say so ) in those posted scriptures!
Explain what Jesus meant when believers stop abiding in Him to get cut off and thrown in the fire in John 15:6, which that fire is what is coming on the earth for not being ready to go Luke 12:40-49?

Why warn believers not to be ensnared by the cares of this life so that they should be praying to escape what is coming on the earth Luke 21:33-36? Why did Jesus testify that some believers invited would make excuses not to come to the supper for the cares of this life? Luke 14:15-24?

Why did Jesus expounded on that to the multitude about the cost of discipleship is to hate this life, leave all and loved ones behind in Luke 14:25-33 if there is a Marriage Supper to be held in Heaven?

Why warn believers to depart from iniquity or else miss out on the Marriage Supper in Heaven with the O.T. saints in Luke 13:24-30?

Zechariah 14:1-5, Jesus is coming back with the saints touching down on the Mount Olives to do battle with the world's armies marching against Jerusalem. After the world's armies are defeated by Him and Satan is in the pit for a thousand years is when the King of kings on earth, will resurrect those that have died during the great tribulation. Revelation 20:1-6

That means those resurrected after the great tribulation are not meeting Jesus in the air.
 

Pipiripi

Active member
FYI, NO saved believers get left behind when 1 Thess.4:14-17 transpires in conjunction with 2 Thess.2:7! But some of the left behind ( who are NOT saved when that happens ) BECOME believers ( saved ) and are called Trib. saints and NOT Bride members! Some of those Trib. saints get captured & beheaded! When Christ returns at the END of the Trib., the surviving Trib. saints get to inherit the kingdom to repopulate the earth for 1000 years! The beheaded Trib. saints get resurrected to REIGN with Christ ( and His Bride at His side - the ones that get Caught Up in 1 Thess.4:14 / TAKEN in 2 Thess.2:7 to be in Heaven for the wedding of the Lamb in Rev.19:7-8 before they Follow Him back to earth in Rev.19:14 ) for those 1000 years as per Rev.20:4-6, before the New earth & Heaven get created in Rev.21:1! Case closed on your above say so ( man's word ) that contradicts that Truth ( God's say so ) in those posted scriptures!
A completely twisting of scriptures!! Taking verses here and there and plucked them together, to make a Hollywood scene fiction story.
My friend just read the Chapter and the verses completely.
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
Explain what Jesus meant when believers stop abiding in Him to get cut off and thrown in the fire in John 15:6, which that fire is what is coming on the earth for not being ready to go Luke 12:40-49?

Why warn believers not to be ensnared by the cares of this life so that they should be praying to escape what is coming on the earth Luke 21:33-36? Why did Jesus testify that some believers invited would make excuses not to come to the supper for the cares of this life? Luke 14:15-24?

Why did Jesus expounded on that to the multitude about the cost of discipleship is to hate this life, leave all and loved ones behind in Luke 14:25-33 if there is a Marriage Supper to be held in Heaven?

Why warn believers to depart from iniquity or else miss out on the Marriage Supper in Heaven with the O.T. saints in Luke 13:24-30?

Zechariah 14:1-5, Jesus is coming back with the saints touching down on the Mount Olives to do battle with the world's armies marching against Jerusalem. After the world's armies are defeated by Him and Satan is in the pit for a thousand years is when the King of kings on earth, will resurrect those that have died during the great tribulation. Revelation 20:1-6

That means those resurrected after the great tribulation are not meeting Jesus in the air.
FYI again, ONLY the Bride ( the True church - His Body of believers that He is the HEAD of ) meets Him in the clouds in the air ( in earth's atmosphere ) in 1 Thess.4:14-17! The beheaded Trib. saints get resurrected on earth some 7 years later ( and stay there - don't go to Heaven ) to REIGN with Him for those 1000 years, as He will in FACT return to planet earth with His Bride ( Part of the armies of Heaven - Rev.19:14 ) at the END of the future Great Trib. ( that they getbeheaded in ) that starts in the MIDDLE of Das.9:27! Case closed!
 

rod.ney

Well-known member
A completely twisting of scriptures!! Taking verses here and there and plucked them together, to make a Hollywood scene fiction story.
My friend just read the Chapter and the verses completely.
WRONG! I took all the verses on the SAME Topic that will Never CONTRADICT one another! Case closed!
 

Hark

Well-known member
FYI again, ONLY the Bride ( the True church - His Body of believers that He is the HEAD of ) meets Him in the clouds in the air ( in earth's atmosphere ) in 1 Thess.4:14-17! The beheaded Trib. saints get resurrected on earth some 7 years later ( and stay there - don't go to Heaven ) to REIGN with Him for those 1000 years, as He will in FACT return to planet earth with His Bride ( Part of the armies of Heaven - Rev.19:14 ) at the END of the future Great Trib. ( that they getbeheaded in ) that starts in the MIDDLE of Das.9:27! Case closed!
Those abiding in Him will be raptured. Those not abiding in Him, will be cut off. You cannot be cut off from the vine unless you were on it per John 15:1-6

You cannot have a falling away from the faith unless they were of the faith; 1 Timothy 4:1-2 & 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3

He still abides even in former believers that deny Him, because He is faithful even though He will deny them thus being left behind.

2 Timothy 2:11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

That is why we are to call even former believers to go to Him for help to depart from iniquity so they can be received by Him as vessels unto honor.

2 Timothy 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

So if a former believer and a believer living in unrepentant sin wants to avoid being left behind, they need His help daily to lay aside every weight & sin in running that race, placing their confidence in the Lord Jesus Christ to finish that race to His glory ( Philippians 1:6-11 ) where the crowns we receive are really His crowning achievements in us in helping us to follow Him & abide in Him.

Revelation 4:10 The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying, 11 Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

This is where the vessels unto dishonor comes from; not just new believers that went through the great tribulation, but unrepentant saints & former believers that gets left behind too for not being ready or even willing to go when the Bridegroom comes; Luke 21:33-36 & Luke 14:15-24
 

Pipiripi

Active member
WRONG! I took all the verses on the SAME Topic that will Never CONTRADICT one another! Case closed!
Go read again why the rapture theory is false!!
First is there somewhere in the Bible the word SECRET RAPTURE written?
I know that you will close the case, aslong that you are bringing your wrong teaching I will ask you questions and you must show me it in the Bible! Other wise you will have problem with Paul!!
Galatians 1:1-10.
 
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